2011 NBA MVP Thread
- Thread in 'Sports & Training' Thread starter Started by CP1708,
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kobe missed a few
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kobe missed a few
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You're damn right I was. And weren't you doing the same?
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You're damn right I was. And weren't you doing the same?
everysingletime
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Happy that this thread came back to life. It was pretty dead for a while there.
Haven't heard any new argument though. Every detractor love to rehash arguments.
1-"Bulls offense sucks which Rose is a big part of and Bulls defense rocks which Rose affects the least"
2-"Bulls surge is due to Thibs defensive philosophy than Rose's improvement"
3-"If you wanna play hypotheticals, then Magic without Dwight would be absolute garbage"
4-"Westbrook has same numbers as Rose but is more efficient"
1- Thibs has always said from day 1 that for his defense to work, everyone has to be on the same page. If Rose wasn't holding up his share, with the minutes he plays the defense wouldn't be as good.
I know some of y'all, professional writers included like to get cute and discredit Rose's improved defense by adding that the defense gets better when Rose sits out for Watson, but everyone conveniently ignores that when Rose is subbed out, it's not just Watson that subs in. Bulls have what we call a 'bench mob.' It's a highly defensive oriented bench that includes along with Watson - Taj, Brewer, Asik - three of our better defenders. Thibs likes to bring these three in along with Watson AND he keeps Luol Deng on the floor. Of course the defense is going to improve especially when you consider Boozer - IMO the weakest defender out of every Bull not named Scalabrine and Butler is taken out when Rose is subbed out as well.
2-This argument would be more credible, IMO if Rose's improvement was only marginal. If Rose had stayed practically the same player he was last year and the Bulls STILL are at the top of the standings then of course we can point to Thib's coaching as the main factor in the Bulls improvement. As it is I would go 50/50 on this. The Bulls need Thibs just as much as they need Rose.
The game that we just had would not have been possible without Thib's defense AND Rose's improvement. We were down what, 13 or 14 in the 3rd - maybe 15. Milwaukee was playing us tough the whole game. We were just trying to chip in the lead and we did. And it was made possible by the fact that our defense put a stranglehold on the Bucks and the fact that Rose carried the entire offense in the 2nd.
The game was closer than the score would lead you to believe and best believe that the Bulls needed every basket and assist Derrick had. He had 30 and 17. Last year's Rose could not have had that game, or any other great game that the Bulls had needed from him to pull out wins this year.
Bulls improvement has a lot to do with Thibs but we can't be giving all the credit to Thibs. That's just unfair to Rose but y'all are doing it.
3- Dwight is definitely number 2 and he would probably be number 1 maybe if the Magic was just ranked higher. When you're ranked number 4 in the East you better have ungodly numbers to overcome the media's penchant for only picking MVP's from highly seeded teams. Dwight is doing his thing and he definitely gets props from me. The only problem I have is when people say Dwight is "doing more with less" - the Magic personnel are just fine. They have Jameer, who was once an all star caliber pg. They have Turk, one of the key pieces to a Magic team that went to the finals. Jason Richardson is talented and so is Gil. The "more with less" thing really irks me but besides that I actually like Dwight.
4-Russy is more efficient than Rose because he doesn't have an entire defense gunning for him. He has a 30 ppg machine deflecting much of the attention from him. Russy is doing his thing and he'll probably still be doing his thing if he was the #1 option on another team BUT I will put ANYTHING on the line that his highly touted efficiency will go down in the process as well.
Efficiency, I've noticed is a card I've seen played a lot in arguments on NT this season. It has been used to credit and discredit players in different arguments and I'm kinda tired of it.
Too much emphasis has been put on it to the point where it's getting overrated.
Efficiency is nice but it's not the bottom line.
You can have Dirk and Nash who I know are both ungodly players in terms of efficiency but I'll take Kobe, who's not as efficient (how I hate to bring him into an argument) over each of them every time.
That's pretty much all I got to say on this. I'm pretty sure I've done nothing to change your minds but hey, as long as my argument is heard. Whether my argument made a dent or not doesn't matter - Rose is winning it regardless.
Haven't heard any new argument though. Every detractor love to rehash arguments.
1-"Bulls offense sucks which Rose is a big part of and Bulls defense rocks which Rose affects the least"
2-"Bulls surge is due to Thibs defensive philosophy than Rose's improvement"
3-"If you wanna play hypotheticals, then Magic without Dwight would be absolute garbage"
4-"Westbrook has same numbers as Rose but is more efficient"
1- Thibs has always said from day 1 that for his defense to work, everyone has to be on the same page. If Rose wasn't holding up his share, with the minutes he plays the defense wouldn't be as good.
I know some of y'all, professional writers included like to get cute and discredit Rose's improved defense by adding that the defense gets better when Rose sits out for Watson, but everyone conveniently ignores that when Rose is subbed out, it's not just Watson that subs in. Bulls have what we call a 'bench mob.' It's a highly defensive oriented bench that includes along with Watson - Taj, Brewer, Asik - three of our better defenders. Thibs likes to bring these three in along with Watson AND he keeps Luol Deng on the floor. Of course the defense is going to improve especially when you consider Boozer - IMO the weakest defender out of every Bull not named Scalabrine and Butler is taken out when Rose is subbed out as well.
2-This argument would be more credible, IMO if Rose's improvement was only marginal. If Rose had stayed practically the same player he was last year and the Bulls STILL are at the top of the standings then of course we can point to Thib's coaching as the main factor in the Bulls improvement. As it is I would go 50/50 on this. The Bulls need Thibs just as much as they need Rose.
The game that we just had would not have been possible without Thib's defense AND Rose's improvement. We were down what, 13 or 14 in the 3rd - maybe 15. Milwaukee was playing us tough the whole game. We were just trying to chip in the lead and we did. And it was made possible by the fact that our defense put a stranglehold on the Bucks and the fact that Rose carried the entire offense in the 2nd.
The game was closer than the score would lead you to believe and best believe that the Bulls needed every basket and assist Derrick had. He had 30 and 17. Last year's Rose could not have had that game, or any other great game that the Bulls had needed from him to pull out wins this year.
Bulls improvement has a lot to do with Thibs but we can't be giving all the credit to Thibs. That's just unfair to Rose but y'all are doing it.
3- Dwight is definitely number 2 and he would probably be number 1 maybe if the Magic was just ranked higher. When you're ranked number 4 in the East you better have ungodly numbers to overcome the media's penchant for only picking MVP's from highly seeded teams. Dwight is doing his thing and he definitely gets props from me. The only problem I have is when people say Dwight is "doing more with less" - the Magic personnel are just fine. They have Jameer, who was once an all star caliber pg. They have Turk, one of the key pieces to a Magic team that went to the finals. Jason Richardson is talented and so is Gil. The "more with less" thing really irks me but besides that I actually like Dwight.
4-Russy is more efficient than Rose because he doesn't have an entire defense gunning for him. He has a 30 ppg machine deflecting much of the attention from him. Russy is doing his thing and he'll probably still be doing his thing if he was the #1 option on another team BUT I will put ANYTHING on the line that his highly touted efficiency will go down in the process as well.
Efficiency, I've noticed is a card I've seen played a lot in arguments on NT this season. It has been used to credit and discredit players in different arguments and I'm kinda tired of it.
Too much emphasis has been put on it to the point where it's getting overrated.
Efficiency is nice but it's not the bottom line.
You can have Dirk and Nash who I know are both ungodly players in terms of efficiency but I'll take Kobe, who's not as efficient (how I hate to bring him into an argument) over each of them every time.
That's pretty much all I got to say on this. I'm pretty sure I've done nothing to change your minds but hey, as long as my argument is heard. Whether my argument made a dent or not doesn't matter - Rose is winning it regardless.
everysingletime
formerly amel223
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Happy that this thread came back to life. It was pretty dead for a while there.
Haven't heard any new argument though. Every detractor love to rehash arguments.
1-"Bulls offense sucks which Rose is a big part of and Bulls defense rocks which Rose affects the least"
2-"Bulls surge is due to Thibs defensive philosophy than Rose's improvement"
3-"If you wanna play hypotheticals, then Magic without Dwight would be absolute garbage"
4-"Westbrook has same numbers as Rose but is more efficient"
1- Thibs has always said from day 1 that for his defense to work, everyone has to be on the same page. If Rose wasn't holding up his share, with the minutes he plays the defense wouldn't be as good.
I know some of y'all, professional writers included like to get cute and discredit Rose's improved defense by adding that the defense gets better when Rose sits out for Watson, but everyone conveniently ignores that when Rose is subbed out, it's not just Watson that subs in. Bulls have what we call a 'bench mob.' It's a highly defensive oriented bench that includes along with Watson - Taj, Brewer, Asik - three of our better defenders. Thibs likes to bring these three in along with Watson AND he keeps Luol Deng on the floor. Of course the defense is going to improve especially when you consider Boozer - IMO the weakest defender out of every Bull not named Scalabrine and Butler is taken out when Rose is subbed out as well.
2-This argument would be more credible, IMO if Rose's improvement was only marginal. If Rose had stayed practically the same player he was last year and the Bulls STILL are at the top of the standings then of course we can point to Thib's coaching as the main factor in the Bulls improvement. As it is I would go 50/50 on this. The Bulls need Thibs just as much as they need Rose.
The game that we just had would not have been possible without Thib's defense AND Rose's improvement. We were down what, 13 or 14 in the 3rd - maybe 15. Milwaukee was playing us tough the whole game. We were just trying to chip in the lead and we did. And it was made possible by the fact that our defense put a stranglehold on the Bucks and the fact that Rose carried the entire offense in the 2nd.
The game was closer than the score would lead you to believe and best believe that the Bulls needed every basket and assist Derrick had. He had 30 and 17. Last year's Rose could not have had that game, or any other great game that the Bulls had needed from him to pull out wins this year.
Bulls improvement has a lot to do with Thibs but we can't be giving all the credit to Thibs. That's just unfair to Rose but y'all are doing it.
3- Dwight is definitely number 2 and he would probably be number 1 maybe if the Magic was just ranked higher. When you're ranked number 4 in the East you better have ungodly numbers to overcome the media's penchant for only picking MVP's from highly seeded teams. Dwight is doing his thing and he definitely gets props from me. The only problem I have is when people say Dwight is "doing more with less" - the Magic personnel are just fine. They have Jameer, who was once an all star caliber pg. They have Turk, one of the key pieces to a Magic team that went to the finals. Jason Richardson is talented and so is Gil. The "more with less" thing really irks me but besides that I actually like Dwight.
4-Russy is more efficient than Rose because he doesn't have an entire defense gunning for him. He has a 30 ppg machine deflecting much of the attention from him. Russy is doing his thing and he'll probably still be doing his thing if he was the #1 option on another team BUT I will put ANYTHING on the line that his highly touted efficiency will go down in the process as well.
Efficiency, I've noticed is a card I've seen played a lot in arguments on NT this season. It has been used to credit and discredit players in different arguments and I'm kinda tired of it.
Too much emphasis has been put on it to the point where it's getting overrated.
Efficiency is nice but it's not the bottom line.
You can have Dirk and Nash who I know are both ungodly players in terms of efficiency but I'll take Kobe, who's not as efficient (how I hate to bring him into an argument) over each of them every time.
That's pretty much all I got to say on this. I'm pretty sure I've done nothing to change your minds but hey, as long as my argument is heard. Whether my argument made a dent or not doesn't matter - Rose is winning it regardless.
Haven't heard any new argument though. Every detractor love to rehash arguments.
1-"Bulls offense sucks which Rose is a big part of and Bulls defense rocks which Rose affects the least"
2-"Bulls surge is due to Thibs defensive philosophy than Rose's improvement"
3-"If you wanna play hypotheticals, then Magic without Dwight would be absolute garbage"
4-"Westbrook has same numbers as Rose but is more efficient"
1- Thibs has always said from day 1 that for his defense to work, everyone has to be on the same page. If Rose wasn't holding up his share, with the minutes he plays the defense wouldn't be as good.
I know some of y'all, professional writers included like to get cute and discredit Rose's improved defense by adding that the defense gets better when Rose sits out for Watson, but everyone conveniently ignores that when Rose is subbed out, it's not just Watson that subs in. Bulls have what we call a 'bench mob.' It's a highly defensive oriented bench that includes along with Watson - Taj, Brewer, Asik - three of our better defenders. Thibs likes to bring these three in along with Watson AND he keeps Luol Deng on the floor. Of course the defense is going to improve especially when you consider Boozer - IMO the weakest defender out of every Bull not named Scalabrine and Butler is taken out when Rose is subbed out as well.
2-This argument would be more credible, IMO if Rose's improvement was only marginal. If Rose had stayed practically the same player he was last year and the Bulls STILL are at the top of the standings then of course we can point to Thib's coaching as the main factor in the Bulls improvement. As it is I would go 50/50 on this. The Bulls need Thibs just as much as they need Rose.
The game that we just had would not have been possible without Thib's defense AND Rose's improvement. We were down what, 13 or 14 in the 3rd - maybe 15. Milwaukee was playing us tough the whole game. We were just trying to chip in the lead and we did. And it was made possible by the fact that our defense put a stranglehold on the Bucks and the fact that Rose carried the entire offense in the 2nd.
The game was closer than the score would lead you to believe and best believe that the Bulls needed every basket and assist Derrick had. He had 30 and 17. Last year's Rose could not have had that game, or any other great game that the Bulls had needed from him to pull out wins this year.
Bulls improvement has a lot to do with Thibs but we can't be giving all the credit to Thibs. That's just unfair to Rose but y'all are doing it.
3- Dwight is definitely number 2 and he would probably be number 1 maybe if the Magic was just ranked higher. When you're ranked number 4 in the East you better have ungodly numbers to overcome the media's penchant for only picking MVP's from highly seeded teams. Dwight is doing his thing and he definitely gets props from me. The only problem I have is when people say Dwight is "doing more with less" - the Magic personnel are just fine. They have Jameer, who was once an all star caliber pg. They have Turk, one of the key pieces to a Magic team that went to the finals. Jason Richardson is talented and so is Gil. The "more with less" thing really irks me but besides that I actually like Dwight.
4-Russy is more efficient than Rose because he doesn't have an entire defense gunning for him. He has a 30 ppg machine deflecting much of the attention from him. Russy is doing his thing and he'll probably still be doing his thing if he was the #1 option on another team BUT I will put ANYTHING on the line that his highly touted efficiency will go down in the process as well.
Efficiency, I've noticed is a card I've seen played a lot in arguments on NT this season. It has been used to credit and discredit players in different arguments and I'm kinda tired of it.
Too much emphasis has been put on it to the point where it's getting overrated.
Efficiency is nice but it's not the bottom line.
You can have Dirk and Nash who I know are both ungodly players in terms of efficiency but I'll take Kobe, who's not as efficient (how I hate to bring him into an argument) over each of them every time.
That's pretty much all I got to say on this. I'm pretty sure I've done nothing to change your minds but hey, as long as my argument is heard. Whether my argument made a dent or not doesn't matter - Rose is winning it regardless.
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^
I don't think Rose is the far and away the most deserving but I also don't think anyone else deserves it going away either. Yes, he is on the team with the best story and unexpected rise tot the top of East so I think he will win it. That's how it goes and I'm fine with it.
A lot of MVP awards should be re-assigned according to this thread.
I don't think Rose is the far and away the most deserving but I also don't think anyone else deserves it going away either. Yes, he is on the team with the best story and unexpected rise tot the top of East so I think he will win it. That's how it goes and I'm fine with it.
A lot of MVP awards should be re-assigned according to this thread.
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^
I don't think Rose is the far and away the most deserving but I also don't think anyone else deserves it going away either. Yes, he is on the team with the best story and unexpected rise tot the top of East so I think he will win it. That's how it goes and I'm fine with it.
A lot of MVP awards should be re-assigned according to this thread.
I don't think Rose is the far and away the most deserving but I also don't think anyone else deserves it going away either. Yes, he is on the team with the best story and unexpected rise tot the top of East so I think he will win it. That's how it goes and I'm fine with it.
A lot of MVP awards should be re-assigned according to this thread.
Yes I did, which was the point. I was told then that record mattered, now those folks want to ignore a guy leading a 1 seed for an average team? Interesting, isn't that? If Nash was the guy then, Rose is the guy now. Dwight may just be the best player, like Kobe was back then, but that's not who they awarded. I said back then this is why they shouldn't have picked Nash, cuz now they have to vote this way every year from now on.
Yes I did, which was the point. I was told then that record mattered, now those folks want to ignore a guy leading a 1 seed for an average team? Interesting, isn't that? If Nash was the guy then, Rose is the guy now. Dwight may just be the best player, like Kobe was back then, but that's not who they awarded. I said back then this is why they shouldn't have picked Nash, cuz now they have to vote this way every year from now on.
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its a good thing none of you all have a vote
MVP= Most Valuable Player to his team success
Howard is having a great year his team is in 4th place, they won 59 games last year, the most they could win this year is 56....This year they had carter/lewis/pietrus/gortat and replaced them with richardson/arenas/turkolu..... all capable players lewis/pietrus/gortat/hedo all helped orlando get to the finals, which dismiss the notion that he has no support...
James having a good statistical season,,,, hes playing with a next top 5 player, and another top 15 player, yet his team will win less games then the cavs did last year.....the same cavs team that had no talent, the same cavs team that wont win 20 games this year..... With wade/bosh/miller/haslem they should of won 70 games,,,,,,, not even close
Kobe is having a good year.....Having bynum,gasol, odom is always a help, and kobe is one of those player sthey would give it to every year if they could, this aint the year
Rose.....having a good 3rd year....25/8.... Last year the bulls won 41 games, so far they have won 53(+12), 7-3 for the last 10 games is dooable, to give dem 60 wins(+19).... The second and third best players on the team missed a combined 60+ games... and the team stayed afloat..... He Resurrected Luol Deng's Career, and his team is currently the number 1 team in the east....
I guess the Mvp isnt that clear cut, lol......He takes too much shots? was Iversons Mvp not earned?..... I would say this....if howards team was number 1 i wouldnt have no problem if either him or rose won,,,,,thats not the case
MVP= Most Valuable Player to his team success
Howard is having a great year his team is in 4th place, they won 59 games last year, the most they could win this year is 56....This year they had carter/lewis/pietrus/gortat and replaced them with richardson/arenas/turkolu..... all capable players lewis/pietrus/gortat/hedo all helped orlando get to the finals, which dismiss the notion that he has no support...
James having a good statistical season,,,, hes playing with a next top 5 player, and another top 15 player, yet his team will win less games then the cavs did last year.....the same cavs team that had no talent, the same cavs team that wont win 20 games this year..... With wade/bosh/miller/haslem they should of won 70 games,,,,,,, not even close
Kobe is having a good year.....Having bynum,gasol, odom is always a help, and kobe is one of those player sthey would give it to every year if they could, this aint the year
Rose.....having a good 3rd year....25/8.... Last year the bulls won 41 games, so far they have won 53(+12), 7-3 for the last 10 games is dooable, to give dem 60 wins(+19).... The second and third best players on the team missed a combined 60+ games... and the team stayed afloat..... He Resurrected Luol Deng's Career, and his team is currently the number 1 team in the east....
I guess the Mvp isnt that clear cut, lol......He takes too much shots? was Iversons Mvp not earned?..... I would say this....if howards team was number 1 i wouldnt have no problem if either him or rose won,,,,,thats not the case
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its a good thing none of you all have a vote
MVP= Most Valuable Player to his team success
Howard is having a great year his team is in 4th place, they won 59 games last year, the most they could win this year is 56....This year they had carter/lewis/pietrus/gortat and replaced them with richardson/arenas/turkolu..... all capable players lewis/pietrus/gortat/hedo all helped orlando get to the finals, which dismiss the notion that he has no support...
James having a good statistical season,,,, hes playing with a next top 5 player, and another top 15 player, yet his team will win less games then the cavs did last year.....the same cavs team that had no talent, the same cavs team that wont win 20 games this year..... With wade/bosh/miller/haslem they should of won 70 games,,,,,,, not even close
Kobe is having a good year.....Having bynum,gasol, odom is always a help, and kobe is one of those player sthey would give it to every year if they could, this aint the year
Rose.....having a good 3rd year....25/8.... Last year the bulls won 41 games, so far they have won 53(+12), 7-3 for the last 10 games is dooable, to give dem 60 wins(+19).... The second and third best players on the team missed a combined 60+ games... and the team stayed afloat..... He Resurrected Luol Deng's Career, and his team is currently the number 1 team in the east....
I guess the Mvp isnt that clear cut, lol......He takes too much shots? was Iversons Mvp not earned?..... I would say this....if howards team was number 1 i wouldnt have no problem if either him or rose won,,,,,thats not the case
MVP= Most Valuable Player to his team success
Howard is having a great year his team is in 4th place, they won 59 games last year, the most they could win this year is 56....This year they had carter/lewis/pietrus/gortat and replaced them with richardson/arenas/turkolu..... all capable players lewis/pietrus/gortat/hedo all helped orlando get to the finals, which dismiss the notion that he has no support...
James having a good statistical season,,,, hes playing with a next top 5 player, and another top 15 player, yet his team will win less games then the cavs did last year.....the same cavs team that had no talent, the same cavs team that wont win 20 games this year..... With wade/bosh/miller/haslem they should of won 70 games,,,,,,, not even close
Kobe is having a good year.....Having bynum,gasol, odom is always a help, and kobe is one of those player sthey would give it to every year if they could, this aint the year
Rose.....having a good 3rd year....25/8.... Last year the bulls won 41 games, so far they have won 53(+12), 7-3 for the last 10 games is dooable, to give dem 60 wins(+19).... The second and third best players on the team missed a combined 60+ games... and the team stayed afloat..... He Resurrected Luol Deng's Career, and his team is currently the number 1 team in the east....
I guess the Mvp isnt that clear cut, lol......He takes too much shots? was Iversons Mvp not earned?..... I would say this....if howards team was number 1 i wouldnt have no problem if either him or rose won,,,,,thats not the case
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Oh, one person solely resurrected Deng's career.
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Oh, one person solely resurrected Deng's career.
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Kobe would have at least 3 MVP's by now if that were true
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Kobe would have at least 3 MVP's by now if that were true
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The Nash winning doesn't have anything to do with Rose winning, Nash had a more obvious correlation to the Suns success, the suns defense is mediocre and there offense was at that time was the best and Nash was the most important part of it.
Nash has a distinct andvantage when it comes to MVP awars is because he plays the point guard position in a way that nobody is or has played it, so if you are a voter it's far easier to see his "value" to the team.
Nash has a distinct andvantage when it comes to MVP awars is because he plays the point guard position in a way that nobody is or has played it, so if you are a voter it's far easier to see his "value" to the team.
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The Nash winning doesn't have anything to do with Rose winning, Nash had a more obvious correlation to the Suns success, the suns defense is mediocre and there offense was at that time was the best and Nash was the most important part of it.
Nash has a distinct andvantage when it comes to MVP awars is because he plays the point guard position in a way that nobody is or has played it, so if you are a voter it's far easier to see his "value" to the team.
Nash has a distinct andvantage when it comes to MVP awars is because he plays the point guard position in a way that nobody is or has played it, so if you are a voter it's far easier to see his "value" to the team.
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What is it that you guys aren't getting........Rose is the MVP this year, end of story. No need to get talking about Lebron, Dwight, Kobe, Westbrook or anybody else for that matter. Better luck to all those dudes next time, but this year belongs to Rose.
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What is it that you guys aren't getting........Rose is the MVP this year, end of story. No need to get talking about Lebron, Dwight, Kobe, Westbrook or anybody else for that matter. Better luck to all those dudes next time, but this year belongs to Rose.
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bulls coach deserves coach of the year more then pooh deserves mvp
