***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[daddy style]

And that's the paradox that truly makes Castro's legacy a mixed bag for people ( not me in particular). On one hand, he helped free South Africa from apartheid, while also aiding Angola and Namibia in their own revolutions, And he openly supported Pan Africanist leaders like Nkrumah. And he was also an open supporter of Malcolm X and the Black Panthers.

But when it came time for him to make a decision to hand power over to the people in his own country, he became corrupt and chose to keep power for himself. He truly represents both the best and worst of powerful leaders. He was able to fight for the freedom of others while taking it away from his own.

I agree with this, but his real issue was that he trusted no one. With so many people out to get him, I do not blame him for that stance.

 

[daddy style]

Alright

It would appear that there's nothing to be gained from either of us continuing this discussion

Hey, I do not know everything, then am willing to learn. If you have a counterpoint, please, be my guest.

 

[d nice]

I agree with this, but his real issue was that he trusted no one. With so many people out to get him, I do not blame him for that stance.

That's understandable given the amount of times the US govt tried to assassinate him and undo the work he did, but his choices changed the fortunes of his country and his people for generations. People lost their lives and their families because of his repressive dictatorship. How can you fight for freedom everywhere else, but choose to take it away from your own people? Many of whom lived on the fringes of Cuban society before the revolution and still do.

 

[Based Jesus]

 

Relative privation laced hypotheticals are never a valid counterargument and while your point on why some have an issue with Castro might be a valid observation, it is still irrelevant when discussing the injustices committed against the people of Cuba by the totalitarian regime of Fidel Castro and his personal role in them for nearly 40 years.

Both black and white cubans are not looking for the same freedoms, and you do not make the rules on what I wish to say, nor how I wish to argue, I am hungry... lololololol

I agree that the levels of oppression in Cuba between white and black cubans are different. I literally just made a post about it on the last page. 

I also pointed out that Castro did little to alleviate that during his "tenure" 

 He probably made it worse.

If we lived in Cuba, Castro's government, who does make the rules there on what you're allowed to say, wouldn't allow either of us to say it. 

Not online, since access to the internet is strictly limited there and definitely not in public unless you wanted to be arrested.

If we made a song it would be banned. If we wrote a book it would be banned. If we filmed a movie it would be banned.

I like that he spoke out against racism but I can't say that he truly fought racism when where he was most powerful, he did the least. 

I like that he spoke out against imperialism but I can't say that he truly fought for freedom when where he was most powerful, he did the most harm.

 

[daddy style]

That's understandable given the amount of times the US govt tried to assassinate him and undo the work he did, but his choices changed the fortunes of his country and his people for generations. People lost their lives and their families because of his repressive dictatorship. How can you fight for freedom everywhere else, but choose to take it away from your own people? Many of whom lived on the fringes of Cuban society before the revolution and still do.

He lived to 90, outlived many who tried to take him out. I remember when Hurricane Katrina hit NO, Castro was telling the black folk to come to Cuba! Lololol For me, and I do not have all of the answers, I see Castro as a product of the past, dealing with corrupt nations around the globe. My personal view of Cuba is how it came into existence, and then who wanted control of what was once considered paradise for white america, and white europeans. Castro put an end to all that.

 

[RustyShackleford]

That's understandable given the amount of times the US govt tried to assassinate him and undo the work he did, but his choices changed the fortunes of his country and his people for generations. People lost their lives and their families because of his repressive dictatorship. How can you fight for freedom everywhere else, but choose to take it away from your own people? Many of whom lived on the fringes of Cuban society before the revolution and still do.

He lived to 90, outlived many who tried to take him out. I remember when Hurricane Katrina hit NO, Castro was telling the black folk to come to Cuba! Lololol For me, and I do not have all of the answers, I see Castro as a product of the past, dealing with corrupt nations around the globe. My personal view of Cuba is how it came into existence, and then who wanted control of what was once considered paradise for white america, and white europeans. Castro put an end to all that.

Castro gained support for his revolution by promising to return the country to the Cuban people, for it to be a democratic republic. He went back on his promise.

Yes he put a end to one hell, and then marched the Cuban people into another one.

You seem to be too focused on White people taking a relatively minor L because of Castro.

-D Nice is right Castro denied his people the things he help give to others.

Castro is like the dude that helps fund and run a domestic violence shelter for abused women, but then goes home and beats his wife every night.

Dude was a walking contradiction.

 

[daddy style]

I agree that the levels of oppression in Cuba between white and black cubans are different. I literally just made a post about it on the last page. 
I also pointed out that Castro did little to alleviate that during his "tenure"   He probably made it worse.
If we lived in Cuba, Castro's government, who does make the rules there on what you're allowed to say, wouldn't allow either of us to say it. 
Not online, since access to the internet is strictly limited there and definitely not in public unless you wanted to be arrested.
If we made a song it would be banned. If we wrote a book it would be banned. If we filmed a movie it would be banned.
I like that he spoke out against racism but I can't say that he truly fought racism when where he was most powerful, he did the least. 
I like that he spoke out against imperialism but I can't say that he truly fought for freedom when where he was most powerful, he did the most harm.

To act as if Castro was this super sophisticated intellectual that had all of the solutions to end all ills in cuba is simply crazy. Revolutions are often not successful. If won, the transition is often sloppy, because the revolutionaries are more prepared to die than lead. In trying to take a balanced look at Castro, he wasn't prepared to take rule as some may have thought, they were winging it when the revolution took over, so in hindsight I am not surprised at the result. He made mistakes that in this world is only allowed to white men.

 

[EddieDoyers]

I don't know how you can justify Castro's actions towards his own people....

 

[daddy style]

Castro gained support for his revolution by promising to return the country to the Cuban people, for it to be a democratic republic. He went back on his promise.

Yes he put a end to one hell, and then marched the Cuban people into another one.

You seem to be too focused on White people taking a relatively minor L because of Castro.

-D Nice is right Castro denied his people the things he help give to others.

Castro is like the dude that helps fund and run a domestic violence shelter for abused women, but then goes home and beats his wife every night.

Dude was a walking contradiction.

He made mistakes that are often only afforded to white men in power,without the approval of other white men. Did he do some ugly things? Certainly. But I admire that he was his own man in the face of hypocrisy.

 

[daddy style]

I don't know how you can justify Castro's actions towards his own people....

In the global view, name a perfect nation toward its people?! america? Show me one that started as a slave port, then define treatment of its people.

 

[ninjahood]

classic example of someone who's insistence on including racial components when they don't apply makes da entire argument invalid.

... and you are a classic example of how someone who is in denial of himself, your entire existence can be summed up in a nutshell, pathetic.

coming from a delusional race huckster, i consider it a compliment...make no mistake, i think da way u spew racial diatribes is atrocious, ur no different then da white people u rail against.

thank god da 2020 census is gonna relegate people like you to Dust bin of forgotten history.

 

[EddieDoyers]

I don't know how you can justify Castro's actions towards his own people....

In the global view, nane a perfect nation toward its people?!

There's no perfect nation out there. Castro wasn't a hero for what he did though. You can't make excuses for his violations of human rights.

 

[ninjahood]

I don't know how you can justify Castro's actions towards his own people....

you can't, Castro was a monster who limited basic Tennants of liberty & freedom for his own justification of self aggrandizement.

 

[daddy style]

There's no perfect nation out there. Castro wasn't a hero for what he did though. You can't make excuses for his violations of human rights.

If you are referring to kicking white racist cubans, the mafia, a Batista out of cuba as violations then yes I modt certainly can. He violated their rights to be ******** by kicking them out of the country, and I applaud him for it, and admire his guts to do it. White people do not like to be kicked out of anyplace, and Castro is one of the few who did it, then got away with it. Haiti did it as well, but could not maintain economic independence.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Castro gained support for his revolution by promising to return the country to the Cuban people, for it to be a democratic republic. He went back on his promise.

Yes he put a end to one hell, and then marched the Cuban people into another one.

You seem to be too focused on White people taking a relatively minor L because of Castro.

-D Nice is right Castro denied his people the things he help give to others.

Castro is like the dude that helps fund and run a domestic violence shelter for abused women, but then goes home and beats his wife every night.

Dude was a walking contradiction.

He made mistakes that are often only afforded to white men in power,without the approval of other white men. Did he do some ugly things? Certainly. But I admire that he was his own man in the face of hypocrisy.

Famb, no

A oppressive murderous dictator like Castro doesn't get let off the hook just because of "the white man". Decades upon decades he jailed, murdered, and tortured people for just disagreeing with him, for wanting to leave the damb island, or for being gay. White, black, brown, everyone

He let his people suffer in economic despair, and hunger, while he got fat and rich of their labor.

For everything good Castro did in this world, he did something horrible.

He doesn't get graded on the curve, and even if he did, he still fails.

Castro himself is a hypocrite in so many ways. And he was more than willing to accept the aid of white men from the Soviet Union, racist white men, when it serve him. So he doesn't have any moral high ground to stand on.

 

[EddieDoyers]

There's no perfect nation out there. Castro wasn't a hero for what he did though. You can't make excuses for his violations of human rights.

If you are referring to kicking white racist cubans, the mafia, a Batista out of cuba as violations then yes I modt certainly can. He violated their rights to be ******** by kicking them out of the country, and I applaud him for it, and admire his guts to do it. White people do not like to be kicked out of anyplace, and Castro is one of the few who did it, then got away with it. Haiti did it as well, but could not maintain economic independence.

http://www.theroot.com/articles/his...o_cubans_what_it_means_to_be_black_in_cuba/3/
http://www.havanatimes.org/?p=109220
Yeah I dunno about that

 

[ninjahood]

. Decades upon decades he jailed, murdered, and tortured people for just disagreeing with him, for wanting to leave the damb island, or for being gay. White, black, brown, everyone

He let his people suffer in economic despair, and hunger, while he got fat and rich of their labor.

this is enough for anyone to to take glee in pissing on his grave.

 

[daddy style]

you can't, Castro was a monster who limited basic Tennants of liberty & freedom for his own justification of self aggrandizement.

I bet that I was one of the people you tried to report, aren't I?! lololol My black brother, you obvious descendant of black kings, you of the connection to tjose who built the pyramids, you of those who were rocking silk white the euro was painting himself blue and hiding our in caves, what happened to you my black brother?! Don't you know that you are beautiful? Why your skin looks like gold next to them, don't you know that? Who taught you to hate yourself? Who taught you that you were less than a human being? Who told you that the color of your skin was a disadvantage in this world, and that you believe it so hard, that you are in denial if your bloodlines.... what happened to you? Tell the story so nobody else will be like you, white, black asian, man woman or child. Speak your pain my nubian brother.

 

[RustyShackleford]

you can't, Castro was a monster who limited basic Tennants of liberty & freedom for his own justification of self aggrandizement.

I bet that I was one of the people you tried to report, aren't I?! lololol My black brother, you obvious descendant of black kings, you of the connection to tjose who built the pyramids, you of those who were rocking silk white the euro was painting himself blue and hiding our in caves, what happened to you my black brother?! Don't you know that you are beautiful? Why your skin looks like gold next to them, don't you know that? Who taught you to hate yourself? Who taught you that you were less than a human being? Who told you that the color of your skin was a disadvantage in this world, and that you believe it so hard, that you are in denial if your bloodlines.... what happened to you? Tell the story so nobody else will be like you, white, black asian, man woman or child. Speak your pain my nubian brother.

 

[gry60]

Regarding Castro, both sides have offered valid points; however, he will never stand next to Mandela because he failed his ideal when he chose to stay in power instead of stepping down once he had kicked out Batista. Mandela set the example of a peaceful transition even though he knew he could stay because of what he meant to South Africa. We have way to many revolutionaries who have overstayed their welcome to become what they fought against (Kabila Jr).

 

[EddieDoyers]

Regarding Castro, both sides have offered valid points; however, he will never stand next to Mandela because he failed his ideal when he chose to stay in power instead of stepping down once he had kicked out Batista. Mandela set the example of a peaceful transition even though he knew he could stay because of what he meant to South Africa. We have way to many revolutionaries who have overstayed their welcome to become what they fought against (Kabila Jr).

Yup
Well said
Guy wanted to be the hero but ended up being an oppressor

 

[daddy style]

Famb, no

A oppressive murderous dictator like Castro doesn't get let off the hook just because of "the white man". Decades upon decades he jailed, murdered, and tortured people for just disagreeing with him, for wanting to leave the damb island, or for being gay. White, black, brown, everyone

He let his people suffer in economic despair, and hunger, while he got fat and rich of their labor.

For everything good Castro did in this world, he did something horrible.

He doesn't get graded on the curve, and even if he did, he still fails.

Castro himself is a hypocrite in so many ways. And he was more than willing to accept the aid of white men from the Soviet Union, racist white men, when it serve him. So he doesn't have any moral high ground to stand on.

lol You are stuck on thinking that I am making him out to br a martyr. Nope. I just like what he did against white privilege.

http://www.theroot.com/articles/his...o_cubans_what_it_means_to_be_black_in_cuba/3/
http://www.havanatimes.org/?p=109220
Yeah I dunno about that

Maybe you missed it, but tou cannot equate inequality for black people in cuba, to what happened with white cubans, then claim that they are both the victims of the same oppression. Black cubans still had to deal with their white racist counterparts, Castro could not stop that, as it was too deep in that culture. He would have had to kick out each and every white person in Cuba, in order to do that.

 

[d nice]

I don't wanna turn this into the Black Culture discussion thread part 2, so I'll just end my take with this.....

Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are almost always bad men, even when they exercise influence and not authority; still more when you superadd the tendency of the certainty of corruption by authority. 

 

[RustyShackleford]

Famb, no

A oppressive murderous dictator like Castro doesn't get let off the hook just because of "the white man". Decades upon decades he jailed, murdered, and tortured people for just disagreeing with him, for wanting to leave the damb island, or for being gay. White, black, brown, everyone

He let his people suffer in economic despair, and hunger, while he got fat and rich of their labor.

For everything good Castro did in this world, he did something horrible.

He doesn't get graded on the curve, and even if he did, he still fails.

Castro himself is a hypocrite in so many ways. And he was more than willing to accept the aid of white men from the Soviet Union, racist white men, when it serve him. So he doesn't have any moral high ground to stand on.

lol You are stuck on thinking that I am making him out to br a martyr. Nope. I just like what he did against white privilege.


.

That is exactly what you doing by continuously minimizing his actions as just "mistakes"and making excuses for him

 

[ninjahood]

you can't, Castro was a monster who limited basic Tennants of liberty & freedom for his own justification of self aggrandizement.

I bet that I was one of the people you tried to report, aren't I?! lololol My black brother, you obvious descendant of black kings, you of the connection to tjose who built the pyramids, you of those who were rocking silk white the euro was painting himself blue and hiding our in caves, what happened to you my black brother?! Don't you know that you are beautiful? Why your skin looks like gold next to them, don't you know that? Who taught you to hate yourself? Who taught you that you were less than a human being? Who told you that the color of your skin was a disadvantage in this world, and that you believe it so hard, that you are in denial if your bloodlines.... what happened to you? Tell the story so nobody else will be like you, white, black asian, man woman or child. Speak your pain my nubian brother.

sounding like Langston Hughes on PCP...