Jay-Z "Success" Question

[s0lefunk]

Originally Posted by digitalO22

Originally Posted by s0leFUNK

Originally Posted by digitalO22

Originally Posted by HypeBeast McStreetwear

Jay-Z is the greatest BITER alive....and Yes he bit off Eminem....

Jay-Z has been off Biggie, Nas, Eminem, Slick Rick, Rakim, Big Daddy Kane....I mean the list goes on....and countless others...

You would think that Jay-Z would stop when Nas brought this to his attention and jay-z said "When I say a BIG verse, I'm just trying to Big up my Brother"....but it looks like Jay still continues to bite...

Very very sad, if you ask me....that you make a career of biting and consider yourself the "Great Rapper ever" and "Michael Jordan of the Rap Game"

Rakim didn't bite, Nas didn't bite, Pac didn't bite....

But it seems with rappers nowadays biting is that big of a deal...

Its true that Jay-Z has bitten countless rappers but...Anyone in here and I mean ANYONE, tell me one memorable/hip-hop quotable Jay-Z has spit that is bitten. If you take up all of his bitten lines he still has all of his most memorable lines that makes the best rapper to date.

Regardless, biting = lack of creativity. Unless you think he's "shouting out" Eminem on this track.

This was addressed awhile ago when AG first leaked.. but seriously, lets look. Big, Rakim, Em, Big Daddy Kane... does anyone see a pattern here? In case you dont.. LEGENDS. You dont see a Chingy, a Quan, a Lil Flip.. you see every line in question that Jay spit was taken from a legend. Why is it your brains cant process the fact that this man is paying homage? So what Nas or Rakim didnt do it? Rap is an art where one expresses themselves differently.

If I was an OG, I'd feel more flattered if I heard the new generation spittin a line of mine versus them just sayin "Yea, I mess with dude. He a legend". Yall know music is full of sheep. Jay spittin that Em line tells Em that Jay actually listens to his music, REMEMBERS the bars, and cared enough to borrow it because it fit the concept perfectly.

If you dont like Jay, its cool. But dont throw out logic to make weak arguments.

You're right, rap is an art, so if you need other people's material are you really an artist, or just a business maaaaan?

Em and Jay are from the same generation, and if he really wants to flatter him, do it in a form of a paycheck for using rhymes he wrote.


You completely missed my point and brought up another one. The ratio of borrowed lines to 100% Jay is umm, what, 1:100,000?? Yea, thats businessmaaan... like Jay really was stuck at 14 bars so he went crate diggin to complete a verse.

Come on now. If son was the biter yall claim, why hasnt he jacked straight verses? Insteadof wasting time "writing" and releasing an album every year, why not release a B.I.G. - Ready to Die (The Jay-Z Edition) and make a killin? Its knownJay borrows lines and is still a powerseller. Its business right? So why not cut your effort to a mere fraction and quadruple your income since his salesobviously show that the music fans, "dont mind".

According to yall, dude is SOO incapable of makin his own music that he needs others work so why is it that he stops at a bar or two... every now and then...?

And to yall still stuck on why he gotta "bite" period.. its music, he shouts out MCs by usin their lines. Its no different from sayin "Shoutoutto my man ____" at the end of the track..

It should be 0% it doesn't make sense AT ALL for rappers to straight jack another rapper's lines when you're good enough or better than the rapper. It shows a insane amount of no originality when he does it no creativity like you can't express what you wanna say in other words or something when we all kno Ol Man Jigga is better than that. I mean what if Mary J. Blige went around singing India Arie's Video or Erykah Badu's Bag Lady claiming she wrote it? "Ohhh nawww Mary just paying homage"

So when does art have regulations now?? And would the tracks he borrowed lines in be unlistenable if he used a different bar? You're sayinlike a 10th of Jay's catalouge is two bars away from bein unlistenable.. And singers cover older generation music that were popularALL THE TIME and you know that. And see "What More Can I Say" for the rest..

I don't think Jay "bites" with the intent of wanting others to think he wrote the line, but I think he assumes people know hip-hop's history and already know these lines.
You think what everyone knows but what some just refuse to accept.

 

[firered18]

"Get ya weight up/ Not ya hate up, Jiggaman is Diesel when I lift the 8 up"
word to....

That wasn't bitten

 

[jawnyquest]

nothing wrong with recycling..

 

[true 3 blue]

biting or not (which all rappers do), he has tons of lines better than those.

 

[dj236]

all of the bitten lines in hov's career add up to about >>1% of all his work..AT BEST

but real talk u cant exactly defend jay when he bites lines, it's never a cool thing to do so. BUT it isn't something that holds him from some type ofpedestal of being one of the GOATS. It would be dumb if anyone on here thinks of jay first as a, "notorious biter that makes him what he is today"when none of what he has bitten hasn't defined anything that he has done whatsoever.

think of the hottest jay songs you know and look to see if anything that is bitten..if so, and we all kno they have a chance of containing a bitten line, pullback and ask if the line(s) are what defined the song..if not then take it for what it is:

-is jay a biter (at times)???: that is a resounding yes
-but is that what makes him great??: that is a resounding no..hell no to be exact

 

[nolandw]

i'm actually writing a final paper on jay's biting...due the 20th.

 

[ak nako]

Name an artist who hasn't borrowed and I'll either call you uninformed, or a fool.

 

[po2345]

....Who didn't know this....
Where were you in the official thread?!?....It's not like it wasn't acknowledged in there...

PO

 

[mickey moss]

Originally Posted by flossb15

Wait a minute wait a minute ...I don't mind the jay-z hate ...but Nas and eminem and Pac have all bitten lines ...

I guess yall to young to understand that though or your hate for jayz is that thick

Case 1 - I am what ever you say I am if I wasn't then why would I say I am - emimen year 2000 - bit off of Rakim

Case 2 - Got yourself a gun same lyric which would be stolen from Rakim

Case 3 - like pun said you not even in mi clasa - nas stole from Big Pun

Case 4 - eminem on +%$#* please 2 - ah nawl big slim dogg eighty pound balls big 6 inch long, back up in the heezy baby he's shady - copied from snoop

Case 5 - Look at the XXL every month to see that every rapper steals and also tally how many have stole from Jayz

1. Fat joe
2. Big pun
3. Lil wayne
4. Jadakiss
5. Remy ma
6. Young chris
7. Beanie sigel
8. Angie martinez
9. Lil kim
10. Jim jones

And I know I'm forgetting ALOT

This was a weak attempt at defending Jay-Z'sbiting ways.

Thats why Nas said ``Like Pun said...You aint even...``....He obviously said Pun...

Eminem was on the song with Snoop Dogg and he said it purposely because Snoop was there...and he didn't bite it line for line...

Jay-Z is a biter...it doesn't matter if he doesn't bite a whole verse...he takes lines and lyrics from other rappers......for a rapper of Jay-Z'scaliber he shouldn't bite at all...because Jay is a legend...

don't even compare Kim, Jim Jones, Fat Joe to Jay-Z's biting...those are mediocre rappers....and Jay is supposed to be great.

Jigga Warriors are out....

``When the Remi's in the system, ain't no tellin
Will I eff em will I diss em, that's what these **** yellin
I'm a pimp by blood, not relation
Y'all still chase on, I'll replace on`` - Notorious BIG ``The World is Filled``

``When the Remi's in the system
Aint no tellin will I eff 'em will I diss 'em
That's what they be yellin..
I'm a pimp by blood, not relation, Y'all be chasin, I replace them`` - Jay-Z (I just wanna love you, give it to me)

^Need I not say that is one of Jay-Z's biggest hits and singles...that@%+! was the hottest song of the year...being played on Z100, KTU, Hot97,etc....andHow you blantatly bite off BIG in that song?...that was such a big hit..being played everywhere...atleast give some money to Mrs. Wallace and Biggie'sdaughter...

``I gotta feed Tiyana man``

yeah ok...

 

[all19mjs]

Originally Posted by PeterJamesThe3rd

yeah jay really gotta stop stealing lyrics...

Listen fam yall think the small lines that JAY-Z I REPEAT JAY-Z take cant replace them with his own bars come on man lets be real

 

[irapthough]

But if you were real hip-hops fans you would know right off the back where the line came from ...
It's not a line from an unknown rapper in which he's trying to hide it from ...

 

[mickey moss]

Originally Posted by all19mjs

Originally Posted by PeterJamesThe3rd

yeah jay really gotta stop stealing lyrics...

Listen fam yall think the small lines that JAY-Z I REPEAT JAY-Z take cant replace them with his own bars come on man lets be real

So why does he bite in the first place...just use fillers from his non writing self

and use all those raps that he keeps in his memory to take the place of thoselines he bites.....Biting is a no-no...especially from Big camel...he knows better...

Nobody is saying what your saying in the first place...is that Biting should not be allowed and a rapper of Jay-Z stature shouldn't be biting....especiallyfrom Eminem...who is younger than him and isn't even Legend status...with that garbage album of Encore in his catalogue...

 

[laced up jordans]

This is the EXACT reason I'll always put BIG and Nas ahead of Jay. He bites off of EVERYONE, its like you hear a dope bar from dude and you search aroundand someone had been said that line. But I gotta admit he is the KING of the double and triple entendre

 

[x Buddha Bless x]

So when does art have regulations now?? And would the tracks he borrowed lines in be unlistenable if he used a different bar? You're sayin like a 10th of Jay's catalouge is two bars away from bein unlistenable.. And singers cover older generation music that were popular ALL THE TIME and you know that. And see "What More Can I Say" for the rest..

So you're fine with all artists just takinganything from other songs with no recognition to the OG? I dont care what you assumed you think Im saying. I never said a 10th of dudes catalog is bitten. Imsaying he shouldnt do it and if he never did it we wouldnt even be having this argument. You do kno covering and biting are two diff things right? Rappers havebeen accused of biting by other rappers in the past. Look at the singers I compared you dont think I know that? The singers I compared ARE NOT FROM AN OLDERGENERATION. Right now you're making arguments for completely other topics. At the end of the day he shouldn't be doing it biting aint justifiable andyou(SHOULD) know that.

 

[hypebeast mcstreetwear]

all of the bitten lines in hov's career add up to about >>1% of all his work..AT BEST

but real talk u cant exactly defend jay when he bites lines, it's never a cool thing to do so. BUT it isn't something that holds him from some type of pedestal of being one of the GOATS. It would be dumb if anyone on here thinks of jay first as a, "notorious biter that makes him what he is today" when none of what he has bitten hasn't defined anything that he has done whatsoever.

think of the hottest jay songs you know and look to see if anything that is bitten..if so, and we all kno they have a chance of containing a bitten line, pull back and ask if the line(s) are what defined the song..if not then take it for what it is:

-is jay a biter (at times)???: that is a resounding yes
-but is that what makes him great??: that is a resounding no..hell no to be exact

thank you...

as I slip a leg into my flame suit and prepare to open Pandora's Box I ask you "Hasn't Hip-Hop stemmed from taking Drum Breaks from other people's songs?" Granted, the ppl most likely knew what songs they were from, its still on the same plane as this discussion. For the record I'm not just defending Jay-Z but ALL the rappers who recycled lines.

 

[x Buddha Bless x]

as I slip a leg into my flame suit and prepare to open Pandora's Box I ask you "Hasn't Hip-Hop stemmed from taking Drum Breaks from other people's songs?" Granted, the ppl most likely knew what songs they were from, its still on the same plane as this discussion. For the record I'm not just defending Jay-Z but ALL the rappers who recycled lines.
My boy made the same argument when defending Jigga for biting. Technically you're right but producers pay the OG artist/label for sampling. Ialso knew this dude doesn't hold the integrity for original lyrics that high. Im not saying all of dudes lyrics are bitten, Im saying it says a lot abouthis originality and creativity or lack there of. Also you can only recycle your own lines like you a radio verse on an album. Spitting lines from other rappersis not recycling it is stealing.

This is not hate for this dude I dont condone any rapper that does it. It just don't make sense to me you're so great yet you take from othersyou're suppose to learn from others. The shh irks me man and this shouldn't be defended cuz its wrong.

 

[true 3 blue]

Ok you have a point, but what about the lines he's made that pretty much go unnoticed (at least in THIS thread)?

 

[nolandw]

all the writers of the world is filled were credited in give it 2 me.

 

[x Buddha Bless x]

^ You know some ppl are stupid and are real hateful haters to not even acknowledge or appreciate his triple entendres. Im not one of those ppl, If its abouthis unnoticed rhymes make a thread I'll drop a few verses from him that I love. Overall some ppl never catch some of his lines like the one at the top ofthis page(Even I didnt catch at 1st) and its lines like that that make me say why this dude would even think about sayin anybody elses lines when he got thatcrack on his own.

My theory is years of not writin shh down is hard. He finally revealed the science behind it in a video interview(something I assumed) and spitting the sameverse over n over in ya head addin on a line from where you finished until its done is HARD. So ppl who were thinking otherwise NO dude does not just spitverses off the top like its nothing he goes in the booth with an idea n when works from there. I dont see da reason to do it I wasn't

over that even when Big said he does that, I tried it myself and it takes a lotof patience. So maybe once in awhile he throws in somebody else's line that he may kno from listening to their music in to one of his joints just toconnect a few bars. It may seem like nothing but even that shouldn't be done if you aint gonna throw some recognition to the artist. Also if he willing tomake it that hard she take time to make up more lines.

 

[hypebeast mcstreetwear]

My boy made the same argument when defending Jigga for biting. Technically you're right but producers pay the OG artist/label for sampling. I also knew this dude doesn't hold the integrity for original lyrics that high. Im not saying all of dudes lyrics are bitten, Im saying it says a lot about his originality and creativity or lack there of. Also you can only recycle your own lines like you a radio verse on an album. Spitting lines from other rappers is not recycling it is stealing.

This is not hate for this dude I dont condone any rapper that does it. It just don't make sense to me you're so great yet you take from others you're suppose to learn from others. The shh irks me man and this shouldn't be defended cuz its wrong.
Yea point taken but personally, I can turn the other cheek when rappers bite lines (to a degree) It depends on the bitten to OG lines ratio. Whenit comes to Jay tho for every bitten line there is like 6 sick%$+% lines.

 

[true 3 blue]

Originally Posted by xBuddha Blessx

^ You know some ppl are stupid and are real hateful haters to not even acknowledge or appreciate his triple entendres. Im not one of those ppl, If its about his unnoticed rhymes make a thread I'll drop a few verses from him that I love. Overall some ppl never catch some of his lines like the one at the top of this page(Even I didnt catch at 1st) and its lines like that that make me say why this dude would even think about sayin anybody elses lines when he got that crack on his own.

My theory is years of not writin shh down is hard. He finally revealed the science behind it in a video interview(something I assumed) and spitting the same verse over n over in ya head addin on a line from where you finished until its done is HARD. So ppl who were thinking otherwise NO dude does not just spit verses off the top like its nothing he goes in the booth with an idea n when works from there. I dont see da reason to do it I wasn't

over that even when Big said he does that, I tried it myself and it takes a lot of patience. So maybe once in awhile he throws in somebody else's line that he may kno from listening to their music in to one of his joints just to connect a few bars. It may seem like nothing but even that shouldn't be done if you aint gonna throw some recognition to the artist. Also if he willing to make it that hard she take time to make up more lines.

true, true i guess even the elite rappers get lazy at times

 

[flatbushfiyah23]

Bottom line is this even if you actually are foolish enough to believe Jay is a biter. The lines Jay has used to pay homage to other rappers (which manyrappers do all the time other than Jay!!) are probably less than two percent of the countless lyrics Jay has spit throughout his career. I mean seriously ifyou are going to cry about 2% of anyones lyrics and call them a biter you seriously need to find better things to do with your time. Its not that serious.

 

[x Buddha Bless x]

Yea point taken but personally, I can turn the other cheek when rappers bite lines (to a degree) It depends on the bitten to OG lines ratio. When it comes to Jay tho for every bitten line there is like 6 sick%$+% lines.
Im similar and when I think of biting Im not thinking of Jigga, he's not the 1st dude that pops in my head when I think biting. It was justall these Biggie lines from time to time I took as disrespect cuz of ppl tellin me the other way around that its his line and Big took it and then if he doesit to his own peers. But I can name dudes who bite scores of verses, dudes spittin nothing but Pac verses on the daily and its disgusting. I just feel if youlet somebody on Jigga's status get away with it a whole age of new rappers will be doing it and slowly but surely creativity will be completely gone fromhip hop I mean we already spittin about the same topics. Its just that I expect more of him in that aspect.

 

[sunshine734]

Most of the people's lines that he uses have no problem with it and are excited that jay z liked and remembered their stuff well enough to use it again. when he used Bun's line from "Touched" (Ridin Dirty) in 99 problems Bun said he was flattered

 

[littlepetewrigley]

In what song did Eminem say the rhyme that's in question?