"You have damaged your own race" Philadelphia mayor to black youth

[beh235]

I agree on the point of the presentation of our youth. They need to understand how important it is to have a decent presentation on a daily basis. No one will hire you if you have your pants half off your butt. In terms of damaging our race, I wouldn't go that far. It's a bit hyperbole, but I see his point. I agree with making the parents accountable for their children's actions though. I don't live in Philly, so I don't exactly know the dynamics of the politics with this mayor, so I can only go off this article. Pardon my ignorance on this, but I thought flash mobs were groups of people organizing and doing a corny dance routine. I had no idea there can be violent flash mobs. That's crazy. Kids these days....

 

[snaggykicks]

He is right if i was him id make the curfew 6 30 charge parents 350 everytime they out something is gonna stop its just sad

 

[beh235]

Originally Posted by Quincy Powell

Why are African-Americans so judgmental of each other?





Rhetorical.

I know you said it's rhetorical, but I'm not letting you get away that easy

. You can say that about any race dude. You have Asians, Whites, etc. Let's not turn this into that. How is it judgemental to make a statement for youth not to act like a bunch of knuckleheads? I can't stand seeing young Black men dressed like that. It's sad and most don't know the origin of the trend, which makes me more sick. This topic is way too deep to discuss on NT without it getting completely out of hand.

  

 

[patrick bateman]

Originally Posted by B Smooth 202

is that what you tell your future?

how are you gonna blame the kids man? the kids are the victims here....it's irresponsible adults like this guy who have failed the children and thats why he can allow himself to say something as demeaning to his own people.

I'm all for the public taking action (see London 

) but from what I get about this situation, dudes are just acting a fool for no cause.. maybe I'm misinformed, how are the kids the victims in this situation? (sincere question)

 

[tkthegirl]

Dang ain't nobody doing summer sports conditioning, working, volunteering?
 Is there anything to do there?

That's a lot Idle minds in one spot.

 

[milestailsprowe]

He is right because people who do things like this just leave bad impressions on people

 

[quincy powell]

Originally Posted by beh235

Originally Posted by Quincy Powell

Why are African-Americans so judgmental of each other?





Rhetorical.

I know you said it's rhetorical, but I'm not letting you get away that easy

. You can say that about any race dude. You have Asians, Whites, etc. Let's not turn this into that. How is it judgemental to make a statement for youth not to act like a bunch of knuckleheads? I can't stand seeing young Black men dressed like that. It's sad and most don't know the origin of the trend, which makes me more sick. This topic is way too deep to discuss on NT without it getting completely out of hand.

  

That may be but I feel like we're always doing it for everybody to see and judge us as well. We $#%+ on each other through the media and wonder why others feel it's cool to look down on us and make a few bad apples represent us. Whites and Asians don't have those issues.

 

[ruxxx]

I came in here to say the same thing B Smooth,but all of em' can't be placed under that "victims" umbrella.Some of these kids are GONE and they ain't tryna hear %+@*.On the other side of that though,some of these old heads (60+) pointing fingers,yelling,putting our "dirty laundry" out there for the world to see (literally) need to take a look in the mirror and ask THEMselves "where did WE go wrong?" and "what is it that WE didn't do?".Both sides need to take accountability.

 

[goldenchild9]

Hes has a point in that our generation needs to get it together...but when you point the finger at someone, 4 fingers are pointing back at you.

A lot of the blame for the state of inner city youth lands squarely on him, his generation and people of his ilk (politicians/those with positions of power).

 

[jd214]

Dude is right

 

[sreggie101]

posting for later read.

just by going off the title alone, i 100% agree. those kids have BEEN setting me back with their antics. getting together is one thing, but looting stores, targeting white people and jumping them, and smashing store windows is diff story.

 

[8h2i9frs]

he's right.
black people seem to turkish our race every single day.
constant brother on brother crime and senseless acts of crime.

 

[-Red-]

Originally Posted by xCautioNx

Originally Posted by bboy1827

I like it, riot in the streets until these kids get jobs or something to do with their summer. Not down with riots turning into gang violence, but that is the consequence of people, not just youth or adults, without jobs, frustrated, angry and bored. Most of these kids are doing it just to do it to be honest. Still, can't help to wonder if there was something better for them to do would they be flash mobbing or if their parents cared that there 11 year old was out at all hours of the night. Hopefully the people will stand up in a positive way, opposed to more restrictions of freedoms. People will demand that there be some type of summer programs for kids, preferably jobs or sports. Stop firing teachers and cutting school funding; maybe kids won't be spend their summers running around in the streets potentially getting criminal records that will follow them in far into their futures.


and before someone says "they are kids, they know what their doing'' there is a reason we have a juvenile court system; or age of consent laws; or child labor laws; or any other laws that "protect our children"

Oh and the things you learn in school, the jobs that you get during the year, the clubs that you want to be a part of, the sports that you want to play are all factors in what you do with your summer. For instance, football players have 7 on 7 summer workouts what have you.

Great post.

  

Yup.  Things like "flash mobs" are SYMPTOMS of much larger issues at work, NOT the issues themselves.

I am not familiar with Philly politics or the mayor specifically, but what has HE done to create greater resources and opportunities for Black youth in his city?  What have any of you all agreeing with his statements done to help prevent or address these type of situations in your cities?

Those are not rhetorical questions, either...

Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman

Originally Posted by B Smooth 202

is that what you tell your future?

how are you gonna blame the kids man? the kids are the victims here....it's irresponsible adults like this guy who have failed the children and thats why he can allow himself to say something as demeaning to his own people.

I'm all for the public taking action (see London 

) but from what I get about this situation, dudes are just acting a fool for no cause.. maybe I'm misinformed, how are the kids the victims in this situation? (sincere question)

The young people are the victims in this situation because they are marginalized population within a marginalized population and bear the full brunt of every social ill affecting urban populations due to no fault of their own.  They come from homes where their parents are largely uneducated and unemployed.  Their housing is inadequate for the number of people living there.  Their communities look like wastelands or garbage containers and where feelings of hopelessness and helplessness are the norm.  Their schools are run-down and often lack basic necessities (soap, copy paper, etc.).  They have little or no recreational opportunities and even fewer employment opportunities.  THESE CONDITIONS ALL EXISTED DUE TO NO FAULT OF THEIR OWN AND WERE AROUND LONG BEFORE THIS CURRENT GENERATION WAS EVEN BORN.

How are they NOT the victims in this situation?

 

[beh235]

Originally Posted by Quincy Powell

Originally Posted by beh235

Originally Posted by Quincy Powell

Why are African-Americans so judgmental of each other?





Rhetorical.

I know you said it's rhetorical, but I'm not letting you get away that easy

. You can say that about any race dude. You have Asians, Whites, etc. Let's not turn this into that. How is it judgemental to make a statement for youth not to act like a bunch of knuckleheads? I can't stand seeing young Black men dressed like that. It's sad and most don't know the origin of the trend, which makes me more sick. This topic is way too deep to discuss on NT without it getting completely out of hand.

  

That may be but I feel like we're always doing it for everybody to see and judge us as well. We $#%+ on each other through the media and wonder why others feel it's cool to look down on us and make a few bad apples represent us. Whites and Asians don't have those issues.

I see what you're getting at. It's the crabs in a barrel analogy. It's so deep

. Sadly, too deep for NT.

 

[vq35dett]

I've been a teacher in a public school in Philly for a few years now and I deal with a lot of these kids everyday.  From my point of view, a large portion of the blame is on the kids and an even larger portion of the blame is on the parent(s).  The term kid or child here is used loosely seeing as quite a few of the minors arrested during these flash mobs were very close to 18 (some even older).  At some point, these kids have to start taking full responsibility for their actions, ESPECIALLY when parenting is transient or non-existent (not a popular sentiment).  It's not a good situation to be in where children are taking care of children, but it becomes a very tribal and evolutionary struggle where the strong survive.  Of course, many of our youths who are caught up in these situations think that being "strong" means being aggressive and violent to display prowess.  Unfortunately, this face-value approach to evolution simply doesn't work in modern society where true strength is most directly derived from intellectual ability and mental robustness.  This is hard to recognize without strong leadership (PARENTING) so children without this support often rely on the more convenient and socially acceptable behaviors such as acting out and being violent. 

Broadly, the flash mob issue in Philadelphia (and probably in Chicago and other urban areas) is an acute symptom of a very chronic illness with our youth.  The causes of this illness are very deeply rooted in societies and cultures and simply cannot be changed overnight.  I agree with Mayor Nutter's sentiment in that the actions, especially those that are repetitive, of a few bad apples allow the masses to form generalizations of a whole demographic.  Nutter is absolutely correct in saying that flash mobs, rude behavior, tattoos, sagging pants, etc. are triggers for people to look at African Americans a certain (negative) way.  Whether you like it or not, this perception is true.

In terms of trying to fix the flash mob problem right here, right now in the Summer of 2011 in Philadelphia, I think that Nutter is doing what he needs to do.  He is putting himself out in front of cameras and radio stations so that the kids in the city know that people are watching.  While there may not be an infinite amount of organized activities to participate in, there are things for kids to do.  Did everyone here really go to summer camp or play sports or have a job?  I didn't.  My dad never paid for me to go to camp or to play sports.  When I was too young to work, I just stayed at home or maybe went outside to play.  Why is that such a hard task these days?  I'm not sure and it's a tough question to answer.  Even tougher is the question of why boredom or frustration leads to such random acts of violence.  I'm from the school of thought where I think that this behavior should be treated similarly to PTSD (but that another discussion).

As a slight aside, and hopefully to stir up some positive discussion/brainstorming, I think that the overall trend of handouts needs to be ramped down.  Some kids are now growing up in a world where they get THREE full meals a day at school, free/subsidized housing, Accesscards (food stamps), and just a general lifestyle of handouts.  I understand the concept of welfare, I get why this great country has it.  Welfare needs to be a means to an end, not an end.  I honestly believe that generations of families who live off of welfare lead to societies where handouts are expected and all of a sudden, when something isn't easily attainable, excuses start flying.  Give an inch, take a mile.

Life's about getting real, getting down to business, and working hard to support your (hopefully positive) lifestyle.  Excuses don't mean anything.  Kick habits.  Stop fighting.  It's hard, trust me, I know.  What are the other options though? 

 

[undermedicated]

Originally Posted by Quincy Powell

Originally Posted by beh235

Originally Posted by Quincy Powell

Why are African-Americans so judgmental of each other?





Rhetorical.

I know you said it's rhetorical, but I'm not letting you get away that easy

. You can say that about any race dude. You have Asians, Whites, etc. Let's not turn this into that. How is it judgemental to make a statement for youth not to act like a bunch of knuckleheads? I can't stand seeing young Black men dressed like that. It's sad and most don't know the origin of the trend, which makes me more sick. This topic is way too deep to discuss on NT without it getting completely out of hand.

  

That may be but I feel like we're always doing it for everybody to see and judge us as well. We $#%+ on each other through the media and wonder why others feel it's cool to look down on us and make a few bad apples represent us. Whites and Asians don't have those issues.

I think most people know by now some just don't want to see others get to where they are in life or do better then them. 
You can put a racial spin on it and blame the media and common stuff in life, but even people in a certain job field will find promotions hard for the same reason.

 

[sreggie101]

Originally Posted by vq35dett

I've been a teacher in a public school in Philly for a few years now and I deal with a lot of these kids everyday.  From my point of view, a large portion of the blame is on the kids and an even larger portion of the blame is on the parent(s).  The term kid or child here is used loosely seeing as quite a few of the minors arrested during these flash mobs were very close to 18 (some even older).  At some point, these kids have to start taking full responsibility for their actions, ESPECIALLY when parenting is transient or non-existent (not a popular sentiment).  It's not a good situation to be in where children are taking care of children, but it becomes a very tribal and evolutionary struggle where the strong survive.  Of course, many of our youths who are caught up in these situations think that being "strong" means being aggressive and violent to display prowess.  Unfortunately, this face-value approach to evolution simply doesn't work in modern society where true strength is most directly derived from intellectual ability and mental robustness.  This is hard to recognize without strong leadership (PARENTING) so children without this support often rely on the more convenient and socially acceptable behaviors such as acting out and being violent. 

Broadly, the flash mob issue in Philadelphia (and probably in Chicago and other urban areas) is an acute symptom of a very chronic illness with our youth.  The causes of this illness are very deeply rooted in societies and cultures and simply cannot be changed overnight.  I agree with Mayor Nutter's sentiment in that the actions, especially those that are repetitive, of a few bad apples allow the masses to form generalizations of a whole demographic.  Nutter is absolutely correct in saying that flash mobs, rude behavior, tattoos, sagging pants, etc. are triggers for people to look at African Americans a certain (negative) way.  Whether you like it or not, this perception is true.

In terms of trying to fix the flash mob problem right here, right now in the Summer of 2011 in Philadelphia, I think that Nutter is doing what he needs to do.  He is putting himself out in front of cameras and radio stations so that the kids in the city know that people are watching.  While there may not be an infinite amount of organized activities to participate in, there are things for kids to do.  Did everyone here really go to summer camp or play sports or have a job?  I didn't.  My dad never paid for me to go to camp or to play sports.  When I was too young to work, I just stayed at home or maybe went outside to play.  Why is that such a hard task these days?  I'm not sure and it's a tough question to answer.  Even tougher is the question of why boredom or frustration leads to such random acts of violence.  I'm from the school of thought where I think that this behavior should be treated similarly to PTSD (but that another discussion).

As a slight aside, and hopefully to stir up some positive discussion/brainstorming, I think that the overall trend of handouts needs to be ramped down.  Some kids are now growing up in a world where they get THREE full meals a day at school, free/subsidized housing, Accesscards (food stamps), and just a general lifestyle of handouts.  I understand the concept of welfare, I get why this great country has it.  Welfare needs to be a means to an end, not an end.  I honestly believe that generations of families who live off of welfare lead to societies where handouts are expected and all of a sudden, when something isn't easily attainable, excuses start flying.  Give an inch, take a mile.

Life's about getting real, getting down to business, and working hard to support your (hopefully positive) lifestyle.  Excuses don't mean anything.  Kick habits.  Stop fighting.  It's hard, trust me, I know.  What are the other options though? 

One of the strongest posts i've read on NT so far. Cosigned. Also, very insightful on the welfare point (underlined), I never saw it that way.

I've always thought that a big reason these kids are failing at life is due to lack of a family structure at home...broken families caused by drugs, economic hardship, single parent or any combination of said issues. The issue is how to fix the home situation. The way i see it, if this problem persists, the kid is more likely to grow up with the same mentality has his folks and therefore the next generation of kids will have the same broken family issue...a rinse and repeat process.

 

[atlien seeko]

This is hilarious. If someone would have told me "in the future, 'fun' will be planking and assembling doing dumb ******ed stuff" I would have laughed my !*$ off.

So since it's actually happening, I have to just

 

[ghenges]

The unfortunate thing about it is that none of the flash mob kids who read what he had to say will take any of it seriously. 

Then the day will come when they go too far and it will be too late. 

 

[lesfamilia]

Outside of the gentleman who has actually taught in the district, I don't think people totally have an idea of what we are dealing with here.  I worked with kids for the past year in West Philly, and for them, the only reason they would assemble for flash mobs is because there are no opportunities for young people here in the summer.  I don't think anyone can argue there.  If anything, the media is making more of a big deal about this than it really is.  Instead of just pointing fingers, Mayor Nutter needs to step in and create opportunities for these kids.  It's not just about handouts, it's about helping people out.

The problem with the mobs is that they are only a small percentage of the number of kids who are our school over the summer here in Philly.  They mess it up for anyone.  I live right on South Street, and while I can say the crowds can be annoying at times, I've never felt unsafe.  Maybe that's just me, though...

 

[debso]

Originally Posted by bboy1827

I like it, riot in the streets until these kids get jobs or something to do with their summer. Not down with riots turning into gang violence, but that is the consequence of people, not just youth or adults, without jobs, frustrated, angry and bored. Most of these kids are doing it just to do it to be honest. Still, can't help to wonder if there was something better for them to do would they be flash mobbing or if their parents cared that there 11 year old was out at all hours of the night. Hopefully the people will stand up in a positive way, opposed to more restrictions of freedoms. People will demand that there be some type of summer programs for kids, preferably jobs or sports. Stop firing teachers and cutting school funding; maybe kids won't be spend their summers running around in the streets potentially getting criminal records that will follow them in far into their futures.


and before someone says "they are kids, they know what their doing'' there is a reason we have a juvenile court system; or age of consent laws; or child labor laws; or any other laws that "protect our children"

Oh and the things you learn in school, the jobs that you get during the year, the clubs that you want to be a part of, the sports that you want to play are all factors in what you do with your summer. For instance, football players have 7 on 7 summer workouts what have you.

agreed. adults should take note given the complacency about the whole jobs situation in our country.

 

[ghenges]

Hold on...so the alternative to not having a job is joining a flash mob??


How about reading a book? Volunteer work?


I understand hardships of unemployment but being "bored" is no reason to act like a damn fool. Sorry to say but their parents failed.

 

[lesfamilia]

Originally Posted by Ghenges

Hold on...so the alternative to not having a job is joining a flash mob??


How about reading a book? Volunteer work?


I understand hardships of unemployment but being "bored" is no reason to act like a damn fool. Sorry to say but their parents failed.

No, that's not necessarily what I'm saying.  But in a city where the education system is already failing the youth and where teachers and administrators already see kids more than their own parents do, doing things for the sake of doing like volunteer work or reading for leisure isn't really a priority for many kids.  Especially when the stresses of city life begin to take their toll...

 

[pip777]

Originally Posted by vq35dett

I've been a teacher in a public school in Philly for a few years now and I deal with a lot of these kids everyday.  From my point of view, a large portion of the blame is on the kids and an even larger portion of the blame is on the parent(s).  The term kid or child here is used loosely seeing as quite a few of the minors arrested during these flash mobs were very close to 18 (some even older).  At some point, these kids have to start taking full responsibility for their actions, ESPECIALLY when parenting is transient or non-existent (not a popular sentiment).  It's not a good situation to be in where children are taking care of children, but it becomes a very tribal and evolutionary struggle where the strong survive.  Of course, many of our youths who are caught up in these situations think that being "strong" means being aggressive and violent to display prowess.  Unfortunately, this face-value approach to evolution simply doesn't work in modern society where true strength is most directly derived from intellectual ability and mental robustness.  This is hard to recognize without strong leadership (PARENTING) so children without this support often rely on the more convenient and socially acceptable behaviors such as acting out and being violent. 

Broadly, the flash mob issue in Philadelphia (and probably in Chicago and other urban areas) is an acute symptom of a very chronic illness with our youth.  The causes of this illness are very deeply rooted in societies and cultures and simply cannot be changed overnight.  I agree with Mayor Nutter's sentiment in that the actions, especially those that are repetitive, of a few bad apples allow the masses to form generalizations of a whole demographic.  Nutter is absolutely correct in saying that flash mobs, rude behavior, tattoos, sagging pants, etc. are triggers for people to look at African Americans a certain (negative) way.  Whether you like it or not, this perception is true.

In terms of trying to fix the flash mob problem right here, right now in the Summer of 2011 in Philadelphia, I think that Nutter is doing what he needs to do.  He is putting himself out in front of cameras and radio stations so that the kids in the city know that people are watching.  While there may not be an infinite amount of organized activities to participate in, there are things for kids to do.  Did everyone here really go to summer camp or play sports or have a job?  I didn't.  My dad never paid for me to go to camp or to play sports.  When I was too young to work, I just stayed at home or maybe went outside to play.  Why is that such a hard task these days?  I'm not sure and it's a tough question to answer.  Even tougher is the question of why boredom or frustration leads to such random acts of violence.  I'm from the school of thought where I think that this behavior should be treated similarly to PTSD (but that another discussion).

As a slight aside, and hopefully to stir up some positive discussion/brainstorming, I think that the overall trend of handouts needs to be ramped down.  Some kids are now growing up in a world where they get THREE full meals a day at school, free/subsidized housing, Accesscards (food stamps), and just a general lifestyle of handouts.  I understand the concept of welfare, I get why this great country has it.  Welfare needs to be a means to an end, not an end.  I honestly believe that generations of families who live off of welfare lead to societies where handouts are expected and all of a sudden, when something isn't easily attainable, excuses start flying.  Give an inch, take a mile.

Life's about getting real, getting down to business, and working hard to support your (hopefully positive) lifestyle.  Excuses don't mean anything.  Kick habits.  Stop fighting.  It's hard, trust me, I know.  What are the other options though? 

Great post.

 

[ghenges]

Originally Posted by vq35dett

I've been a teacher in a public school in Philly for a few years now and I deal with a lot of these kids everyday.  From my point of view, a large portion of the blame is on the kids and an even larger portion of the blame is on the parent(s).  The term kid or child here is used loosely seeing as quite a few of the minors arrested during these flash mobs were very close to 18 (some even older).  At some point, these kids have to start taking full responsibility for their actions, ESPECIALLY when parenting is transient or non-existent (not a popular sentiment).  It's not a good situation to be in where children are taking care of children, but it becomes a very tribal and evolutionary struggle where the strong survive.  Of course, many of our youths who are caught up in these situations think that being "strong" means being aggressive and violent to display prowess.  Unfortunately, this face-value approach to evolution simply doesn't work in modern society where true strength is most directly derived from intellectual ability and mental robustness.  This is hard to recognize without strong leadership (PARENTING) so children without this support often rely on the more convenient and socially acceptable behaviors such as acting out and being violent. 

Broadly, the flash mob issue in Philadelphia (and probably in Chicago and other urban areas) is an acute symptom of a very chronic illness with our youth.  The causes of this illness are very deeply rooted in societies and cultures and simply cannot be changed overnight.  I agree with Mayor Nutter's sentiment in that the actions, especially those that are repetitive, of a few bad apples allow the masses to form generalizations of a whole demographic.  Nutter is absolutely correct in saying that flash mobs, rude behavior, tattoos, sagging pants, etc. are triggers for people to look at African Americans a certain (negative) way.  Whether you like it or not, this perception is true.

In terms of trying to fix the flash mob problem right here, right now in the Summer of 2011 in Philadelphia, I think that Nutter is doing what he needs to do.  He is putting himself out in front of cameras and radio stations so that the kids in the city know that people are watching.  While there may not be an infinite amount of organized activities to participate in, there are things for kids to do.  Did everyone here really go to summer camp or play sports or have a job?  I didn't.  My dad never paid for me to go to camp or to play sports.  When I was too young to work, I just stayed at home or maybe went outside to play.  Why is that such a hard task these days?  I'm not sure and it's a tough question to answer.  Even tougher is the question of why boredom or frustration leads to such random acts of violence.  I'm from the school of thought where I think that this behavior should be treated similarly to PTSD (but that another discussion).

As a slight aside, and hopefully to stir up some positive discussion/brainstorming, I think that the overall trend of handouts needs to be ramped down.  Some kids are now growing up in a world where they get THREE full meals a day at school, free/subsidized housing, Accesscards (food stamps), and just a general lifestyle of handouts.  I understand the concept of welfare, I get why this great country has it.  Welfare needs to be a means to an end, not an end.  I honestly believe that generations of families who live off of welfare lead to societies where handouts are expected and all of a sudden, when something isn't easily attainable, excuses start flying.  Give an inch, take a mile.

Life's about getting real, getting down to business, and working hard to support your (hopefully positive) lifestyle.  Excuses don't mean anything.  Kick habits.  Stop fighting.  It's hard, trust me, I know.  What are the other options though? 

Yes, I know others have quoted it but I'm quoting it again.  Very, very good post.  Hit all the nails on the head and didn't shy away from the uncomfortable topics. 

Props for taking the time to put this out there.