The Penn State Child-Sex Abuse Scandal Thread...Hammer dropped on PSU...sanctions galore.

[osh kosh bosh]

 @ you saying he had a limited understanding of molestation like this is some new sick activity. 

Have you ever talk to an older person about this? My grandmother didn't even know what it mean (granted she is from Nigeria)


to say that people in 2014 don't have a more sophisticated less naive understanding of sexual predators is ridiculous.


even then Sandusky went through a lot of trouble to make it seem like he was just a guy who loved kids and would horse play with them and apperently he was pretty good at this since he managed to fool footbal coaches, the parents of kids who he baby sat and so on.

Im an outside observer I have no skin in the game


like I said, I don't believe mquery and thats what this comes down to, really, If you belive that Joe understood and he explained it them you are justified in your vitriol if you don't well then its mnore complicated.

 

[MIKE LOWERY]

Paterno was catholic.


He knew exactly what it was.

 

[mr marcus]

I can see someone older from another country like Nigeria being oblivious to molestation. It's probably known by something else or the practice is accepted and not spoken about (because of war or fear). 

 

[dmxfury]

I would question how much my grandfather would comprehend or 'get' what I was saying if I hinted around the topic. Obviously if I was direct he'd understand completely what I was referring to.

 

[rillo561]

He knew exactly what it was.

No question, this was a huge cover up and many people involved looked the other way.

 

[stillin729]

misleading; clearly fell for the ESPN TMZ story

Penn State is not putting up the statue a group of morons raised money is and a local bar is allowing them to place it outside their establishment

 

[osh kosh bosh]

I would question how much my grandfather would comprehend or 'get' what I was saying if I hinted around the topic. Obviously if I was direct he'd understand completely what I was referring to.

thats my point I don't think Mcquery was clear.

sure if you said JOE, JERRY SHOWER PENIS CHILDS *** HOLE. he would understand but I don't think it went down like that.

No question, this was a huge cover up and many people involved looked the other way.

Why, Joe despised sandusky on general principle,why joe cover for him?

 

[stillin729]

it's a mute point anyway; the person who posted the ESPN tweet did no actual background on the story

PSU is not going to put up a statue of Joe Paterno; the university has done everything to move away from him which is why you have idiot loons doing this downtown in State College

As an alum I can't stand this idiots who still stand behind Joe Pa

 

[dmxfury]

You will get that blind loyalty with any big program, nothing you can do about it

 

[osh kosh bosh]

it's a mute point anyway; the person who posted the ESPN tweet did no actual background on the story

PSU is not going to put up a statue of Joe Paterno; the university has done everything to move away from him which is why you have idiot loons doing this downtown in State College

As an alum I can't stand this idiots who still stand behind Joe Pa

really?

People act as if Joe Pa molested the kids himself...

He seems like a scape goat to me.


I completely understand why someone would want to reclaim his legacy, especially considering he made a mistake at that many people/institutions have made, child molesters are notoriously difficult to spot without 20/20 hind sight.

 

[rillo561]

Why, Joe despised sandusky on general principle,why joe cover for him?

He despised him but kept him on staff? After I read what happened to the first prosecutor that was trying to build the case against Sandusky; the whole thing reeks of a cover up and I wouldn't be surprised how deep the rabbit hole goes. There were rumors of a whole ring going on. Sandusky was probably just the beginning.

 

[rillo561]

really?

People act as if Joe Pa molested the kids himself...

He seems like a scape goat to me.

The guy admitted he could've done more, looking the other way isn't a "scape goat" you're just as guilty in my eyes. Also, there were numerous reports of inappropriate behavior by this scumbag, Joe looked the other way.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

He despised him but kept him on staff? After I read what happened to the first prosecutor that was trying to build the case against Sandusky; the whole thing reeks of a cover up and I wouldn't be surprised how deep the rabbit hole goes. There were rumors of a whole ring going on. Sandusky was probably just the beginning.

he fired him, before that im pretty sure.

 

[rillo561]

he fired him, before that im pretty sure.

Sure, when it was getting too close for comfort.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

The guy admitted he could've done more, looking the other way isn't a "scape goat" you're just as guilty in my eyes. Also, there were numerous reports of inappropriate behavior by this scumbag, Joe looked the other way.

I disagreed with this assessment, looked the other way at what?

Just accept my version of events for a sec, you're an old man, a shell shocked mquery starts rambling to you about some "horse play" possibly in the shower from a former employee (an employee who has reputation for close relationships with minors and physical seemingly non sexual horseplay).


his next action was to inform his superior.

Is that really so illogical??


Remove hindsight from it man, and really try and put your self in joe mindframe, an old dude who didn't grow up with awareness of sexual predators we have today.

you tell your boss about it why is that the wrong move in the moment.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Sure, when it was getting too close for comfort.

I rmeebr a a column in the new yorker was pretty compelling


here a clip

"In 1999, Paterno made it plain to Sandusky that he would not be the next head coach of Penn State. Sandusky retired and took an emeritus position. On February 9, 2001, a former Penn State quarterback named Mike McQueary saw Sandusky in the shower with a young boy at a Penn State athletic facility. What exactly McQueary witnessed is still in dispute. That evening, he spoke to a family friend—a local doctor—and told him he had heard “sexual” sounds. The doctor asked him several times if he had seen any sexual act, and each time McQueary said no. Eleven years later, in his grand-jury testimony and at Sandusky’s criminal trial, McQueary’s memory grew more explicit: he had seen Sandusky raping the boy, he now said. What is clear, though, is that whatever McQueary saw or heard upset him greatly. He went to Paterno. Paterno called Tim Curley, the Penn State athletic director."


Y'all really belive that Mcqueary told Paterno the real details of how it happned?


I'm sorry, I don't it sounds to me like a guy trying to cover his *** 11 years later.


and when you here stories that Mqueary was also a victim of sexual abuse it might explain why he wasn't forthright with joe as you ar i might be.

 

[rillo561]

I disagreed with this assessment, looked the other way at what?

Just accept my version of events for a sec, you're an old man, a shell shocked mquery starts rambling to you about some "horse play" possibly in the shower from a former employee (an employee who has reputation for close relationships with minors and physical seemingly non sexual horseplay).


his next action was to inform his superior.

Is that really so illogical??


Remove hindsight from it man, and really try and put your self in joe mindframe, an old dude who didn't grow up with awareness of sexual predators we have today.

you tell your boss about it why is that the wrong move in the moment.

Sorry, but this is really naive IMO.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Sorry, but this is really naive IMO.

why? You are asking me to believe a complicated conspiracy.

I am asking you to believe basically the same events that happen in child molester scandal.

-Socioppathic child molester through charm and effort sets up a campaign of disinformation to get easy access to future victims and leave himself as the least possible sucpect.

-Institutions and individuals fail to notice.

-then are hit with 20/20 hind sight about how they should have know.


Sandusky duped a victims PARENTS, you don't think he couldn't dupe his old boss who didn't like him or give a **** about him outside of work?

 

[dmxfury]

I think holding an apathetic party to the same level of responsibility as the party which did act would lead to problems in general

 

[rillo561]

The old man said he could've done more. That's all I needed to know.

 

[darthska]

I'm not digging stuff up from 2 years ago, but there was some really damning quotes from JoePa. He knew Sandusky was showering w/ those boys, and for me, that's enough for me to hold him in contempt for NOT tearing PSU's walls down in an attempt to right ANYTHING being done wrong.

But he didn't tear any walls down.

He politely... 'reported it'... to the athletic department or whoever it was.

You want to make up scenarios where "It's possible that he just, you know, only coached football, and honestly and truly thought everything was lovely"?

Let me make up a scenario: his own grandson is all like "Oh, yay! Mr. Sandusky is coming over? Are we gonna take a shower like ma and him did the other day?"

Run that scenario through your 'hypothetical machine', tell me what results come out. Tell me he still just 'reports it' and goes back to his desk, with next to ZERO follow up.

"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing."

I still contend that Joe Pa was a good man.

Who did nothing.

And yes, he knew more than his apologists are ready to realize.

 

[stillin729]

Paterno was a good man who did a lot of good for people but ultimately it's the one thing he didn't do that will forever taint his legacy

 

[darthska]

^ Sad.

But ultimately,

True.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

I'm not digging stuff up from 2 years ago, but there was some really damning quotes from JoePa. He knew Sandusky was showering w/ those boys, and for me, that's enough for me to hold him in contempt for NOT tearing PSU's walls down in an attempt to right ANYTHING being done wrong.

But he didn't tear any walls down.

He politely... 'reported it'... to the athletic department or whoever it was.

You want to make up scenarios where "It's possible that he just, you know, only coached football, and honestly and truly thought everything was lovely"?

Let me make up a scenario: his own grandson is all like "Oh, yay! Mr. Sandusky is coming over? Are we gonna take a shower like ma and him did the other day?"

Run that scenario through your 'hypothetical machine', tell me what results come out. Tell me he still just 'reports it' and goes back to his desk, with next to ZERO follow up.

"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing."

I still contend that Joe Pa was a good man.

Who did nothing.

And yes, he knew more than his apologists are ready to realize.

I think you are really under estimating the difference in are awareness of sexual predation for a some born now vs 1929.


Bill James sums it up well.

We all have a moral feeling, in regard to Mr. Sandusky’s activities, that somebody should have stopped this. Quite certainly, somebody should have stopped it. Penn State wrote Mr. Paterno’s name into that space because it was him or us. The real "cover-up" here was the act of laying responsibility onto Joe Paterno for actions that Paterno knew nothing about, actions that came to light only after his professional relationship with Mr. Sandusky had ended, and actions that he reported to his superiors as he should have done, and trusted them to do what needed to be done.

The assumption that Joe Paterno failed in his moral responsibility relies on the belief that Mr. Paterno knew things that in fact there is no evidence whatsoever that he did know, or could have known, or had any reason to suspect. No person has stepped forward to say that Mr. Sandusky’s departure from the Penn State program in the late 1990s had anything to do with his sexual misconduct. Mr. Paterno has stated publicly that he had no such information at that time. No person has stated that this was not true. No person has provided any evidence or any testimony that contradicts this.


In my mind out everyone in this entire situation Joe should get the LEAST blame, I think what he chose to do was completely reasonable and appropriate.

 

[darthska]

Were you born in the 20s? I'm not being sarcastic; I'm asking for a reason I'll get to in a sec.

I really think you're undervaluing exactly how much a head football coach at ANY school knows about, ESPECIALLY a school like PSU.

Do I know how much they are aware of? No, but I've heard. I've heard they're virtual gods to the school, not just in stature, but in the innerworkings of much more than just the football program, and certainly any- and everything attached to the program.

But do I, myself, know how much they are aware of? No, just as you weren't born in the 20s.

But in any case where a child is traumatized, I'm siding on the side of the child, and I will hold in contempt any- and everyone who could have done something to stop the traumatization and didn't.

And again, if JoePa's own grandkids had been one of Sandusky's victims... one of his own kids' kids... he would have went far beyond "reasonable and appropriate." He wouldn't have stopped until he was DAMN sure no shenanigans were taking place, not just vaguely positive that most likely nothing too bad is really going on.