***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[IATT]

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

It must be an amazing feeling to be white in America

You’d think. But among all of their privileges, perhaps the most frustrating is their privilege to never have to acknowledge their privilege.

my understanding of the research is the "learning styles" are basically a myth.

You don’t have kids, do you?

What is Takoma Park?

People’s Republic of

 

[wavycrocket]

 

[lovehateself]

Yo who are Bidens advisers to have let him say this

major biden gonna have to take a bite out of him

 

[osh kosh bosh]

You don’t have kids, do you?

If I have 0 children or 500 children
It doesn't change the fact that there isn't any strong evidence that im aware of that teaching according to a child's "learning style"
improves performance.

but no i don't have children.

Broadly speaking, there are a number of major problems with the notion of learning styles.

First, there is quite a difference between the way that someone prefers to learn and that which actually leads to effective and efficient learning.
Second, a preference for how one studies is not a learning style.

Most so-called learning styles are based on types; they classify people into distinct groups.

The assumption that people cluster into distinct groups, however, receives very little support from objective studies.
Finally, nearly all studies that report evidence for learning styles fail to satisfy just about all of the key criteria for scientific validity

Stop propagating the learning styles myth Paul A. Kirschner a, b a Open University of the Netherlands, Valkenburgerweg 177, 6419AT Heerlen, The Netherlands

im not sure if Paul Kirschner has kids or not

 

[gry60]

Allow me to quote again:

We also must, finally, move away from the militia and look at the other armed force which likewise offers illustration of the militant character of the South, the slave patrol. The connection with the militia, here, was a mixed on. In some areas, the patrols were explicitly handled by the militia, and the militia officers would be the ones assigning and organizing, while in others the connection would be tenuous at best, membership overlapping simply due to demographics, but patrols organized completely separately. In both cases however the slave patrol was more comparable to a gendarmerie, a militarized police force, whose duty was to enforce the laws and social norms with regards to the enslaved population. Enforcing curfews and travel restrictions was a principal role, as well as hunting down runaways and sniffing out hints of an uprising, but often too was checking up on slave owners to ensure that they were not too permissive, all roles which they often undertook without much concern for property rights and such.

In regions where the patrol was made up mostly of poor whites and yeoman farmers, non-slaveholders, or at most enslaver of only a few human beings, they were particularly invested in enforcing racial norms as they related to the value skincolor gave them in the social hierarchy, and an enslaver with a reputation for leniency could face their wrath too, such as Georgie planter Col. Bryan was a Georgia planter. A patrol came by one night and began to search his cellar, and then began beating an enslaved person who attempted to stop them. His daughter later recounted how her father went out to stop them from doing so, but it only resulted in them accusing that he "upheld his negroes in their rascality", and a week later, the malicious injuring of his prize race horse in retaliation, although other acts such as arson and vandalism were hardly unknown.

Lots of things have changed, but this mentality has remained constant throughout the history of this country since its inception.

 

[had pants]

 

[Zainjal26]

Wrong thread

 

[Zainjal26]

Delete

 

[dwalk31]

Y’all seen the Zack Stacy former jets player video

Jesus Christ looked like a Guantanamo bay interrogation room video

What does this have to do with politics?

 

[Zainjal26]

wrong thread

 

[letsgetit22]

If I have 0 children or 500 children
It doesn't change the fact that there isn't any strong evidence that im aware of that teaching according to a child's "learning style"
improves performance.

but no i don't have children.


Stop propagating the learning styles myth Paul A. Kirschner a, b a Open University of the Netherlands, Valkenburgerweg 177, 6419AT Heerlen, The Netherlands

im not sure if Paul Kirschner has kids or not

What are you talking about? There is plenty of evidence that suggest that people have different ways in how they learn things and or retain information. Whether or not that improves performance is irrelevant as there may be additional factors that impacts their ability to have a high performance. Like, a teacher can teach to a child's learning style, but if the child fails to complete their class work or homework, then that affects their overall performance. Resources and home environment is another factor that can impact performance.

 

[gry60]

Left-wing Midwest media outlet launching with backing from Dem donor

The outfit, called Heartland Signal, combines a new digital news site focused on election coverage with a progressive talk radio station.

www.politico.com

Heartland Signal’s advisers acknowledged that the site will have a “perspective,” and “that’s not something we’re hiding,” said Tim Hogan, a Democratic consultant and a senior adviser on the project. “The newsroom is anchored to an established progressive talk radio station in the Midwest, but its shows are grounded in facts, and this is how we catch up to conservatives, who have spent decades building a network of right-leaning outlets across the country.”

Cole Leiter, who served as the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee’s communication director, where he was responsible for crafting positive coverage for House Democrats and pushing negative stories about House Republicans, said that “people are increasingly comfortable with the news they consume coming with a helping of opinion — and simultaneously the vacuum in local media continues to grow. Progressive news organizations have to be ready to fill that space, otherwise Sinclair or Fox will happily fill it for us,” he continued, name-checking two conservative TV media companies.
“Local news is trusted, but local news is dying,” Leiter added.

On social media, Democrats have fallen far behind GOP voices in terms of producing "organic" content, particularly on Facebook — that is, content not spread by paid advertising. Conservative figures like Ben Shapiro and Dan Bongino routinely lead the list of most-engaged pages on Facebook. Other conservative sites, like The Daily Caller and The Washington Free Beacon, have also sprung up in the last decade to generate more content from a right-leaning perspective. Metric Media, which owns hundreds of local news-styled outlets, came under scrutiny after a New York Times investigation found that GOP operatives had ordered up specific coverage attacking or promoting candidates.
https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2021/06/12/local-news-demand-493495

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

If I have 0 children or 500 children
It doesn't change the fact that there isn't any strong evidence that im aware of that teaching according to a child's "learning style"
improves performance.

but no i don't have children.


Stop propagating the learning styles myth Paul A. Kirschner a, b a Open University of the Netherlands, Valkenburgerweg 177, 6419AT Heerlen, The Netherlands

im not sure if Paul Kirschner has kids or not

My wife is a professor in a business school. In her papers, she used a lot of terms, things similar to “learning style”… things like “satisfaction” or “happiness”. These are words that have common English interpretations. In her paper, however, they have precise, specific meaning and are evaluated via established norms. Now, you and I might disagree with the methodology in their evaluation… she might disagree, too. But for the purpose of her work, it doesn’t matter. Her field has chosen to define and evaluate things in a specific way and if she departs from those norms, her papers will be rejected.

I believe in expert knowledge and, to a lesser extent, the peer review system of academia. I’m sure Paul Kirschner’s work is rigorous and valid.

I am not a researcher on childhood pedagogy. I’m not equipped to validate that paper or even to know if Paul Kirschner’s definition of learning style is different from mine. (That also means that I’m not equipped to cite his work as evidence of anything. )

But as a parent, and as a person who talks to a lot of parents about parenting, I think most parents would push back on any notion that children have identical ways of obtaining knowledge and skills - that what works for teaching one will not work for another.

And as a person who had taught math, I can tell you that some people do far better with “picture” proofs and others with symbol chasing. So de peon who I was talking to, I’d change approaches and try different things,

So maybe that isn’t the same as “learning styles”? I dunno. Do you?

 

[osh kosh bosh]

My wife is a professor in a business school. In her papers, she used a lot of terms, things similar to “learning style”… things like “satisfaction” or “happiness”. These are words that have common English interpretations. In her paper, however, they have precise, specific meaning and are evaluated via established norms. Now, you and I might disagree with the methodology in their evaluation… she might disagree, too. But for the purpose of her work, it doesn’t matter. Her field has chosen to define and evaluate things in a specific way and if she departs from those norms, her papers will be rejected.

I believe in expert knowledge and, to a lesser extent, the peer review system of academia. I’m sure Paul Kirschner’s work is rigorous and valid.

I am not a researcher on childhood pedagogy. I’m not equipped to validate that paper or even to know if Paul Kirschner’s definition of learning style is different from mine. (That also means that I’m not equipped to cite his work as evidence of anything. )

But as a parent, and as a person who talks to a lot of parents about parenting, I think most parents would push back on any notion that children have identical ways of obtaining knowledge and skills - that what works for teaching one will not work for another.

And as a person who had taught math, I can tell you that some people do far better with “picture” proofs and others with symbol chasing. So de peon who I was talking to, I’d change approaches and try different things,

So maybe that isn’t the same as “learning styles”? I dunno. Do you?

im not an expert in any of that, I'm just an *** hole on a sneaker forum that reads a lot of non fiction,

learning styles is one of those things that feels instinctively true,
but when you read about it seems the consensus is that there isn't any evidence for it.

now a lack of evidence doesn't mean that there isn't a chance it could still be true on some level.

but the original question was on whether we should bow to the expertise of teachers.
I certainly won't bow to their expertise if it's based on fuzzy unclear ideas that don't have any evidence.

a white teacher in a all white school told my parents I was a "slower" than the other kids,
and needed to be separated and put off to the side to complete work on time.

my parents thought this was a racially tinged assertion and given my subsequent academic performance they were probably correct.
should they have bowed to the expertise of the teacher?

obviously not. you can let credentialism and trust in
expert as a excuse to remove your brain from your skull and not use it.

 

[paulwest1985]

Politically speaking, this verdict is gonna play a major factor in the 2022 midterms. They gonna prop this coward up as a symbol for the conservative party

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

im not an expert in any of that, I'm just an *** hole on a sneaker forum that reads a lot of non fiction,

learning styles is one of those things that feels instinctively true,
but when you read about it seems the consensus is that there isn't any evidence for it.

now a lack of evidence doesn't mean that there isn't a chance it could still be true on some level.

but the original question was on whether we should bow to the expertise of teachers.
I certainly won't bow to their expertise if it's based on fuzzy unclear ideas that don't have any evidence.

a white teacher in a all white school told my parents I was a "slower" than the other kids,
and needed to be separated and put off to the side to complete work on time.

my parents thought this was a racially tinged assertion and given my subsequent academic performance they were probably correct.
should they have bowed to the expertise of the teacher?

I get that! I ended up in G&T in second grade because they tried to tell my mom I needed special ed. But that needed intervention by a distant relative who happened to be on the school board.

I agree with some of what you were arguing this morning. I think there was a considerable amount of y’all talking past each other.

My admittedly snarky question before was just meant to get you to reflect a bit.Forget intuition, based on your own experience, do you think people learn the same way? Are lessons equally effective? Like, does that make any sense to you?

All he was saying is that he recognizes more differences in learning across his classes (sample size hundreds) then parents notice (sample size, small). Before appealing to academic papers that are often misunderstood , I think it makes sense to take a view yourself.

To me, and again I’m no expert, that particular view seems pretty sensible.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

David French a fair dude and I tend to trust his analysis,

but it's wild to me he can't see the connection between his commitment to the 2nd amendment
and the chaos in Wisconsin and Rittenhouse's actions that led to deaths of 3 people.

he may not be legally culpable, but the countries legal regime around fire arms is insane.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

I get that! I ended up in G&T in second grade because they tried to tell my mom I needed special ed. But that needed intervention by a distant relative who happened to be on the school board.

I agree with some of what you were arguing this morning. I think there was a considerable amount of y’all talking past each other.

My admittedly snarky question before was just meant to get you to reflect a bit.Forget intuition, based on your own experience, do you think people learn the same way? Are lessons equally effective? Like, does that make any sense to you?

All he was saying is that he recognizes more differences in learning across his classes (sample size hundreds) then parents notice (sample size, small). Before appealing to academic papers that are often misunderstood , I think it makes sense to take a view yourself.

To me, and again I’m no expert, that particular view seems pretty sensible.

instinctively would guess that people don't learn the same way.
but looking at the evidence it seems clear to me that we aren't good at diagnosing what actually is their "learning style".
instead people rely on stereotypes that don't seem to lead to more efficient learning.

 

[1995]

What are you talking about? There is plenty of evidence that suggest that people have different ways in how they learn things and or retain information. Whether or not that improves performance is irrelevant as there may be additional factors that impacts their ability to have a high performance. Like, a teacher can teach to a child's learning style, but if the child fails to complete their class work or homework, then that affects their overall performance. Resources and home environment is another factor that can impact performance.

DCAllAfrican might be able to add more to this...pretty sure I have seen him talk about this topic before

To me, as an outsider, it is wild to say that students don't benefit from teaching styles that take into account their individual strengths and weaknesses

 

[RustyShackleford]

David French a fair dude and I tend to trust his analysis,

but it's wild to me he can't see the connection between his commitment to the 2nd amendment
and the chaos in Wisconsin and Rittenhouse's actions that led to deaths of 3 people.

he may not be legally culpable, but the countries legal regime around fire arms is insane.

I got my opinions about gun, gun culture, and so on

I have made my peace with living in a country with a lot of guns

But it is wild how our laws push people toward using firearms in completely irresponsible ways. Then judges just shrug at the ban outcomes

I am not even talking about not having hardcore gun regulation. But how the hell people don't see poorly written and understood stand your ground laws, and all these loopholes in gun ownership laws, don't lead to really poor outcomes too

But then again, far-right conservatives might like all the grey areas because it gives judges the leeway to come down hard on some people, and excuse the actions of others.

Supreme Court finna make the situation worse too

Nasty all around

 

[yobyellav]

word……

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

instinctively would guess that people don't learn the same way.
but looking at the evidence it seems clear to me that we aren't good at diagnosing what actually is their "learning style".
instead people rely on stereotypes that don't seem to lead to more efficient learning.

This I completely agree with. I think coming to understand what works for someone and being open to the possibility that it might not work sometimes is very different than assigning a label based on shallow observations. So, yeah, I think like any phrase, “learning style” might be rife with ambiguities.

Because I like to think the best of (most of) the people that post here, I assume our resident teachers are doing the hard work and not doing things the lazy way.

 

[IATT]

 

[IATT]