Post Your New Eras*59-Fiftys*etc... VOL. INFINITY NOW W/ Henz0/Thunderchunk/Icy's FAQ ON PG.1

[jonwin]

wallyhopp

They are the same color or at least as close as they'll be with what New Era supplies now.

The Mariners "teal" isn't actually called teal btw.

This color is called "Northwest Green"

The OG hat looks darker b/c it's an old hat and has slightly faded over time.

Also, back in the day when New Era used wool, the dyes for each color had some variation to it, especially with more "unique" colors like the Mariners' Northwest Green.

If you're referring to the "online site images" from Hat Club, yea, you really can't go off the appearance of those since online photos are never really gonna be 100% accurate with how they actually appear compared to normal natural setting photos (hence like you said, my phone pics, the 2 Mariners look a lot closer in color hue b/c they are actually that close).

As far as your comment about "people who make these decisions based off photos and not the real thing", it's a lot more simple as in the Lids guy just didn't do his homework on the exact specs when he did the Retro line lol

For example, even if you didn't pay attention to baseball caps, just about everyone knows a Dodger on-field is royal blue in color but does everyone know the Dodgers' royal blue is technically Dark Royal and a shade darker than the typical royal blue? Well the Lids guy apparently didn't.

jonwin
Are they truly the same shade of teal? It doesn't seem like they are from the photos. That northwest teal is hard to showcase in photos. My og on field appears super dark in regular lighting. The hatclub hat has some vibrancy to it. It's hard to show that in photo form, which is why I feel these people who make these decisions base them off of photos and not the real thing. Og teal is dark without a trace of vibrancy. The photos from hat club seem more dull, true to the og color. Your photos seem to make the teal pop.

 

[wallyhopp]

jonwin
I guess what I'm asking is, are the hat club teal and this retro classic teal the same shade? Maybe I'm over exaggerating how off the retro classic is to the real thing. I get that the og is 20+ years old. But this latest retro classic is straight up closest to Marlins teal. No more dressing up a pig.

Here's a family photo before the retro classic gets boxed up for return. Taken with an iPhone with the incandescent white balance.

From bottom left is an older model Cooperstown classic with NE flag on side and navy blue under. Totally too bright of a teal here. Middle is your retro classic. Closer to the real thing but still too blue. Then your og on the right. Perfection.

Top bills are a 2000 era wool and a 2012 era poly. Both a touch lighter than the og but still physically the closest thing to the real thing because they are the real thing. This is the color I'm looking for in a common era PNM green Mariners retro cap.

I do have a Cooperstown custom marlins teal cap and that thing matches more with the lighter teal Cooperstown Mariners than the retro classic.

So I may be off in saying this retro classic is straight up marlins teal. They seem to be using a unique color but Its not good enough in my book. This is dodger blue wrong in my book. I get available colors can change but don't charge me $37 for something so off.

It's worse in real life. They can't be proud of that. Then again, the Cooperstown have been coming out for years. This isn't just shades off, its whole color wheel segments. Which makes me wonder how close the HC really is. Haven't heard many complaints

 

[jonwin]

wallyhopp

^ The retro classic from Lids is most likely the wrong color. Haven't seen it in person.

The Hat Club remake is using the actual Mariners' On-Field Polyester Northwest Green (2012 era poly from your stack pictured above) so it's as accurate as a custom hat will be based off what New Era offers.

If any Mariners "retro" remake is the same color as the old Marlins Teal, it's definitely the wrong color since Marlins Teal is NOT Mariners Northwest Green.

The reason this mixup happens too often is b/c New Era doesn't typically stock the official Northwest Green poly for use on customs so as a result, when someone like Lids or etc is attempting to do retro Mariners hats, they resort to using either old Marlins Teal, San Jose Sharks Aqua (a little closer to NW Green but still clearly not the same color).

And like I mentioned above, the OG wool hats are gonna look noticeably different to modern day Northwest Green poly due to the wool fabric and the dyes that were used back then.

 

[el bro]

jonwin
I guess what I'm asking is, are the hat club teal and this retro classic teal the same shade? Maybe I'm over exaggerating how off the retro classic is to the real thing. I get that the og is 20+ years old. But this latest retro classic is straight up closest to Marlins teal. No more dressing up a pig.

Here's a family photo before the retro classic gets boxed up for return. Taken with an iPhone with the incandescent white balance.

Wally, I just go to my local lids and return the hats that dont fit that I purchased online. They return or exchange with no problems.

 

[nbatugo1]

Anyone able to shed any insight on trying to find a wool washington nationals fitted in navy?

 

[bm35]

so what's the verdict on them retro classic joints ??

 

[wallyhopp]

jonwin makes sense now. Didn't realize the HC was poly. I definitely like the PNM poly color on the navy blue crown caps and know no poly and likely no wool will ever come close to that '94 PNM Crown hat. I can deal with that sort of color difference. What we're seeing with the retro classic and cooperstowns. No way.

I could definitely live with the current PNM Green poly color. Like I said, it looks like they tried but I am willing to bet someone if you put the retro classic marlins next to this Mariners, they would be identical. So it looks like they tried to keep it to spec with the wool. Credit there. But not worth retail. I may rebuy if they sit like the Cooperstown did when I scooped for $15.

I guess you pick your battles. HC probably knew they couldn't get a wool color remotely close and went with PNM poly. Lids on the other hand is 100% clueless. I won't pay hard earned money for mistakes like that.

el bro were you paying through PayPal? They told me I couldn't do it in store. They sent me a shipping label though. Now a month wait for my money back.

nbatugo1
Gotta say eBay. I see 4 wool in various sizes right now. Problem is. A lot of people don't want to pay retail.

B bm35
Sizing is wacky. Lots of wrong sized logos, wrong buttons, wrong colors. Wrong details. Overall in your hand quality is pretty darn good though. Stitching is solid. Wool material is on par with China customs, which isn't a bad thing. Brim is stiff yet not hard as a rock. Crown is mid crown I'd say. Right in line with your 2008-2015 polys.

Buy in store. That or choose 3 sizes online and return the two that don't fit.

Of the five I bought, my Indians probably fits the best. Got lucky. On a few, there are some glue stains here or there. And some loose threads on almost all of them.

Wouldn't exactly pay retail. But of the 34, the few that are accurate like the Yankees, and you can find in store to try on. Pretty close to spec to the 2006 era wool imho.

 

[el bro]

wallyhopp

I did not pay with paypal, but they didnt even look at my receipt for the exchange.

 

[mkc1983]

I bought two of the three blue jays retros with the third one on its way, and they look good with okay materials. I do find a lot of loose stitching though. Annoying.

The retros are available for 30% off today only with code "school30"

 

[bsv2.0]

I finally got my Retro Classics in hand. I copped the Yankees and the black D-Backs and I'll say for the most part I'm satisfied with them. Just some threads that needed to be clipped but the fit is nice.

 

[wallyhopp]

Craniumfitteds is having 50% clearance plus free shipping over $99. I think I'm set for the next decade now. Ridiculous value.

 

[wallyhopp]

Another successful de-flagging. This time it's a heritage series Boston Red Sox with tonal flag

Before

During

Completion

There's some slight ghosting. But otherwise, I turned this $8 clearance rack 100% wool/grey under cap into a near replica of its pre 2007 made in USA counterpart.

Who needs the $37 retro classics, when new era was doing a very solid job on this heritage series line just a few years back. Dare I say better overall quality on the heritage line, even if they are made in China. I already compared the Oakland athletics cap and that proved to be nearly perfect.

Someone on NEcaptalk took a photo comparison of the Chicago white sox cursive C. Color is right but the logo size is obviously wrong.

 

[Bert.]

The heritage line was awesome minus the stupid flag

 

[wallyhopp]

I'm seeing some of that line or maybe just a wool Cooperstown line that has the AL/NL side patch. Looks decent except for that. I've also see the heritage line with white side flags.

Another de-flagging complete. This time on a Florida marlins teal/grey 'custom'. I have yet to see a cap that looks better with the flag.

Before

During

Final

Could almost pass as some sort of 1993 era alternate.

I took this photo before returning the retro classic hats. I had never seen such a defect on a hat before
Right above the logo dead center of the stitching, there were these two perfect bumps on the Milwaukee Brewers cap.

They were soft, almost like material had bunched up there. Definitely not the NEW ERA USA factories greatest day there.

 

[jonwin]

Here's how you do real retro remake:


Giants 2001 Alternate On-Field Remake:
- USA made Wool
- No NE Flag
- Flat Batterman
- Correct undervisor color (these were black under's despite this hat being in the grey under era)

Indians 1997 World Series remake:
- USA made wool
- Correct Indians logo
- Flat batterman
- Grey Under
- 1997 WS patch
- No NE Flag
- Correct specs (button, etc)

Giants Game On-Field wool remake:
- USA made wool
- Grey under
- No NE flag
- Flat batterman
- Correct size logo

All from Hat Club.

You don't need to buy from Lids. That's a waste of money for all the hype they push out.

Can't even get the hats made the right way smh lol.

 

[wallyhopp]

Totally need that all navy '97 ws Indians, USA or china made.
My '97 navy/red China custom has all the same cues that you mention, except for us wool. Quality is solid. It's the odd ball customs that new era does that shapes and materials fall flat.

But even HC can get it wrong from time to time. Their 2001 ASG Seattle Mariners is wrong. Patch is on the wrong side ( they wore the PNM green bill for that game) and the batterman isn't flat. Major miscues. One note to add. The BP hats that game had the asg patch on the other side. So it looks like HC used the wrong reference photos. They also wore all navy mesh BP. So who knows there thought process.

With a retro classic return, a first for me with lids, I did some digging and found these guys. Got 3-4x for the same price essentially. With superior quality even. Can't beat that.

All from one seller. Solid price. All 2006 era blue NE tag 100% wool, made in USA glory.

All your typical team colors except the black billed rangers. I had heard they only wore this from 2001-2003, yet never officially dropped the color. So it got made up until the 2007 poly switchover. Fit, feel, look is beyond words really. Less than $20/ pair.

Much like the angels of that era, they were one of the first few teams to implement black unders.

CF coming through once again.

-2012 Memorial Day Pittsburgh pirates on field. 100 % poly. USA made
-2012 era Cincinnati Reds alternate. Much like the rangers black bill, they stopped wearing this around 2009, yet may still be produced to this day. 100% poly. USA made.
-2010 Minnesota Twins road. Cool base. First year for this c/w. 100% poly. USA made.
-2008 Tampa Bay Rays. First year color change on field. Cool base sticker/blue size tag combo. 100% poly. USA made.
-2010 San Diego Padres home. Cool base. 100% poly. USA made
-2010 era Milwaukee Brewers. Cool base. 100% poly. USA made
-2010 era Colorado Rockies. Cool base. 100% poly. USA made.
Less than $11/ pair here.

Other CF/eBay finds.
The made in China 'customs' of the bunch

1999 era St. Louis cardinals alternate grey under. 100% wool.
1991 ws patch Minnesota twins. Been on the lookout for his one despite its inaccuracies. It has a grey under. And top button is blue. Material is quality though. I'll take it.
1971-1975 Pittsburgh Pirates. Green under. No batterman. Problem with most of these retros is that they are using the newer brighter shade of gold and not the duller shade. In fact they had the right shade of gold on their 2012-2015 gold cap. Never seen a proper retro.

And a comparison photo between a China made custom and an on field St. Louis cardinals alternate

Aside from the sticker being different , the China made has a slightly higher stiffer crown but I'd call it 95% identical. Lids can't even get 70% right imho.

 

[jonwin]

wallyhopp

A few big misconceptions you have w/ the comments on the Mariners ASG01 hat being wrong.

Yes, technically they're wrong but retailers have to get customs approved by MLB licensing which New Era submits every custom through.

Why do you think they are so many patch fitteds where they are the "right side" and there's a NE flag on the left side?

That's b/c MLB licensing deems them as "customs" and not actual "retro remakes" so if they wanna get the hats made, then they have to settle for having the patch on the wrong side.

It's definitely a flawed process as MLB licensing clearly does NOT get everything right since they approved all those Lids retro remakes that had all the glaring errors but that's how it goes.

So it's not really "Hat Club goofed up and did this..." it's more like "MLB licensing would only approve it that way."

 

[wallyhopp]

Are most of these made in China 'custom' retros done under the table or without approval? Basically fake shoe status? I haven't encountered one that is off more than one or two small elements.

I have yet to buy hats from mickeysplace but I see some that are great and then some that you can tell they had to go through the approval process.

I know my custom 97' ws patch Indians is nearly flawless and then I see other retailers that have the patch on the wrong side.

Or maybe the approval process is super flawed and they can't catch them all to screw them all up.

Other than throwing the "fake" tag out there, I have no other explanation. I don't mind these "fakes" so far. Better quality than the approved stuff

 

[jonwin]

Nah lol, there's no under the table anything.

If you're a New Era retailer, you're a New Era retailer. None of these online guys are wholesale ordering "fakes" haha.

Fakes only come if you're a customer buying from the fugazi kiosk or some clearly counterfeit China website.

It's more a reflection on how unorganized and inconsistent the licensing approval process can be.

MLB Licensing has their own set of specs for retro's that they deem are the official specs but whatever catalog they have, there's quite a few hats that have the wrong specs but if you wanna order it with "no NE flag, no batterman or flat batterman, etc" it's gotta be ordered this way.

If a retailer wanted to "fix it" and "do it the right way", that's where you see some hats like the ones Hat Club does where they're not 100% exactly like the OG's but done to be best possible way.

Then you just have retailers that honestly don't give a flip about accuracy.

Example is like a lot of the east coast New Era shops. They sell the hell of anything that's a patch fitted so it doesn't really matter if a patch custom isn't done the right way necessarily for them.

Are most of these made in China 'custom' retros done under the table or without approval? Basically fake shoe status? I haven't encountered one that is off more than one or two small elements.

I have yet to buy hats from mickeysplace but I see some that are great and then some that you can tell they had to go through the approval process.

I know my custom 97' ws patch Indians is nearly flawless and then I see other retailers that have the patch on the wrong side.

Or maybe the approval process is super flawed and they can't catch them all to screw them all up.

Other than throwing the "fake" tag out there, I have no other explanation. I don't mind these "fakes" so far. Better quality than the approved stuff

 

[wallyhopp]

It's fascinating but I guess you really have to blame or credit the retailer. In my eyes, if you can get a 100% wool no ne flag on the side grey under 'retro custom' then why is the heritage line throwing flags on the side? Why does the Cooperstown lineup change so many elements? How is this retro classic line even in existence? Tonal flags, why? If there is one perfect mold, run with it.

How are these shops in NY and NJ ordering perfect replicas of caps. There's a Pirates grey/black with every element matched to the og. Same with almost every team. Grey under/ 100% wool. Same with 9-10 other teams and colors. That's your retro classic lineup right there. If they can do it, why can't everyone else. I guess it's that element of caring that shows.

I will admit, 90% of the ws patch hats are wrong. So they aren't perfect.

From my first photo, that seller has a couple more wool caps available. I can pm the name to anyone interested. Variety of sizes.

 

[jonwin]

wallyhopp

Long story short, MLB licensing in general is inconsistent and things change over and over after time so that only adds to the inconsistency.

Remember, not everyone's goal is to get a 100% accurate remake. If it's close enough, it's close enough for some people.

And not all retailers are aware of how precise you can get with a hat or not, it's a giant world of diff directions you can go and lot of times, just depends who at licensing decides to hit the "OK" button one day and another day they say "nah, rejected".

You also gotta remember the Heritage is something New Era pushed out.

They're not necessarily trying to promote hats that don't have the NE flags on the side if they don't have to so that explains why they did those Heritage retro's with the NE flag on the side.

And yet, you got people that actually liked those hats smh lol. No wonder why stuff like the Heritage line existed and "worked" since clearly some people don't mind it

 

[jordanhead718212]

$10 off Lids for T-mobile users. Open the T-Mobile Tuesdays App.

 

[Nike Jordan]

$10 off Lids for T-mobile users. Open the T-Mobile Tuesdays App.

I have a coupon if anyone wants it. It's only good for MLB Authentic caps though.

 

[jordanhead718212]

Wow didn't know that. I don't do black nastys so I have a code as well for anyone who wants it too.

 

[wallyhopp]

Nike Jordan If you can weed through the options, the non flagged versions are still around on their website. Those don't seem to be excluded from discount codes.

jonwin i guess I'm just a perfectionist with this hobby. That or I've seen how great something can be, like the '92-'06 wool lineup. So it's tough to see them revert back to inferior options.
-------

I wouldn't mind checking out the T-Mobile code if someone could pm me. im sure I could muster up a value somewhere.


Btw. Lids said my return could take up to 4 weeks to process. They sent me a prepaid ups ground shipping label last week. I sent it off tuesday. They received the items in IN yesterday. And today my PayPal was credited. I may just start paying via CC so I can do seamless returns. But it opens up the possibility for buying two sizes of many hats and go with the best option. It took some chatting each time, but lids has been nothing but the best to me. Missing buttons, they told me to keep the hat and credited my account 100%. I had a clearance hat that fit way too big. They sent me another and let me keep the loose one. They've sent me the wrong size hat and just credited my account for the item. I hate their lack of detail on lids exclusives but I can't hate their online customer service