The Official NBA Season Thread: Las Vegas Summer League | USA VS South Sudan at 3 ET on Fox

[VARNELL HILL]

These guys arent capable of guarding or containing an opposing teams best or second best player. Solid role players.

 

[Moheezy]

Cant blame Rudy and prop up Jokic. His defense and lack of versatility is also a big reason why they are 1-8

Man...I could not believe no one was making a big deal during last year's playoffs where the back to back MVP was being subbed out in every defensive possession of a close game. His offence is outworldy that people ignore his defensive limitations. You can probably get away with it if you're a guard...but not a C.

 

[dacomeup]

I hate to break it to Ja, but Nike and underdogs is an oxymoron.

Shoes look great. Why April tho??

Right in time for the playoffs I’d imagine

 

[Moheezy]

If OG is really on the block I'd make a strong push for him if I was the Nuggets FO. MPJ package should do the trick.

I don't know if Toronto would take on MPJ with that back and contract. Masai is smarter than that.

 

[B Sox]

KCP was a really important piece for the bubble Lakers and the year following because of his perimeter defense.

 

[storm2006]

I missed this. what on earth are you babbling about?

you do know there are examples of great players on limited rosters, who didn't run 40% usage, never run, and play at snails pace.

you realize this is possible? You understand that?

Jokic second best player was Will Barton and Monte Morris last year.
Somehow they managed to ha 6th best offense.

just stop, breath, it's fine Luka is great no one is doubting that.
but to act like they are playing 10000% optimally because you are incapable of grasping nuance

is extremely tiresome.

They are the 8th seed at 18-16 and are 1GB from the 4-seed, 3 GB from the 2/3 and 4 GB from the 1-seed.

So you are telling me they’d be a Top 4 team in the West if they ran more, right?

 

[Moheezy]

If you're one of the greatest offensive players ever, no one cares about you not defending.

Just ask Dirk.

Can you name a team with a great offensive center that doesn't play defense that's won a chip? Or are we only talking about regular season?

 

[N41D]

You know how you don’t build around Jokic for playoff success?

Exactly how the Nuggets have.

 

[Arthur Shelby]

 

[osh kosh bosh]

They are the 8th seed at 18-16 and are 1GB from the 4-seed, 3 GB from the 2/3 and 4 GB from the 1-seed.

So you are telling me they’d be a Top 4 team in the West if they ran more, right?

What I said was, that at a certain level of usage your personal production starts to cannibalize the teams offense.

So yes, I think if Luka got off the ball bit more, the team got out in transition, they could be a more efficient offense.

They can still play luka ball in the half court, but doing it on EVERY SINGLE POSESSIONS.
and basically NEVER running.

I don't think is maximizing the roster.


now if you want to translate that to;
"LLOLOLOLOL THEY SHOULD RUN REGGIE BULLOCK PICK AND ROLLS???????"

only stupid person would think that

I don't believe you are stupid
so you are either being willfully stupid or disingenuous.

cut it out.

 

[VARNELL HILL]

Can you name a team with a great offensive center that doesn't play defense that's won a chip? Or are we only talking about regular season?

Having defensive limitations in certain matchups =/= Doesn't play defense

You're talking like Jokic is a non-defender and that isn't true at all.

 

[pmatic]

Zion went a week without playing and now has to regain conditioning lmao.

 

[ballinsam23]

KCP was a really important piece for the bubble Lakers and the year following because of his perimeter defense.

That was 2-3 years ago. He's a solid defender but I'm not depending on him the way I would like the complimentary pieces that Dirk, Giannis, etc had defensively.

 

[Moheezy]

They said Harden couldn't be a good second man because he won't pass the ball

I was critical of the team early on (so was everyone) but no one seems to give Harden the credit he's due:

• He added a mid range due to his lost burst and opened up new dimensions to his game
• He has great assist to turnover ratios now (he used to lead the league in turnovers during his prime) - link to stats
• He's minimized foul bating - which will help in the playoffs
• He's playing more team ball
• He's dominating with his playmaking rather than scoring - I kept wondering if we will ever see 50 pt Harden again...but his 20 pt 21 ast game convinced me we don't need 50 pt Harden and 21 ast Harden is way more effective for this team...especially when you have the league leading scorer
• He's trying on defence.

You can tell he really worked on his game and health during the offseason. It's been really fun to watch and he deserves the credit.

 

[ballinsam23]

Can you name a team with a great offensive center that doesn't play defense that's won a chip? Or are we only talking about regular season?

Not playing defense is a stretch imo. He's not some turnstile.

We also never seen a center capable of doing what Jokic does.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Having defensive limitations in certain matchups =/= Doesn't play defense

You're talking like Jokic is a non-defender and that isn't true at all.

but fundamentally in the playoff the versatility is more important.
Jokic has good hands, is great defensive rebounder.

so he plays defense, it's just you can only one type of defense with him.

For them to win a championship, I think they'd have to catch a lot of really good matchups like the Bucks did that year.

because there are some teams that I think a Jokic defense simply has no chance.

 

[Moheezy]

Having defensive limitations in certain matchups =/= Doesn't play defense

You're talking like Jokic is a non-defender and that isn't true at all.

Watching him in last year's playoffs and get hunted on defence, Malone subbing him out at every defensive possession...I don't really care between the terms...the fact is, he was a liability in the playoffs and was unplayable at that end when it mattered most So my question hasn't been answered...because the answer is that no one one with a Center that's a defensive liability.

 

[Moheezy]

Not playing defense is a stretch imo. He's not some turnstile.

We also never seen a center capable of doing what Jokic does.

Maybe the terminology was off...but the point still stands. Can you win a chip with a centey that's a liability on defence?

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Watching him in last year's playoffs and get hunted on defence, Malone subbing him out at every defensive possession...I don't really care between the terms...the fact is, he was a liability in the playoffs and was unplayable at that end when it mattered most So my question hasn't been answered...because the answer is that no one one with a Center that's a defensive liability.

GSW and that PHX are the exact type of teams where Jokic defense has zero chance of stopping.

and with a limited roster they didn't have the firepower to outscore them.

 

[ballinsam23]

Maybe the terminology was off...but the point still stands. Can you win a chip with a centey that's a liability on defence?

Yes I think you can 100% win a chip with a player of Jokic's offensive talent and defensive liabilities.

 

[Moheezy]

GSW and that PHX are the exact type of teams where Jokic defense has zero chance of stopping.

and with a limited roster they didn't have the firepower to outscore them.

I don't know man...I appreciate how great he is on offence and he's so much fun to watch. But he's going to have to prove himself in the playoffs. Defensively I mean. I think that's a fair ask.

Malone will need to get creative with his defensive schemes.

 

[Arthur Shelby]

 

[Moheezy]

Yes I think you can 100% win a chip with a player of Jokic's offensive talent and defensive liabilities.

I personally don't believe it until I see it. Do you think the team this year has a chance?

 

[osh kosh bosh]

if you aren't going to let guys fight, you can't let em do this imo

 

[B Sox]

You know how you don’t build around Jokic for playoff success?

Exactly how the Nuggets have.

Yeah I think you can definitely win with him as your best guy.

Going to require better roster construction than they currently have though and a better coach.