- Nov 24, 2009
- 53,525
- 21,113
I haven’t seen someone reading a newspaper on the train in over a decade.
Hide Ya Wives, Hide Ya Kids: Worldwide Coronavirus Pandemic!
- Oct 14, 2008
- 13,939
- 13,403
- Mar 30, 2007
- 151,279
- 202,738
yungxcve
formerly yungc330ci
- Nov 30, 2003
- 593
- 1,032
The Strongest Evidence Yet That an Animal Started the Pandemic
A new analysis of genetic samples from China appears to link the pandemic’s origin to raccoon dogs.
Looks like the origins/genetic sequencing of COVID were traced to raccoon dogs being illegally sold at the wet market.
Nike Jordan
Supporter
- Jun 27, 2002
- 34,011
- 81,471
- Aug 2, 2006
- 34,215
- 29,546
Zoonotic transmission theory responds, series tied 3-3.
- Jul 20, 2009
- 64,968
- 196,213
All things considered, zoonotic transmission has been ahead
It is just funny that all the dudes that wanted to take victory laps after the FBI and DOE news are nowhere to be found on this one
Funny how that works
It is just funny that all the dudes that wanted to take victory laps after the FBI and DOE news are nowhere to be found on this one
Funny how that works
- Apr 30, 2010
- 69,729
- 106,420
What benefit does one have salivating over one possible cause vs the other though? I just want the true source.
elpablo21
Supporter
- Feb 11, 2008
- 106,545
- 196,255
I didn't even know racoon dogs was a thing and to add getting flipped like NFTs
- Nov 8, 2013
- 733
- 460
All this spit about the source seems like wasted effort to me. I’m curious about the true source so that we can act and mitigate future issues/pandemics.
But if that’s not gonna happen, all this speculation is spinning in circles. That being said, if the two credible theories are zoonosis or lab leak, it sounds like we know what we need to act on for prevention.
In real life news, I rolled into a coffee shop without a mask and some dude coughed and sneezed. I immediately wanted to dip. While waiting for my coffee, I was thinking about the ever present vigilance and risk tolerance/calculation and I just felt tired. Masks still seem easier to me. Where are y’all’s heads at?
But if that’s not gonna happen, all this speculation is spinning in circles. That being said, if the two credible theories are zoonosis or lab leak, it sounds like we know what we need to act on for prevention.
In real life news, I rolled into a coffee shop without a mask and some dude coughed and sneezed. I immediately wanted to dip. While waiting for my coffee, I was thinking about the ever present vigilance and risk tolerance/calculation and I just felt tired. Masks still seem easier to me. Where are y’all’s heads at?
- Jan 16, 2011
- 15,009
- 36,451
This.
We've known how to handle natural viral jumps from animal to human for a quite a bit. We also don't need to know that COVID escaped from a lab to know that China has not been forthcoming with the results of their investigations on the pandemic. That should be enough to make its international partners recalibrate how they approach sensitive research with them.
Those who absolutely need the source of covid to be the lab leak have another axe to grind and, let's say it, conspirational motivations.
Nike Jordan
Supporter
- Jun 27, 2002
- 34,011
- 81,471
They're common in East Asia, but they're now in parts of Europe.
Nike Jordan
Supporter
- Jun 27, 2002
- 34,011
- 81,471
- Apr 30, 2010
- 69,729
- 106,420
Learning what a raccoon dog is they look hard, makes me want one but I definitely don't want one now.
- Aug 2, 2006
- 34,215
- 29,546
Uhm...It killed millions of people.
I think it's totally reasonable to want to know exactly how it happened.
And it certainly has implications for how these labs, "virus hunters" and gain function research should be regulated in the future.
- Aug 2, 2006
- 34,215
- 29,546
Id prob still put it at 50 / 50 now pending further analysis of this racoon dog data.
This data doesn't seem all that definitive either. In other articles I've read, they say it's still possible a human brought it to the racoon.
- Mar 19, 2013
- 16,232
- 32,797
Who knew....
- Jul 20, 2009
- 64,968
- 196,213
On aggregate, it seems to me that more things point to natural transmission than not.
To be honest, I don't really care either way.
The lab leak theory will never probably be proven unless some major happens in the intelligence world. This is more about doubt of natural transmission.
But there is same segment of people are really invested in it being true for no reason other than feeling superior or act like there were some can of victims of mob pressure.
People that Nate Silver got his Twitter finger booming with smug post.
On NT a whole damn thread was created for some dudes to act like they were vindicated because of the Department of Energy updating their position and position and the FBI repeating theirs from a year ago.
Acting like they are interested in it because they are mad at the Chinese government, when no matter what, their is enough reason to be mad at them.
Same dudes that wanted to entertain **** like 5G being being an issue, and whatever right wing conspiracy theory that was floating around. Then clutch their pearls when people dare push back. Especially if it was Meth.
When Biden first ordered government agencies to look into this, I said people should be open to either conclusion. But it is clear that the reactions to updating evidence is not equal.
- Aug 2, 2006
- 34,215
- 29,546
it's certainly is a casualty of the culture war.
id like to know, but i guess I don't "care" because im not emotionally invested in it.
my main issue is given the invention of MRNA technology it makes this practice of "virus hunting" seem totally indefensible.
and even more so, if covid leaked from a lab.
but tbh i'd probably think that regardless of zoonotic or lab leak origin.
but Id still like to know, and people should try to find, but well probably never know for sure.
- Aug 23, 2019
- 4,735
- 13,006
With each finding like this the lab leak hypothesis becomes ever less plausible. It was already a huge stretch to imagine how the virus jumped 8 miles from lab to market before infecting anyone. But now we know it infected a raccoon dog
Maybe the raccoon dog caught it from humans but from what I understand human to dog transmission is not easy and usually happens when people are in close contact with the animal for an extended time (pets)
I mean it's possible but Occam's Razor says that it's more likely that the dog was infected because it was a carrier of the virus. That it's a raccoon dog is pretty important here. There was a SARS virus isolated in raccoon dogs in Guangdong in 2003
So we have evidence of a likely transmission animal having Covid in the market where we have evidence that the virus was spreading before anywhere else.... lab leak down 3-1 and 20 points going into the 4th
- Feb 2, 2014
- 39,178
- 55,423
because nt lost its identity
pic of the beast in question for the beasts
this is why i don’t mess with nature. they have their home and i have mine. mutual respect of each other’s territory.
pic of the beast in question for the beasts
this is why i don’t mess with nature. they have their home and i have mine. mutual respect of each other’s territory.
- Jul 20, 2009
- 64,968
- 196,213
The most important bit of info I learned from this whole thing is that raccoon dogs exit.
They aren't even raccoons
They are kinda like a fox, but in an Oreo colorway
So basically this...
+
=
They aren't even raccoons
They are kinda like a fox, but in an Oreo colorway
So basically this...
+
=
Last edited:
- Aug 2, 2006
- 34,215
- 29,546
With each finding like this the lab leak hypothesis becomes ever less plausible. It was already a huge stretch to imagine how the virus jumped 8 miles from lab to market before infecting anyone. But now we know it infected a raccoon dog
Maybe the raccoon dog caught it from humans but from what I understand human to dog transmission is not easy and usually happens when people are in close contact with the animal for an extended time (pets)
I mean it's possible but Occam's Razor says that it's more likely that the dog was infected because it was a carrier of the virus. That it's a raccoon dog is pretty important here. There was a SARS virus isolated in raccoon dogs in Guangdong in 2003
So we have evidence of a likely transmission animal having Covid in the market where we have evidence that the virus was spreading before anywhere else.... lab leak down 3-1 and 20 points going into the 4th
Did you read the article, nothing in there is definitive or makes the lab leak implausible?
just seems like exaggerating in the opposite direction.
also this;
the reality is;
Coronavirus outbreak occurring around massive wet market.
Coronavirus outbreak occurring near virus lab with poor security researching coronaviruses.
Occams razor can lead you to either zoonotic or lab leak theory.
and one theory being true makes the other a massive coincidence.
- Jul 20, 2009
- 64,968
- 196,213
I think the reason people are more inclined to believe it occurred naturally is that it happen before
And we know that China didn't take the steps to prevent such a thing from happening again after SARS
That is why even on paper I can't put the odds at 50/50
If those are the two options, it seems to me the conditional probability of it happening naturally is above 50
And we know that China didn't take the steps to prevent such a thing from happening again after SARS
That is why even on paper I can't put the odds at 50/50
If those are the two options, it seems to me the conditional probability of it happening naturally is above 50
- Aug 2, 2006
- 34,215
- 29,546
I would have agreed at the start of the pandemic, that was generally my position from the start
but people have searched and searched and searched for the animal reservoir and have come up empty.
when they were able to trace the origin of SARS CoV2 to a bat virus with 98% genetic match within the year from my understanding.
if after all this time and effort you still can't find an animal reservoir, it makes me lean towards Lab leak
Sars CoV2 came from a bat virus, and this lab is going to remote bat caves to collect bat viruses,
it's on record they have poor security, there are reports of sick employees around that time.
it would be a massive coincidence if it turns out that lab had nothing to do with it.
but to fair
a similar virus to sars cov2 not being of natural origin when there was a massive live animal wet market in the same city.
is also a giant coincidence.
