THEE OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA OFFSEASON THREAD: VICTORY LAP

[lawdog1]

^^^ I’ll just say this, there’s some very notable players who got the wrap of not being “tier 1” until they won a ring. And guess what? When they did win the ring, they happened to be on the most talented team. Then narratives changed.

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

Never forget how he got that “one chip”



Y’all make leading a team to a championship, seen so easy these days

What happened in the 2015-2016 season where HOU only finished .500? Dwight?

I forgot about it, but that year Curry pretty much didn't play the entire series vs Houston...

HOU got waxed

 

[VARNELL HILL]

^^^ I’ll just say this, there’s some very notable players who got the wrap of not being “tier 1” until they won a ring. And guess what? When they did win the ring, they happened to be on the most talented team. Then narratives changed.

Does that work for teams too?

Before the Warriors actually won it...how many people were calling them the most talented team?

 

[P C H]

What happened in the 2015-2016 season where HOU only finished .500? Dwight?

I forgot about it, but that year Curry pretty much didn't play the entire series vs Houston...

HOU got waxed

Lost in 5 to GSW in 16' w/only iirc Steph playing 2 games,
The game 6 flameout against SAS may be the worst flameout of a superstar I've ever seen
Game 6 vs LAC.

Curry has just done too much head to head against Harden to say they're on the same tier. Not in 2020.

This put an end to that. THat's your home floor, KD wasn't even playing.

 

[lawdog1]

Does that work for teams too?

Before the Warriors actually won it...how many people were calling them the most talented team?

Fair point. Nobody was calling them the most talented, but you could also say they weren’t the most talented before Kerr got there. They went to another level. Just like the Lakers did when Phil got there.

And that’s kind of my point. Everything comes together the right way for championship teams. So I don’t think it’s fair to say Harden “isn’t that guy” just because he hasn’t gotten to the Finals yet.

 

[wavycrocket]

Game 5...2019 finals. No KD....Tie game, time series....chance to be up 3-2, going home......Fully healthy squad.....And you let Steph curry go for 16 4th qtr points to close out the game with a Win



Game 6 2019....No KD...you let Steph curry score 33 second half points to send you home



Harden my guy....but he just a level below. That’s not a slight to him. I’ve given him credit for pushing the warriors to the brink. He’s even been better than Lebron against the KD-Steph led warriors. He’s been amazing over the past 5 seasons. When the chips are down....he didn’t come thru. And that’s the difference. The other guy ain’t going out sad against the Kawhi-Less spurs, or anything like that.

What is a FACT is, Steph as a #1 option...has led teams that have beaten Bron, KD, Harden, AD, Lillard etc. That gotta count for something @lawdawg @bSox

 

[P C H]

Harden is not that guy because he hasn't gotten to the finals though, he's not that guy because he's not as good as those guys at basketball. At least to me.

Getting to the finals is ultimately a byproduct of that sure, but that's not the crux of why I said that he wasn't that guy. I think there are tangible things related to basketball that he's just not as good as those guys are, that show themselves in the most egregious times and moments.

It partly falls on Houston but I think the Rockets org has gamed the system in a way that puts Harden and his chamberlainesque numbers in a context that just isn't warranted.

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

Fair point. Nobody was calling them the most talented, but you could also say they weren’t the most talented before Kerr got there. They went to another level. Just like the Lakers did when Phil got there.

And that’s kind of my point. Everything comes together the right way for championship teams. So I don’t think it’s fair to say Harden “isn’t that guy” just because he hasn’t gotten to the Finals yet.

Distinction:

To this point you can't put Harden in Curry's tier

Harden could theoretically change that fact

I don't think my statement is unfair at all

Exactly what happened to Dirk. He was always ****ted on and called soft until he won

 

[VARNELL HILL]

Game 5...2019 finals. No KD....Tie game, time series....chance to be up 3-2, going home......Fully healthy squad.....And you let Steph curry go for 16 4th qtr points to close out the game with a Win



Game 6 2019....No KD...you let Steph curry score 33 second half points to send you home



Harden my guy....but he just a level below. That’s not a slight to him. I’ve given him credit for pushing the warriors to the brink. He’s even been better than Lebron against the KD-Steph led warriors. He’s been amazing over the past 5 seasons. When the chips are down....he didn’t come thru. And that’s the difference. The other guy ain’t going out sad against the Kawhi-Less spurs, or anything like that.

What is a FACT is, Steph as a #1 option...has led teams that have beaten Bron, KD, Harden, AD, Lillard etc. That gotta count for something @lawdawg @bSox

Let's walk em back even further.



No KD around to claim "unfairness" either...

 

[wavycrocket]

Let's walk em back even further.



No KD around to claim "unfairness" either...

Facts. Then this....

Head up, each team with a total of “2 all stars”....to get to the finals to win that “One Chip”....a gentleman sweep. Including a near 40 point loss in game 3....where Steph goes for 37 in 3 quarters .

 

[ill steelo]

Ever since that San Antonio nightmare, offense has absolutely NOT been the issue with James Harden.

Offensively, he’s completely beyond reproach at this point. Teams are now doubling him 40 feet away from the basket, shading him right to a comically exaggerated extent. I’m not sure why 2015 is even being referenced anymore.

The issue is going to be on the other end, and will continue to be until Morey or his successor finds the right mix of two way guys, ala Kidd/Trix/Tyson on the ‘11 Mavs.

It’s a shame he and Paul fell out. Westbrook is one of the laziest defenders in the sport

 

[B Sox]

Ever since that San Antonio nightmare, offense has absolutely NOT been the issue with James Harden.

Offensively, he’s completely beyond reproach at this point. Teams are now doubling him 40 feet away from the basket, shading him right to a comically exaggerated extent. I’m not sure why 2015 is even being referenced anymore.

The issue is going to be on the other end, and will continue to be until Morey or his successor finds the right mix of two way guys, ala Kidd/Trix/Tyson on the ‘11 Mavs.

It’s a shame he and Paul fell out. Westbrook is one of the laziest defenders in the sport

One could say he needs Klay/Dray/Iggy.

 

[statis22]

Never forget how he got that “one chip”



Y’all make leading a team to a championship, seen so easy these days

This game will never sit well with me considering they were a few bounces away from winning both games in Oakland. And looking back this may have been the game the team quit on Kevin McHale but idk why they would have chosen this game to do it. The fact that they came out that flat in what was the biggest game for the franchise in almost 20 years made it that much disappointing.

 

[SpittaJetLife]

Harden is basically modern Gilbert Arenas.

 

[nick.]

 

[Mister Meaner]

Damn, that’s horrible. Hope he and his family can recover from this.

And rewatching Kobe’s 81. I always cringe at the commentary.

 

[ballinsam23]

CP3 and Harden were capable of winning one. Front office coulda properly surrounded those two with the right wings and bigs for a 3-4 year run.

MDA too damn stubborn and cant control egos at all.

 

[HOU$TON]

If harden had more talented teams y’all would change y’all tune. In the 2019 series KD, harden, klay, EG, and draymond all were better than Steph. Curry was terrible that series 40% from the field and 28% from 3 while be abused on defense. Imagine having the luxury of playing 3 good quarters in a series that went 6 games as a star player and winning. Harden is top tier!



Going heads up with KD (best player in the world)

 

[do work son]

Steph has always had Klay and Dray. KD didn’t win it all until he joined them. LeBron had Wade/Bosh then Kyrie/Love. Kawhi had Parker/Duncan/Ginobili and while the raptors didn’t have a true second star, Siakam, Lowry, FVV were all great in the finals and they still barely scraped by needing Klay missing a game and KD missing the whole series to win.

harden had a post back surgery Dwight Howard clearly on the decline and a 33 year old Chris Paul for one good season. The one season Harden had a teammate actually play like a star, they won 65 games and cruised to the WCF before running into Klay, Steph, and KD. Beyond that, the teams put around him have always been inferior to the competition around the league. That doesn’t make harden inferior to his peers. KD and Bron are in my tier one. Steph Harden Kawhi Giannis and AD are in my tier 2.

 

[pums]

Harden Lost to the warriors who were healthy for 4 and 3/4th's games.

Kawhi had the better supporting cast yet they still lost twice to a shell of the warriors' team.


Kawhi (28.5 / 9.8 / 4.2)
Harden (34.8/7.0/5.5)

 

[pums]

After watching the documentary Harden needs to find his own Phil Jackson. Someone to actually coach him and make him accountable. We're running the Doug Collins offense.

 

[Zo gif]

Harden will get his chance when he's 35 coming off the bench for a 62 win team.
He just can't be THE guy it's not in his DNA.
It took KD joining a historically great team to secure his rings.
I just dont see how harden and the rockets could ever reach that next level.

 

[Sonny Corinthos]

 

[freeze]

Lolllll

 

[polosanddunks]

Harden will get his chance when he's 35 coming off the bench for a 62 win team.
He just can't be THE guy it's not in his DNA.
It took KD joining a historically great team to secure his rings.
I just dont see how harden and the rockets could ever reach that next level.

We had our chance in Game 7 but they wanted to go shoot 27 consecutive missed 3s....AT HOME

Then we had our chance again.KD goes down and these fools still don’t seize the opportunity. This is me a Rockets fan talking too.

it’s a wrap until the next rebuild.