Black Culture Discussion Thread

[layziegunts]

Yeah I'd say "I'm pro-black," but Pan-Africanism n' stuff like that I can't get down with. Claiming I'm some type of African when I'm not is poser activity to me. It's not my country and or my culture. I don't even claim Panamanian and I think either my grandfather or his parents was that. Once again, not my culture.

you keep getting it wrong, Pan-Africanism isnt saying you must be from Africa. The guy who is started the whole movement Marcus Garvey never stepped foot in Africa all is life.

All its, saying is thats youre suppose to love your home continent and wanrt to see it do better. Being Pan-African doesnt mean you deny your immediate heritage (ie Panama or America) but to understand where we come from AFRICA should be important to us. (also, Africa isnt a country)

Jesus Christ yall got it all wrong lol

 

[Present]

I dont even know who that dude is, if I put a video out that says "pigs can fly and do mulitplication" youre gonna believe me? One person cant control a whole narrative.

Thats my whole point.

He wasnt "some dude"...

Author, Activist and Teacher Omowale Ru Pert-em-Hru delivers an in depth video lesson on Understanding Pan African philosophy. Taken from his much heralded book entitled Pan Afrikanism: From Programme to Philosophy: An Outlook on Liberation.

Lets not ad-hominem the man because he said something we dont like.

Thats why try not to join organizations or say Im this or that w/o understanding what this or that is.

 

[layziegunts]

Like Garvey joined up with the KKK when he wanted to separate black people in America from America.

wtf are you talking about now? Please go away with this nonsense bro.

 

[Present]

you keep getting it wrong, Pan-Africanism isnt saying you must be from Africa. The guy who is started the whole movement Marcus Garvey never stepped foot in Africa all is life.

All its, saying is thats youre suppose to love your home continent and wanrt to see it do better. Being Pan-African doesnt mean you deny your immediate heritage (ie Panama or America) but to understand where we come from AFRICA should be important to us. (also, Africa isnt a country)

Jesus Christ yall got it all wrong lol

Because we dont know what it is!

One Pan African says its this and one Pan African says its that.

Y'all got a website or something?

 

[marikomorose]

So wait - offsprings of bi-racial parents are not considered black? Well atleast to some of y’all standards?
Now I think about the most of the militant gatekeepers for blacks were light skinned.

1. Honestly, I don't. If u have a bi-racial parent that is let's black and white and they have a child w/ a none bi-racial partner then the baby is gonna look more like the partner. In this case Shaun King's mother is white. So Shaun King looks more white. If he didn't have caesar u wouldn't question it.

2. A lot of light-skinned people's blackness be getting tested and sadly people like, let's say a J. Cole feels the need to prove their blackness b/c of the clowns who discriminate against them.

 

[Present]

wtf are you talking about now? Please go away with this nonsense bro.

Garvey and J. Edgar Hoover
Because of his outspoken activism, Garvey became a target of J. Edgar Hoover at the Bureau of Investigation (BOI), a precursor to the FBI. The BOI began investigating Garvey on charges of mail fraud in connection with a brochure for the Black Star Line that included a photo of a ship before the company actually had a vessel in its fleet.

In 1923, after a controversial trial, Garvey was found guilty of these charges and sentenced to a maximum of five years in prison. He blamed a Jewish judge and Jewish jurors for his conviction, saying that they sought retribution against him after he had agreed to meet with the Grand Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan (K.K.K.) several months prior to the trial.

Garvey believed he and the K.K.K. shared similar views on segregation, given that he sought a separate state for African Americans.

Marcus Garvey: Quotes, Books & Death | HISTORY

Marcus Garvey was a Black nationalist and leader of the Pan-Africanism movement, which sought to unify and empower people of African descent worldwide.

www.history.com

Also...

"In America, Garvey scolded blacks for abetting their own oppression through moral lassitude. "Sloth, neglect, indifference caused us to be slaves. Confidence, conviction, action will cause us to be free men today," he proclaimed...

These are Garvey's own words - his mission statement....

He starts off saying "Fellow citizens of Africa"...

Fellow citizens of Africa, I greet you in the name of the Universal Negro Improvement Association and African Communities League of the World. You may ask, what organization is that? It is for me to inform you that the Universal Negro Improvement Association is an organization that seeks to unite into one solid body the 400 million Negroes of the world; to link up the 50 million Negroes of the United States of America, with the 20 million Negroes of the West Indies, the 40 million Negroes of South and Central America with the 280 million Negroes of Africa, for the purpose of bettering our industrial, commercial, educational, social and political conditions.

Say It Plain - American RadioWorks

American RadioWorks is the national documentary unit of American Public Media. ARW is public radio's largest documentary production unit; it creates documentaries, series projects, and investigative reports for the public radio system and the Internet. ARW is based at St. Paul, Minnesota, with...

americanradioworks.publicradio.org

 

[layziegunts]

Because we dont know what it is!

One Pan African says its this and one Pan African says its that.

Y'all got a website or something?

youre starting to become an idiot now. Iight man, I aint responding to you no more.

 

[marikomorose]

Like Garvey joined up with the KKK when he wanted to separate black people in America from America.

HE DID WHAT!?

you keep getting it wrong, Pan-Africanism isnt saying you must be from Africa. The guy who is started the whole movement Marcus Garvey never stepped foot in Africa all is life.

All its, saying is thats youre suppose to love your home continent and wanrt to see it do better. Being Pan-African doesnt mean you deny your immediate heritage (ie Panama or America) but to understand where we come from AFRICA should be important to us. (also, Africa isnt a country)

Jesus Christ yall got it all wrong lol

My Home Continent= The United States of... Merica

 

[Present]

HE DID WHAT!?

My Home Continent= The United States of... Merica

History is something else!

True facts.

In June of 1922, Marcus Garvey traveled to Atlanta to meet with Imperial Kleagle5 Edward Young Clarke of the Ku Klux Klan. Garvey had sought to strengthen his Universal Negro Improvement Association’s (UNIA) influence in the South, but the Klan’s widespread power made any inroads difficult to achieve. Realizing the bargaining power he had in the situation, Clarke agreed to let Garvey to sell stock in the variety of businesses his organization had started - Universal Printing House, Negro Factories Corporation, Black Star Line – under the guarantee that Garvey would also work to weaken organizations like that NAACP that were fighting for civil rights and integration.6 Why would Garvey agree to help fight those that were trying to improve the social status of his fellow African-Americans? And why would he make that agreement with an organization that robbed, beat, raped, and murdered the people he sought to liberate? Likewise, what would motivate Clarke to risk undermining the social hegemony his race held in the southern states by giving more power to the UNIA? From Garvey’s account of the meeting (no such account exists from Clarke’s perspective), the two did little more than mutually reinforce their similar, already-held racial ideologies. As Garvey recounts, “I asked [Clarke] whether he was interpreting the spirit of just a few people who make up his organization or not, and he said ‘no; we are interpreting the spirit of every true white American; but we are honest enough to say certain things that others do not care to say.’”7 Later in the speech, Garvey describes a moment in the meeting when he asks how the Klan feels about blacks who want to be President, followed by the same questions as regards a senator or congressman, and once again, what percentage of white Americans the opinions of the Klan represent. The question-and-answer here seems to be merely for rhetorical effect, and after Garvey notes that once again Clarke claimed to speak for all whites, he states: “Mr. Clark [sic] did not tell me anything new; he told me what I discovered seven years ago. He told me the thing that caused me to have organized the Universal Negro Improvement Association four and a half years ago.”8 That “thing” was a deep belief that humans are inherently racist. In the second volume of Philosophy and Opinions of Marcus Garvey, first published three years after his meeting with Clarke, he writes that racial “self-preservation […] naturally is the first law of nature [….] What must the Negro do in the face of such a universal attitude but to align all his forces in the direction of protecting himself from the threatened disaster of race domination and ultimate extermination? [my emphasis]”9

The Spark | REL355 FA07 | Johnson

 

[Raji Lowenthal]

Wait, did I just read Marcus Garvey was a klansman c'mon son that is not what I got from reading that.

 

[Present]

youre starting to become an idiot now. Iight man, I aint responding to you no more.

Dont be mad at me.

Be mad at the links.

Sheesh!

 

[layziegunts]

P Present whats your purpose for posting those? People always have a funny way of interpreting things.

It's real slick for you to try and come in here and paint a negative picture of Garvey because from what ive been noticing from you, is that you really have nothing to stand on as a black man. You come in here a lot just to go againt me and lot of other cats.

Now, you posted a few select things. Tell me, how do YOU feel about Garvey young man?

 

[layziegunts]

I cant talk certain people in here seriously, I need to get back to work.

 

[Present]

P Present whats your purpose for posting those? People always have a funny way of interpreting things.

It's real slick for you to try and come in here and paint a negative picture of Garvey because from what ive been noticing from you, is that you really have nothing to stand on as a black man. You come in here a lot just to go againt me and lot of other cats.

Now, you posted a few select things. Tell me, how do YOU feel about Garvey young man?

Bro. Its facts.

I provided links.

Ad Hominem:

Description: Attacking the person making the argument, rather than the argument itself, when the attack on the person is completely irrelevant to the argument the person is making.

 

[Present]

Wait, did I just read Marcus Garvey was a klansman c'mon son that is not what I got from reading that.

Where did I say "Marcus Garvey was a klansman"?

Straw man is one type of logical fallacy. Straw man occurs when someone argues that a person holds a view that is actually not what the other person believes. Instead, it is a distorted version of what the person believes.

By exaggerating, misrepresenting, or just completely fabricating someone's argument, it's much easier to present your own position as being reasonable, but this kind of dishonesty serves to undermine honest rational debate.

 

[layziegunts]

P Present what is your position?

 

[Raji Lowenthal]

Where did I say "Marcus Garvey was a klansman"?

Straw man is one type of logical fallacy. Straw man occurs when someone argues that a person holds a view that is actually not what the other person believes. Instead, it is a distorted version of what the person believes.

By exaggerating, misrepresenting, or just completely fabricating someone's argument, it's much easier to present your own position as being reasonable, but this kind of dishonesty serves to undermine honest rational debate.

I read he joined the Klan, in my haste I missed 'up' which is very different than he joined. Just an error on my part no strawman here. Your links dont provide me with any reasonable proof that MG was actively working with the Klan either.

 

[marikomorose]

History is something else!

True facts.

In June of 1922, Marcus Garvey traveled to Atlanta to meet with Imperial Kleagle5 Edward Young Clarke of the Ku Klux Klan. Garvey had sought to strengthen his Universal Negro Improvement Association’s (UNIA) influence in the South, but the Klan’s widespread power made any inroads difficult to achieve. Realizing the bargaining power he had in the situation, Clarke agreed to let Garvey to sell stock in the variety of businesses his organization had started - Universal Printing House, Negro Factories Corporation, Black Star Line – under the guarantee that Garvey would also work to weaken organizations like that NAACP that were fighting for civil rights and integration.6 Why would Garvey agree to help fight those that were trying to improve the social status of his fellow African-Americans? And why would he make that agreement with an organization that robbed, beat, raped, and murdered the people he sought to liberate? Likewise, what would motivate Clarke to risk undermining the social hegemony his race held in the southern states by giving more power to the UNIA? From Garvey’s account of the meeting (no such account exists from Clarke’s perspective), the two did little more than mutually reinforce their similar, already-held racial ideologies. As Garvey recounts, “I asked [Clarke] whether he was interpreting the spirit of just a few people who make up his organization or not, and he said ‘no; we are interpreting the spirit of every true white American; but we are honest enough to say certain things that others do not care to say.’”7 Later in the speech, Garvey describes a moment in the meeting when he asks how the Klan feels about blacks who want to be President, followed by the same questions as regards a senator or congressman, and once again, what percentage of white Americans the opinions of the Klan represent. The question-and-answer here seems to be merely for rhetorical effect, and after Garvey notes that once again Clarke claimed to speak for all whites, he states: “Mr. Clark [sic] did not tell me anything new; he told me what I discovered seven years ago. He told me the thing that caused me to have organized the Universal Negro Improvement Association four and a half years ago.”8 That “thing” was a deep belief that humans are inherently racist. In the second volume of Philosophy and Opinions of Marcus Garvey, first published three years after his meeting with Clarke, he writes that racial “self-preservation […] naturally is the first law of nature [….] What must the Negro do in the face of such a universal attitude but to align all his forces in the direction of protecting himself from the threatened disaster of race domination and ultimate extermination? [my emphasis]”9

The Spark | REL355 FA07 | Johnson

Wait, did I just read Marcus Garvey was a klansman c'mon son that is not what I got from reading that.

This is why I can't get down w/ extremest reviews man, all that hate/love will make u align yourself w/ the devil. He should've worked w/ the NAACP which was the bigger organization w/ more support to further advance Black people in here in America. That would've most definitely resulted in a trickle down effect sooner. Instead he unsuccessfully put his ideologies 1st and helped stunt our growth in the process. Hell, I can't even honestly say that I wouldn't burn down a Klan lodge if I came across one. Let alone align myself w/ one. Hell no.

 

[Present]

I read he joined the Klan, in my haste I missed 'up' which is very different than he joined. Just an error on my part no strawman here.

Yeah I coulda been more clear too.

Joined up meaning partnered with, collaborated, shared similar interests.

Pardon the confusion.

 

[Present]

This is why I can't get down w/ extremest reviews man, all that hate/love will make u align yourself w/ the devil. He should've worked w/ the NAACP which was the bigger organization w/ more support to further advance Black people in here in America. That would've most definitely resulted in a trickle down effect sooner. Instead he unsuccessfully put his ideologies 1st and helped stunt our growth in the process. Hell, I can't even honestly say that I wouldn't burn down a Klan lodge if I came across one. Let alone align myself w/ one. Hell no.

Relationship with W.E.B. Du Bois
Garvey clashed with prominent African-American leaders of the day, including W.E.B. Du Bois. Among his criticisms, Du Bois denounced Garvey for meeting with Ku Klux Klan (KKK) members in Atlanta. At this meeting, Garvey told the KKK that their goals were compatible. Like the KKK, Garvey said, he rejected miscegenation and the idea of social equality. Blacks in America needed to forge their own destiny, according to Garvey. Ideas like these horrified Du Bois, who called Garvey "the most dangerous enemy of the Negro Race in America and in the world" in a May 1924 issue of The Crisis.

Marcus Garvey and Embracing African Heritage

This Marcus Garvey biography defines the radical views he popularized after founding the UNIA urging Blacks to embrace their African heritage.

www.thoughtco.com

 

[Present]

P Present what is your position?

"I belive in solidarity first and foremost of all descendents of Sub-Saharan Africa and the diaspora first and foremost. "

I already agree with you bro!

Pardon my posts but I beleive facts matter.

Thats why I supply links and such.

People are complex and history is full of people!

 

[layziegunts]

double post

 

[marikomorose]

Where did I say "Marcus Garvey was a klansman"?

Straw man is one type of logical fallacy. Straw man occurs when someone argues that a person holds a view that is actually not what the other person believes. Instead, it is a distorted version of what the person believes.

By exaggerating, misrepresenting, or just completely fabricating someone's argument, it's much easier to present your own position as being reasonable, but this kind of dishonesty serves to undermine honest rational debate.

layziegunts You really should stop doing this for your own good honestly. Its's manipulative and it'll make people not wanna deal w/ you.

 

[Present]

This is why I can't get down w/ extremest reviews man, all that hate/love will make u align yourself w/ the devil. He should've worked w/ the NAACP which was the bigger organization w/ more support to further advance Black people in here in America. That would've most definitely resulted in a trickle down effect sooner. Instead he unsuccessfully put his ideologies 1st and helped stunt our growth in the process. Hell, I can't even honestly say that I wouldn't burn down a Klan lodge if I came across one. Let alone align myself w/ one. Hell no.

Garvey was Jamaican - that fact obviously mattered. His cultural experience wasnt in the South.

Had it been, personally beleive he would have known better than to even meet with the KKK.

This is the bases of my POV.

We all dont share the same cultural experiences even though we are all decendants of enslaved Africans.

 

[Grine]

bro, where are you coming from with that argument? I spoke about Shaun King, who I proved is 100% white. Please dont mince my words.

Also, if you got any black in you and you rep blackness you are my brother . ei (Obama, Bob Marley, etc) I dont have any issues with bi-racial black people.

whoooaaa don’t get sensitive ... I was just asking a question, b. .

nothing directing to you...