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It all starts to make sense now.
Delete/Lock...Draft talk over in JPZ's thread....
- Thread in 'Sports & Training' Thread starter Started by doublejs07,
- Start date
It all starts to make sense now.
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Originally Posted by Im Not You
Originally Posted by BangDak
stop with the pyramids please? its making this page look alot longer then it actually is...
and haywood is not garbage like you make him seem. with a HEALTHY agent 0 and haywood inserted back into the starting lineup, that team is straight up
im not from dc, but im pretty sure anyone would rejoice if mcgee could play. who wouldnt want a talented young center to backup their starting center?
I guarantee you if polled everybody in this area who they would want to start RIGHT NOW...McGee would come out on top. Even when he came back at the end of the season people in the stands were mad as hell when he started taking McGee's minutes. He's still raw around the edges but he's already talented enough to start over Haywood. Haywood's a bum...he only got his starting job back when that other bum Etan got hurt.
I'd start Haywood 10 times out of 10 (right now) over McGee. We're a better team when Todd is on the floor. We all know that McGee's potential isunlimited, but let's be real....dude is a "project" in ever sense of the word. Offensively, he doesn't have a clue as to what he'sdoing...and on defense, he makes antawn jamison look like the 2nd coming of bill russell. McGee's time will come...trust that. However, he's one ofthe last guys (on the current) roster I would want STARTING over Todd.
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These guys aren't showcasing their athleticism? Do you know how difficult it is for undersized (with the exception of Ray Ray) SG's tonumerous contested jumpers and hardly ever get blocked? That's pretty impressive to me
im not you
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Personally...at the end of the day I just believe if you give him the same minutes right now as Haywood has gotten as a starter...he'll give you the samenumbers and this is with him being as raw as he is. Peep the games he plays at least 20 minutes...and compare this to Haywoods career output
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/4480/gamelog;_ylt=A2KIRzOpLyhKTS4AbArdPaB4
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/4480/gamelog;_ylt=A2KIRzOpLyhKTS4AbArdPaB4
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Regarding the Raptors:
We had DeMar DeRozan going to Toronto with the ninth pick in our latest mock draft.
Don't expect him to slip past there. League sources say the Raptors have let DeRozan know that if he's there at nine they're taking him.
Source
We've learned that the Knicks have Holiday and Curry ahead of Evans, because they feel that they are more suited at the point guard position, but theMemphis product will work out for the Knicks as well as the Kings, Wizards and Raptors with Toronto keeping their fingers crossed that he falls to 9. No chancehe gets past the Raptors, who have all but guaranteed Evans' camp.
Source
We had DeMar DeRozan going to Toronto with the ninth pick in our latest mock draft.
Don't expect him to slip past there. League sources say the Raptors have let DeRozan know that if he's there at nine they're taking him.
Source
We've learned that the Knicks have Holiday and Curry ahead of Evans, because they feel that they are more suited at the point guard position, but theMemphis product will work out for the Knicks as well as the Kings, Wizards and Raptors with Toronto keeping their fingers crossed that he falls to 9. No chancehe gets past the Raptors, who have all but guaranteed Evans' camp.
Source
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Buy beware:
On the downside, Pittsburgh's DeJuan Blair has to be bummed. Blair looked solid in the drills and really impressed teams with his weight loss and tone.He also measured short, but his wingspan, standing reach and his athletic abilities made up for much of it.
However, the news became much grimmer for Blair when the results of the medical testing came back. Multiple NBA teams are saying Blair's knees have beenred-flagged.
Blair tore both of his ACLs in high school, and the preliminary word from the physicals is that his knees aren't in great shape.
How bad they are depends on who you talk to, but the range wasn't good. I heard everything from "devastating" to "troubling."
Blair's agent, Happy Walters, doesn't feel words like "devastating" are accurate in describing the report he saw.
.
On the downside, Pittsburgh's DeJuan Blair has to be bummed. Blair looked solid in the drills and really impressed teams with his weight loss and tone.He also measured short, but his wingspan, standing reach and his athletic abilities made up for much of it.
However, the news became much grimmer for Blair when the results of the medical testing came back. Multiple NBA teams are saying Blair's knees have beenred-flagged.
Blair tore both of his ACLs in high school, and the preliminary word from the physicals is that his knees aren't in great shape.
How bad they are depends on who you talk to, but the range wasn't good. I heard everything from "devastating" to "troubling."
Blair's agent, Happy Walters, doesn't feel words like "devastating" are accurate in describing the report he saw.
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I'll put it this way...
With McGee on the floor the Wizards are an exciting team to watch....
With Haywood on the floor the Wizards are a better team....
McGee's was really bad. I'm telling you, when he was in the game, it was like the Wizards were playing 4 on 5 on the defensive end of the floor. On a defensively atrocious team in 08-09, McGee was one of the weakest links. He'll figure it out in due time, but he'd be a major downgrade fromHaywood if he was starting.
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this is 100% FACT
and why are the wiz giving up on Nick Young?
Nick Young is a one-trick pony...if he ain't scoring, he isn't doing anything else....
he had a HUGE chance to step up this year with all the injuries and everything else...dude squandered that opportunity.
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he only played 22 minutes a game tho, he needs a HC to be tough with him and tell him to stop that goofy @$*% and he should be fine.
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Props to my dude DoubleJs for still being able to stomach the Wizards last year
I would be able to give insightful analysis about last season like that, but after the first 15 games or so I couldn't bear to watch it any more.
I would be able to give insightful analysis about last season like that, but after the first 15 games or so I couldn't bear to watch it any more.
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so wait, the raptors guaranteed their spot to 2 diff playuers. Watch em not draft either.
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Nothing is a guarantee.
Harden
Tyreke
Derozan
Thats his draft board anything after that is up in the air.
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im not continuing our prior discussion, just adding this to the thread because I think its noteworthy
http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draf...ry?columnist=ford_chad&page=DraftWatch-090604
http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draf...ry?columnist=ford_chad&page=DraftWatch-090604
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I still say put in the tape and watch the game... This same thing happens with the NFL, where guys go and workout well, and what you've seen for 3 and 4years on the court gets brushed over... There's a reason people didn't/don't think Tyler Hansbrough is an NBA caliber athlete... And it'sbecause those test results don't translate to the court when he's banging with guys in traffic...
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I promised to keep the thread on the entire draft, id stop posting in regards to Tyler and comparisons. If he gets drafted in the top 30 of the NBA draft, idsay one of those teams DOES consider him an NBA caliber athlete.
id say this though, just watch his career without preconceived notions and see if he proves you wrong or not.
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What's this rumored deal going around about Memphis trading Jaric and no.2 pick for Martin and no.4 pick? With that assumption, it would mean Memphis wouldbe moving OJ to the point. From the Kings standpoint, they would be building around Rubio, Thompson and Hawes. Moving Martin for Jaric saves them almost $7million over the next 2 seasons and then $25 million in 2011-2012 when they would be able to be free agent players and take on salary again.
I don't know how true this rumor is, but its coming from the Kings side. I just heard about it though. IMO, this still wouldn't fix the Grizz PFproblem and how well would OJ and Rudy be able to adjust having a scoring SG like Martin on the perimeter? OJ would probably have an easier time adjusting thanRudy.
I don't know how true this rumor is, but its coming from the Kings side. I just heard about it though. IMO, this still wouldn't fix the Grizz PFproblem and how well would OJ and Rudy be able to adjust having a scoring SG like Martin on the perimeter? OJ would probably have an easier time adjusting thanRudy.
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I still find it unfair that Jaric gets to get paid to play basketball AND have a smokin hot wife
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Would the Grizzlies still be under the cap if they took Martin's contract? I like that Martin would bring perimeter shooting and doesn'tneed to dominate the ball to score, but I don't know if Martin, Mayo and Gay could work. That's unless they're shopping Gay for a PF
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Maybe they're gonna trade conley + the 4 for a PF
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Originally Posted by I NaSmatic I
Would the Grizzlies still be under the cap if they took Martin's contract? I like that Martin would bring perimeter shooting and doesn't need to dominate the ball to score, but I don't know if Martin, Mayo and Gay could work. That's unless they're shopping Gay for a PF.
Yea. Martin only makes 46 mil in the next 4 years. He's making 10 mil next season and it increases to 11,12,12.9 in the 3 years after that. If Memphishands over Jaric to them that would be 6 something. So, Memphis would only lose like 4 mil of the 15-20 mil capspace they would have this off-season. So, theywould still be in pretty good shape.
Maybe they're gonna trade conley + the 4 for a PF
I was thinking that too, but Memphis would have to keep Conley for a 3-guard rotation of OJ/Conley/Martin. If OJ were to come over to the PG slot,he would probably be turnover prone along with Martin. Keeping Conley might be the best option, but that team offensively would be. I just don't see Sacramento just doing a deal so simple likethat for Martin. I would think Memphis would have to add Darko's expiring and/or 27th pick as well.
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That would be another bad move by the Kings.
Who would Memphis take with the 4th pick then, Jordan Hill? Otherwise they would have to trade it.
Who would Memphis take with the 4th pick then, Jordan Hill? Otherwise they would have to trade it.
im not you
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Darrell Arthur > Jordan Hill
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The results of the strength and agility testing rippled through the league Wednesday, along with some interesting and distressing findings from the medicalportion of the testing that are creating some interesting draft-stock fluctuations.
Here's the latest:
• For all of you who wrote me all season furious that I didn't have Tyler Hansbrough in my mock draftlottery … now's the time to yell, "I told you so!"
I think it's time to declare Hansbrough the big winner of the 2009 NBA draft combine. Although he was what you would expect him to be in the skillsportion of the combine, he came out better than expected in the measurements and strength and agility testing.
Hansbrough measured a legit 6-foot-8¼ in socks and 6-9½ in shoes. He also had a surprising 6-11½ wingspan and a standing reach of 8-10 -- one inch betterthan Blake Griffin.
He basically measured the same size as Kevin Love,Drew Gooden, Paul Millsap and David Lee.
But that's just half the tale.
His vertical-jump numbers weren't terrible, either. At 34 inches, he matches up with the combine scores of Emeka Okafor, LaMarcus Aldridge and Nene. And better than Chris Bosh.
His no-step vertical was a little more troubling at just 27½ inches, but that equaled or bettered Carlos Boozer, Aldridge and Charlie Villanueva.
Lateral quickness? His 11.12-second score was stellar for a big man. He bested Tyreke Evans, http://insider.espn.go.com/nbadraft/draft/tracker/player?draftyear=2009&playerId=19262DeMar DeRozan, http://insider.espn.go.com/nbadraft/draft/tracker/player?draftyear=2009&playerId=19309James Johnson and http://insider.espn.go.com/nbadraft/draft/tracker/player?draftyear=2009&playerId=19050Earl Clark from this draft class.And he also was better than http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=1727Amare Stoudemire, Bosh andTyrus Thomas.
And his 3.23 three-quarter-court sprint? Another strong score for a big man. His numbers were better than Griffin, http://insider.espn.go.com/nbadraft/draft/tracker/player?draftyear=2009&playerId=19174Jordan Hill and Michael Beasley.
In fact, if you want a good physical and athletic comparison to Hansbrough, try Beasley, the No. 2 pick in the draft last year. They are within an inch anda few half seconds of each other in virtually every category.
What does all this mean? We already know Hansbrough is a terrific basketball player. There was never a question about what he does on the court. The concernwas always about his lack of size and athleticism.
Now that he has physically proved he's a solid NBA-caliber athlete, will the objections to drafting him in the lottery start to fade?
Some early signs point to yes. I think a number of teams, including the Bucks, Nets and Pacers, will all give Hansbrough a closer look.
"I think we have to re-evaluate him," one lottery-team GM told me. "You get used to seeing a guy through a certain set of glasses. Thisforces you to rethink and ask yourself whether you misjudged him. I think if you need a big, you have to consider him."
• On the downside, Pittsburgh's http://insider.espn.go.com/nbadraft/draft/tracker/player?draftyear=2009&playerId=19230DeJuan Blair has to be bummed.Blair looked solid in the drills and really impressed teams with his weight loss and tone. He also measured short, but his wingspan, standing reach andathletic abilities made up for much of it.
However, the news became much grimmer for Blair when the results of the medical testing came back. Multiple NBA teams are saying Blair's knees have beenred-flagged.
Blair tore both of his ACLs in high school, and the preliminary word from the physicals is that his knees aren't in great shape.
How bad they are depends on who you talk to, but the range wasn't good. I heard everything from "devastating" to "troubling."
Blair's agent, Happy Walters, doesn't feel that words like "devastating" are accurate in describing the report he saw.
"From what I saw, it's not that bad," Walters told Insider. "People tend to get overexcited about this. Some teams will make a big adoabout it and draft him anyway. It's all a game. Some teams want him to slide.
"He had ACL problems in high school. Everyone knew that. He's never missed a game in college from his knees. It hasn't affected his play atall. We'll look further into it. We'll check it out and have other specialists look at it, too. But it's something you can't do anything about.We're not hiding anything."
Whether the concern ends up being a small or large factor in Blair's draft stock, it's a shame when you consider the momentum he has had since theseason ended. With so few bigs in the draft, he was looking at being a potential late lottery pick. That now seems less likely. Although being red-flaggedisn't necessarily a death knell to your draft stock (remember all the concerns about Greg Oden two years ago), it could deter a team in the lotteryfrom taking the risk.
Blair already had one workout in Phoenix before the NBA draft combine. He heads to Oklahoma City on Friday, Sacramento on Saturday, Detroit on Monday,Milwaukee on Wednesday, Chicago on Thursday and Charlotte next Friday for individual workouts.
• Blair wasn't the only one about whom concerns were raised. UNC's Ty Lawson has a toe injury thatteams are concerned about, though not to the level of Blair's injury. Missouri's DeMarre Carroll, who missed thedraft combine and the workouts in Golden State and Minnesota with an injury, also was red-flagged.
• The blowback on BrandonJennings' decision to skip the Reebok Eurocamp in Italy has been pretty hard. A number of teams in the lottery told me they felt as though theydidn't know him well enough to draft him that high.
Jennings obviously is trying to alleviate those concerns by scheduling a number of private workouts with teams everywhere from the early lottery to the latelottery. Will it be enough?
"I really felt like the kid needed to go out and play some competitive basketball to put him over the top," one GM said. "We booked a ticketto Treviso to give him the chance to do it. I'm not sure I can learn everything I need to in a workout setting. I felt he needed more. Others maydisagree."
At least one GM does.
"I don't understand how Jrue Holiday can be shooting up the boards and Jennings is slipping," another GM said. "Both guys were really highly regardedout of high school. Jennings had an up-and-down year. So did Holiday. As far as upside goes, I think he has as much as Ricky Rubio. People are worried,but he's going to go high."
• We had DeMar DeRozan going to Toronto with the ninth pick in our latest mockdraft.
Don't expect him to slip past there. League sources say the Raptors have let DeRozan know that if he's there at No. 9, they'll take him.
The question is, will he be there? The Wolves or Knicks could snatch him up before he falls to nine.
• Most GMs are preoccupied with large group workouts in both Golden State and Minnesota right now.
Most of the players have shown up to both locations with team personnel spread between both sites.
These workouts are more competitive than the combine drills we saw in Chicago. Players can go head-to-head, something elite players shy away from.
Although the top two tiers of talent aren't at the workouts, a number of promising first-round prospects are: Eric Maynor, Jeff Teague, Austin Daye, B.J. Mullens,Chase Budinger, Darren Collison, Gani Lawal, DaJuan Summers, Wayne Ellington, Damion James, Derrick Brown, Omri Casspi, Jeff Pendergraph, A.J. Price, Marcus Thornton, Greivis Vasquez, Paul Harris, Jodie Meeks, Josh Heytvelt, Patrick Beverley, Danny Green and Luke Harangody.
I've talked to a number of people about the workouts, and the response hasn't been really hot or cold on anyone. But here are a few tidbits ofinterest.
Wake Forest's Teague was injured early in his workout Wednesday in Minnesota. The injury was bad enough for him to pull from the rest of the workout.Still trying to get details of its severity, but it sounds like a sprained MCL.
UConn's Price got some love from a number of teams that thought he matched up well in workouts against Collison in Minnesota. He didn't stand out inthe combine, but he apparently shot the ball really well in the workouts and handled Collison fine.
Israel's Casspi also showed much better in workouts than he did in the drills. "He's the type of player who gets 10 times better whenthere's real competition," one GM said.
Notre Dame's Harangody continues to shoot the lights out and show off his slimmed-down physique, but teams are still trying to figure out which positionhe could guard in the league.
France's Nando DeColo earned some buzz in his workout as a potential second-round sleeper. "When you see him compared to some of the top college talent, hereally looked like he belonged," one NBA scout told me.
The shine on Gonzaga's Daye seems to be wearing off a bit. Daye received pessimistic reports from teams at both sites. "He looked fabulous in theone-on-none session in Chicago," one GM said. "He wasn't so hot against competition."
Speaking of Gonzaga, several GMs were ranting about big man Heytvelt. "He looked completely disinterested," one GM said. "He was awful. Hehad his teammates urging him to compete harder. It was weird."
Here's the latest:
Hansbrough
• For all of you who wrote me all season furious that I didn't have Tyler Hansbrough in my mock draftlottery … now's the time to yell, "I told you so!"
I think it's time to declare Hansbrough the big winner of the 2009 NBA draft combine. Although he was what you would expect him to be in the skillsportion of the combine, he came out better than expected in the measurements and strength and agility testing.
Hansbrough measured a legit 6-foot-8¼ in socks and 6-9½ in shoes. He also had a surprising 6-11½ wingspan and a standing reach of 8-10 -- one inch betterthan Blake Griffin.
He basically measured the same size as Kevin Love,Drew Gooden, Paul Millsap and David Lee.
But that's just half the tale.
His vertical-jump numbers weren't terrible, either. At 34 inches, he matches up with the combine scores of Emeka Okafor, LaMarcus Aldridge and Nene. And better than Chris Bosh.
His no-step vertical was a little more troubling at just 27½ inches, but that equaled or bettered Carlos Boozer, Aldridge and Charlie Villanueva.
Lateral quickness? His 11.12-second score was stellar for a big man. He bested Tyreke Evans, http://insider.espn.go.com/nbadraft/draft/tracker/player?draftyear=2009&playerId=19262DeMar DeRozan, http://insider.espn.go.com/nbadraft/draft/tracker/player?draftyear=2009&playerId=19309James Johnson and http://insider.espn.go.com/nbadraft/draft/tracker/player?draftyear=2009&playerId=19050Earl Clark from this draft class.And he also was better than http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=1727Amare Stoudemire, Bosh andTyrus Thomas.
And his 3.23 three-quarter-court sprint? Another strong score for a big man. His numbers were better than Griffin, http://insider.espn.go.com/nbadraft/draft/tracker/player?draftyear=2009&playerId=19174Jordan Hill and Michael Beasley.
In fact, if you want a good physical and athletic comparison to Hansbrough, try Beasley, the No. 2 pick in the draft last year. They are within an inch anda few half seconds of each other in virtually every category.
What does all this mean? We already know Hansbrough is a terrific basketball player. There was never a question about what he does on the court. The concernwas always about his lack of size and athleticism.
Now that he has physically proved he's a solid NBA-caliber athlete, will the objections to drafting him in the lottery start to fade?
Some early signs point to yes. I think a number of teams, including the Bucks, Nets and Pacers, will all give Hansbrough a closer look.
"I think we have to re-evaluate him," one lottery-team GM told me. "You get used to seeing a guy through a certain set of glasses. Thisforces you to rethink and ask yourself whether you misjudged him. I think if you need a big, you have to consider him."
Blair
• On the downside, Pittsburgh's http://insider.espn.go.com/nbadraft/draft/tracker/player?draftyear=2009&playerId=19230DeJuan Blair has to be bummed.Blair looked solid in the drills and really impressed teams with his weight loss and tone. He also measured short, but his wingspan, standing reach andathletic abilities made up for much of it.
However, the news became much grimmer for Blair when the results of the medical testing came back. Multiple NBA teams are saying Blair's knees have beenred-flagged.
Blair tore both of his ACLs in high school, and the preliminary word from the physicals is that his knees aren't in great shape.
How bad they are depends on who you talk to, but the range wasn't good. I heard everything from "devastating" to "troubling."
Blair's agent, Happy Walters, doesn't feel that words like "devastating" are accurate in describing the report he saw.
"From what I saw, it's not that bad," Walters told Insider. "People tend to get overexcited about this. Some teams will make a big adoabout it and draft him anyway. It's all a game. Some teams want him to slide.
"He had ACL problems in high school. Everyone knew that. He's never missed a game in college from his knees. It hasn't affected his play atall. We'll look further into it. We'll check it out and have other specialists look at it, too. But it's something you can't do anything about.We're not hiding anything."
Whether the concern ends up being a small or large factor in Blair's draft stock, it's a shame when you consider the momentum he has had since theseason ended. With so few bigs in the draft, he was looking at being a potential late lottery pick. That now seems less likely. Although being red-flaggedisn't necessarily a death knell to your draft stock (remember all the concerns about Greg Oden two years ago), it could deter a team in the lotteryfrom taking the risk.
Blair already had one workout in Phoenix before the NBA draft combine. He heads to Oklahoma City on Friday, Sacramento on Saturday, Detroit on Monday,Milwaukee on Wednesday, Chicago on Thursday and Charlotte next Friday for individual workouts.
Lawson
• Blair wasn't the only one about whom concerns were raised. UNC's Ty Lawson has a toe injury thatteams are concerned about, though not to the level of Blair's injury. Missouri's DeMarre Carroll, who missed thedraft combine and the workouts in Golden State and Minnesota with an injury, also was red-flagged.
• The blowback on BrandonJennings' decision to skip the Reebok Eurocamp in Italy has been pretty hard. A number of teams in the lottery told me they felt as though theydidn't know him well enough to draft him that high.
Jennings obviously is trying to alleviate those concerns by scheduling a number of private workouts with teams everywhere from the early lottery to the latelottery. Will it be enough?
"I really felt like the kid needed to go out and play some competitive basketball to put him over the top," one GM said. "We booked a ticketto Treviso to give him the chance to do it. I'm not sure I can learn everything I need to in a workout setting. I felt he needed more. Others maydisagree."
At least one GM does.
"I don't understand how Jrue Holiday can be shooting up the boards and Jennings is slipping," another GM said. "Both guys were really highly regardedout of high school. Jennings had an up-and-down year. So did Holiday. As far as upside goes, I think he has as much as Ricky Rubio. People are worried,but he's going to go high."
DeRozan
• We had DeMar DeRozan going to Toronto with the ninth pick in our latest mockdraft.
Don't expect him to slip past there. League sources say the Raptors have let DeRozan know that if he's there at No. 9, they'll take him.
The question is, will he be there? The Wolves or Knicks could snatch him up before he falls to nine.
• Most GMs are preoccupied with large group workouts in both Golden State and Minnesota right now.
Most of the players have shown up to both locations with team personnel spread between both sites.
These workouts are more competitive than the combine drills we saw in Chicago. Players can go head-to-head, something elite players shy away from.
Although the top two tiers of talent aren't at the workouts, a number of promising first-round prospects are: Eric Maynor, Jeff Teague, Austin Daye, B.J. Mullens,Chase Budinger, Darren Collison, Gani Lawal, DaJuan Summers, Wayne Ellington, Damion James, Derrick Brown, Omri Casspi, Jeff Pendergraph, A.J. Price, Marcus Thornton, Greivis Vasquez, Paul Harris, Jodie Meeks, Josh Heytvelt, Patrick Beverley, Danny Green and Luke Harangody.
I've talked to a number of people about the workouts, and the response hasn't been really hot or cold on anyone. But here are a few tidbits ofinterest.
Wake Forest's Teague was injured early in his workout Wednesday in Minnesota. The injury was bad enough for him to pull from the rest of the workout.Still trying to get details of its severity, but it sounds like a sprained MCL.
UConn's Price got some love from a number of teams that thought he matched up well in workouts against Collison in Minnesota. He didn't stand out inthe combine, but he apparently shot the ball really well in the workouts and handled Collison fine.
Israel's Casspi also showed much better in workouts than he did in the drills. "He's the type of player who gets 10 times better whenthere's real competition," one GM said.
Notre Dame's Harangody continues to shoot the lights out and show off his slimmed-down physique, but teams are still trying to figure out which positionhe could guard in the league.
France's Nando DeColo earned some buzz in his workout as a potential second-round sleeper. "When you see him compared to some of the top college talent, hereally looked like he belonged," one NBA scout told me.
The shine on Gonzaga's Daye seems to be wearing off a bit. Daye received pessimistic reports from teams at both sites. "He looked fabulous in theone-on-none session in Chicago," one GM said. "He wasn't so hot against competition."
Speaking of Gonzaga, several GMs were ranting about big man Heytvelt. "He looked completely disinterested," one GM said. "He was awful. Hehad his teammates urging him to compete harder. It was weird."
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