why is it such a sin to say anyone will be better than Michael Jordan?

[spottieottie305]

This video shows why so many believe MJ is the greatest, just look at his footwork and tripple threat position.  He's arguably the best post player ever and people want to compare Lebron to him? Lebron doesn't have a 3rd of Jordan's offensive repertoire.  People get to caught up in the moment and blinded by stats, we need to observe more with our eyes. 

Greatest post player of all time... REALLY??? He definitely had great footwork and was a great post up player. Saying he was the best post up player EVER is reaching. I'll probably say he was probably the best post up guard in history. And saying that LeBron doesn't have a 3rd of Jordan's repertoire is a moot point. No one in the NBA can stop LeBron in the post. Have you been watching him this past year and a half?

Jordan had better footwork and developed a polished post game as his athleticism declined... LeBron, who is in his prime, can already score the ball any way he wants on offense and is a better passer than Jordan ever was. Add on the fact he does it while averaging 56% shooting. Does this mean LeBron is better player, no? What I'm trying to point out is that both players are great in their own right? They have different games yet both are effective.

MJ didn't need to pay Hakeem to learn that post game either. MJ can do that move in his grampa jeans ans turtle neck.

So you are trying to tell me Michael Jordan came into the league with that post game? He just all of a sudden became a great post game player without ever learning or studying a player's moves?

Just because LeBron learned from Hakeem doesn't prove Jordan was a better player. That's a flawed argument. Jordan just like any other player in the history of the game learned from others. He modeled his game after the greats that came before him. Yet, when LeBron does it, he's weaker for it?

LeBron is still developing as a player, his post game might become just as lethal as MJ's. Like I said Michael Jordan never rebounded or passed like LeBron and LeBron never scored or shot like Jordan. Both are great in their own right. Jordan just has the better career resume... so far.

 

[rashi]

Truth hurts, I know.

So you are trying to tell me Michael Jordan came into the league with that post game? He just all of a sudden became a great post game player without ever learning or studying a player's moves? eyes.gif

Just because LeBron learned from Hakeem doesn't prove Jordan was a better player. That's a flawed argument. Jordan just like any other player in the history of the game learned from others. He modeled his game after the greats that came before him. Yet, when LeBron does it, he's weaker for it?

LeBron is still developing as a player, his post game might become just as lethal as MJ's. Like I said Michael Jordan never rebounded or passed like LeBron and LeBron never scored or shot like Jordan. Both are great in their own right. Jordan just has the better career resume... so far.

I didn't use MJ's post game to prove MJ > Lebron, and I don't need to.

I'm willing to bet 95% of the people that comment in this thread aren't even old enough to appreciate the player MJ was. Most caught the tail end of his career or the Wizards days. There was a good 6 year stretch that MJ average 30+ppg-7+-7+, with 1989 he averaged 33-8-8. Just look at his 1988-1989 season, I-N-S-A-N-E. Lebron is great, but the fact is the MJ already did what Lebron is doing, against way better competition.

On top of it, Lebron is a quitter. MJ isn't a quitter.

 

[david bowman]

Im curious to see how many more peak years lebron has in the league. MJ's college years and that baseball stint took away some accolades

 

[srvballer]

I never understand these arguments on radio or tv. Are we arguing whose got a better resume or who is actually better at basketball in their prime.

Because obviously for resume we can't compare yet and its pointless to predict. I do think its a bit absurd to say that Lebron needs to end up with 6 or 7 rings to be considered the GOAT though. Or else like he said the other day...why isn't Russell considered the GOAT? Cause we're all too young and dont have any real footage to watch of him? Pretty lame reasoning.

But I think it is a very legit debate of which player you'd rather have in their prime. Lebron or MJ? I don't think there is a obvious answer

 

[Johnny_Cakes]

Wade better than Pippen??

What a ****ing joke...

 

[spottieottie305]

I'll put my two cents in on the op.

When Michael Jordan started winning he shut the league down. Like no other teams stood a chance until he retired. He beat teams that where better than his.

What happened to Kobe in 2004 and Lebron in 2011 NEVER happened to him because he wouldn't let it.

As great as Lebron is and Kobe is you don't feel hopless like you did with Mike in his prime.

=

What happened the other 7+ years Jordan didn't win a championship? Jordan just let his teams lose those years huh. He didn't have the same killer instinct or will to win those years. His will to win was only strong those 6 times....

The argument that Kobe or LeBron lost in the Finals multiple times... therefore Jordan is better player is such a weak argument. Jordan didn't lead his team to the Championship when he was 22 years old either, but because LeBron was able to do it and lost y'all hold that against him...

The point is, Jordan, just like any other great player had their ups and downs. LeBron career is still going strong, enjoy it while you can. He's a once in a generation player just like Jordan was.

 

[shoeking2101]

Truth hurts, I know.

Truth my ***. If Jordan was such a winner then what happened his first 7, 8 years in the league? He played 13 plus seasons and only won 6 times. What happened those other 7 seasons then?

 

[al3xis]

'Getting cracked' has been replaced by more double-teaming, more trapping and precision rotations that the 80's and 90's did not execute nearly as well. Plus the option of zone which can make it more difficult to get in the paint than defenses of the past. IE when zone was put into effect, Phil Jackson said, "I think it'll be an advantage for Shaq, definitely, defensively," Jackson said. "It's going to keep him around the basket with a lot less movement." Pat Riley: 'I think it's a huge mistake,'' Miami Coach Pat Riley said last week. ''There's not going to be anybody able to drive." Rudy T said: ''We should create a situation where great players get a chance to excel. Zones neutralize great athletic ability."

I bet some guys would rather get knocked around after beating single coverage and hand checking (guys like Durant, LeBron, Rose would have their way with it) than having to deal with the intricacies that go with defense today.

 

[Coupé It]

[/quote]
You said Chris Bosh was better than Pippen, though.[/quote]

What? No I did not. I said D-Wade is an overall better player than Pip, not Bosh.

But if I'm a superstar NBA player like Jordan and Lebron I'd rather have Bosh & Wade then Pippen & whoever else.

Y'all disrespect Wade and Bosh way too much.

 

[david bowman]

I also read it as you would take wade over anyone on Chicago. And you would take bosh over anyone on Chicago. Two different statements. I was like WAAATT?

I will say, without bosh hitting those 3s in game 7 I don't see them winning that game. Plus their troubles came when he wasn't in the line up. So yes he's underrated. But nowhere near pippen. Not in his class

 

[basick]

im young but michael jordan did what he wanted when he wanted how he wanted.

 

[Baby Face Nelson]

Ton of crazy stuff said in here, as always.

Plain and simple, LeBron isn't done yet, but neither he nor Kobe's resume' are even close. Kobe being on the tail end of his and LeBron in his prime... no. Right now, it's not even a discussion.

And I agree with those who say people get caught up in the whole Michael Jordan experience and how it played out and revolutionized not only the league, but the entire sport, fashion, etc... but isn't that part of it all? Not from a marketing or dollar aspect, but I'm talking about how Mike just played out perfectly. He was a winner from his first college season, a clutch winner, and he had the struggles every young man has when he joins the real world (i.e. NBA) but once he was "the Man", he was the Man until he left. Plain and simple.

Mike didn't lose in the Finals. He never even faced elimination in the Finals. Never. To me, that'll always be my last bullet in the chamber, even if LeBron gets to 6 or goes past 6. He lost 2. Got swept the first time and lost to a team that shouldn't have beaten them the 2nd time. Mike just wasn't gonna go out like that and he never did.

I'll agree, we've never seen anything like LeBron before... but we still haven't seen anything like Mike. Kobe has done one helluva job of doing an impersonation. Hell, I used to hate Kobe for no reason, but when I realized all he was doing was pretending to be like Mike just like the rest of us used to do in the backyard, except he actually looked like him, all I could do is enjoy the great years of basketball he gave us.

I am fully confident that we'll never see anything like Mike again. Never.

I am a huge Mike fan but from a fan's point of view, I think Lebron gets alot of flack for his Finals performance. Do you know how trash that 07 Cavs team was? It was remarkable for him to get to that point with those D-Leaguers. I don't want to hear about having to play in a "horrid" conference because he still had to go toe to toe with Paul Pierce and literally carried the Cavs on his back against the 2 time Eastern Conference Champs Pistons. I have to disagree when you talk about the Mavs and Heat matchup. On paper Lebron was the best player on the court, but the way Dirk and Chandler were playing, he was the third best on the court. Dallas was a very deep team that gave Lebron alot of difficult matchups and they were the better team overall. The 95 Magic and 04 Lakers have better players than the Rockets and Pistons respectively in the Finals, but the better teams won. I think people gloss over the fact that it was team efforts that beat Lebron for the sake of arguement.

 

[SneakerProSr.]

Ton of crazy stuff said in here, as always.

Plain and simple, LeBron isn't done yet, but neither he nor Kobe's resume' are even close. Kobe being on the tail end of his and LeBron in his prime... no. Right now, it's not even a discussion.

And I agree with those who say people get caught up in the whole Michael Jordan experience and how it played out and revolutionized not only the league, but the entire sport, fashion, etc... but isn't that part of it all? Not from a marketing or dollar aspect, but I'm talking about how Mike just played out perfectly. He was a winner from his first college season, a clutch winner, and he had the struggles every young man has when he joins the real world (i.e. NBA) but once he was "the Man", he was the Man until he left. Plain and simple.

Mike didn't lose in the Finals. He never even faced elimination in the Finals. Never. To me, that'll always be my last bullet in the chamber, even if LeBron gets to 6 or goes past 6. He lost 2. Got swept the first time and lost to a team that shouldn't have beaten them the 2nd time. Mike just wasn't gonna go out like that and he never did.

I'll agree, we've never seen anything like LeBron before... but we still haven't seen anything like Mike. Kobe has done one helluva job of doing an impersonation. Hell, I used to hate Kobe for no reason, but when I realized all he was doing was pretending to be like Mike just like the rest of us used to do in the backyard, except he actually looked like him, all I could do is enjoy the great years of basketball he gave us.

I am fully confident that we'll never see anything like Mike again. Never.

I disagree.

Its not Lebron's fault the East was so weak that him and some bums made it to the Finals. Mike couldn't get out the East until he had a team.

2011 is a black mark but if Lebron gets 6 playing on the level he is now, he is in the discussion for best ever and you can make a good argument for him.

 

[mister friendly]

Because nobody is better than Jordan right now. Trust what people are telling you. Lebron is more comparable to Magic than Jordan

 

[SneakerProSr.]

I'll put my two cents in on the op.

When Michael Jordan started winning he shut the league down. Like no other teams stood a chance until he retired. He beat teams that where better than his.

What happened to Kobe in 2004 and Lebron in 2011 NEVER happened to him because he wouldn't let it.

As great as Lebron is and Kobe is you don't feel hopless like you did with Mike in his prime.

=

What happened the other 7+ years Jordan didn't win a championship? Jordan just let his teams lose those years huh. He didn't have the same killer instinct or will to win those years. His will to win was only strong those 6 times....

The argument that Kobe or LeBron lost in the Finals multiple times... therefore Jordan is better player is such a weak argument. Jordan didn't lead his team to the Championship when he was 22 years old either, but because LeBron was able to do it and lost y'all hold that against him...

The point is, Jordan, just like any other great player had their ups and downs. LeBron career is still going strong, enjoy it while you can. He's a once in a generation player just like Jordan was.

Jordan always lost to a better team and when he did lose it was never because he failed to show up. Neither Lebron or Kobe can make that statement,

Like I typed above Lebron's resume isn't over and if he gets 6 playing on this level its a good argument between him a Jordan.

 

[moonman818]

Defense was different back in Jordan's day.

I LMAO @ anyone who doesn't think Lebron or Kobe couldn't go back in MJ's time and dominate the game just as much.

 

[tupackshaker]

Jordan played in a watered down league check out this video this dude breaks it down perfectly:

 

[duba169]

I'm not watching that based on the title alone :x

 

[shoegoon77]

Defense was different back in Jordan's day.

I LMAO @ anyone who doesn't think Lebron or Kobe couldn't go back in MJ's time and dominate the game just as much.

I think we all agree that Kobe and Bron would be great in MJ's time. However, I along with others believe that if MJ played in Kobe and Bron's era where rules are more offensively friendly, he would average 40 plus with ease.  You can barely make contact while guarding anyone today..especially superstars.  In Jordan's era, the defense was MUCH more physical than today's defense and that's a fact and teams played a ton of zone(illegal defense) with no defensive 3 sec rule where the lane could stay clogged. IMO that plays huge deal in terms of Jordan's numbers compared to Bron's. 

 

[nycknicks105]

at you guys really thinking Wade > Scottie

As many people have said. Wade is a great offensive player. He has the ability to take over a game all by himself. He is a good defender, great at playing passing lanes, and is one of the best shot blocking guards in the history of the game. Scottie Pippen was the better on ball defender and more versatile due to his size...and that is where the comparison stops.

Wade came into the league and was dominant. In his third year he lead the Miami Heat to a Championship and was a top 5 player in the league. He was self made. And lets not forget he was Finals MVP with Shaq on his squad.

Scottie benefited from MJ being on his team. Without MJ, Scottie Pippin does not become an elite defender.

You're just wrong on so many levels

If that is all you know about Scottie, then there is no point having this conversation with you. Scottie Pippen is probably the most underrated player of all time.

 

[al3xis]

teams played a ton of zone(illegal defense) with no defensive 3 sec rule where the lane could stay clogged.

No, no and no.

 

[ricky409]

People think it is a sin to compare anyone to Michael Jordan because his greatness supersedes the accomplishments of any player in league history. Not only that, he accomplished what he did at the height of the NBA. He won on the biggest stage the league had to offer.

With that said I think LeBron is the only player that can realistically be in the same league as Michael Jordan. All bias aside, he is doing things MJ has never done in terms of efficiency. LeBron has the versatility of a Scottie Pippen, with the play making ability of Magic Johnson. Fans and analyst love to talk about his shooting "weakness" when he's now shooting the ball with ease at a great percentage. He drives the ball with both hands, pulls up when necessary, posts up anytime he needs an easy bucket, etc. He does everything on the floor with greatness. He has no weakness as a basketball player at this point in his career.

The reason people compare MJ to LeBron isn't just about accomplishments. People are having two different arguments. If you only focus on career accomplishments Jordan will win every time. But when you compare them as basketball players, that's where things get interesting.

In my opinion:
Michael Jordan was a better

• scorer
• shooter

LeBron is a better

• rebounder
• passer

They are comparable athletically and both are great defenders. Both had no tangible weakness in their games.

see... that's what i'm talking about...

cats swear up and down that jordan was this and that... all of his game winners are brought to the light... only lebron's misses are brought up...

someone posted in General about how mike was SUCH a savant to the game of ball cuz he recognized that lebron likes to go right and drive, left and pull up... i'm like...

WTH... that's 75% of basketball players... you cannot be cereal.

Players who quit on their teams in the playoffs/Finals can't ever be considered the greatest ever. Therefore, you can cross off Kobe and Lebron.



At the end of the day, MJ is the greatest basketball player of all time. There isn't a debate, I don't care how many titles Lebron wins or how many records he breaks in this watered down league.

how do you sound right now famb?

if bron rakes in 40k points, 10k rebs, and 10k dimes... w/ 7 rings... you'd still say jordan was better?

THIS is what i have a problem w/... its b/c no matter what a person does, jordan is so legendary its like insulting one's religion...

 

[SneakerProSr.]

teams played a ton of zone(illegal defense) with no defensive 3 sec rule where the lane could stay clogged.

No, no and no.

Dudes just start making **** up in "debates" on NT.

Teams played a ton of zone defense

 

[ricky409]

yeah what a bunch of weaklings!
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what a HUUUUUGE difference!!  

It's always been one of the dumbest myths out there

do you see who MJ was beating? lebron would get his head knocked in. No easy lay ups. we simply do not know how he would react when he can't barrel his way through. there would be hard fouls that wouldn't be 10 game suspensions

and yet...

lebron and karl malone are the same size... 6'9", 270...

bron can guard malone. malone aint guarding bron.

and you post extreme examples...

see... i can do that too...

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you dumb as a muh fugga if you dont think athletes are bigger, stronger faster... there were no WESTBROOKS back in the day, brah....

 

[tupackshaker]

I'm not watching that based on the title alone

He brings up a lot of great points I understand that Jordan **** riders will have a hard time hearing the truth.