Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain | A Hideo Kojima Game

MGS4 is such a blur, especially towards the end for me.

They basically used his body for parts and that's it.

Liquid lived in "Liquid" Ocelot.
 

Solid/BB being protagonists

Solidus being a husk and a meh

But what's your thinking on the question of Snake not even thinking Solidus was Big Boss?

At least initially?

Been pestering me for years that one..
 
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Your answer is simply Kojima over extended himself on the mgs2 story. It's the weakest of any of the games. By far. And it's why I think it was so much easier for him to go back in time.

He ret conned most of it well enough in mgs4. Def did about as good a job as u can expect. but t is what it is
 
DubA169 said:
Your answer is simply Kojima over extended himself on the mgs2 story. It's the weakest of any of the games. By far. And it's why I think it was so much easier for him to go back in time.

He ret conned most of it well enough in mgs4. Def did about as good a job as u can expect. but t is what it is
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What????

The whole switcharoo with Raiden and Snake was brilliant, you got to see the real legend of Solid Snake through basically a fanboy (of which all we are) and really Raiden's own lack of awareness/limited info was not gonna work if had to use Snake. 

The (arguably) best squad of villains in the entire franchise (Dead Cell) which had Fatman, Fortune, Vamp, and then the greatest end boss (imo) Solidus Snake which basically was the Big Boss to Raidens Snake. Since we couldn't really see the relationship between the original two, it was pretty awesome when we saw it through them. Then Ocelot revealing himself to be a double, triple agent (now a staple of the series) and the whole "meme" message, I truly feel it's the best game in the series. MGS3 a close 2nd, the 4th being the worst (Twin Snakes being in contention with it).

I never saw the hate being plausible with MGS2 (mostly stemming from Raiden and the fact we had to play as him after the Tanker Incident).
 
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DubA169 said:
Your answer is simply Kojima over extended himself on the mgs2 story. It's the weakest of any of the games. By far. And it's why I think it was so much easier for him to go back in time.

He ret conned most of it well enough in mgs4. Def did about as good a job as u can expect. but t is what it is
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MGS4 was one big retcon. Which is why many fans consider it to be the weakest.

And really I kinda wanted an in game explanation, sure we can just say Kojima overlooked a small mistake but where's the fun in that?
 
I meant mgs2 had the weakest story. The boss fights in mgs2 are far more memorable than the ones in MGS 4. In fact the bosses in mgs4 were its weakest point probably. Mgs4 was a nice way to solve as many plot holes as possible and bring the game full circle. That's tough to do. I was kinda upset it decided which mgs1 ending was true though

Mgs4 is a giant recon BECAUSE of mgs2. So I fault mgs2 more than mgs4. Mgs4 story had to be a certain way because it had to fix the convoluted mess mgs2 created.

I always felt I didn't get enough info on solidus which pissed me off after thinking about him for so ol g after the 1st


Mgs1 and mgs3 are my favorites by far

I don't think the raided switch was brilliant. It was annoying lol. The relationship in mgs3 was far more interesting. And the big shell was kinda meh for a good amount of it.

it doesn't matter. I'm sure we can agree that the "worst" MGS is better than most of the other stuff out!
 
Whoa whoa whoa. MGS2 was not the worst, that title belongs 4 even though 4 was great in its own right. I loved MGS2
 
You damn right. (To Dub I mean in reference to the fact the crappiest MGS game is still top tier quality)

I mean some of the things MGS4 retconned from MGS2 made things even more confusing and usually the explanation left me unsatisfied.

Like Vamp just being suped up with steroid like nanomachines, yet whenever we saw him near water in MGS2, it either helped him (the tear from Fortune "reviving" him, running on water which no one else in the main franchise, screw Revegeance, can do) or hurt him (falling in the water against Raiden and "dying").

And the fact Liquid taking over Ocelot was just Ocelot "thinking" so hard that he "became" Liquid, nevermind the fact he was stitched up with Liquid's arm and that his pops being The Sorrow he'd inherit some of his more supernatural sense (the leading theory before MGS4). 

But nah, he just thought real hard.

I'm still mad Kojima glossed over PO's story with PW. All that talk of PW being the foundation of Outer Heaven, and nothing really happens to move that along (at least far enough where Kojima was saying it would).

We still got two more games and we're still a bit of time away from OH (1983-1984 being the awake time for BB, 1995 is when SS enters and smashes it up.)
 
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swendro88 said:
I'm really not feeling Kojima dropping Hayter.
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Theory is that he'll be in Ground Zeros but not in Phantom Pain due to the fact voices can change when one's in a coma.

My money (and hope) is on Richard Doyle who voiced BB in MGS4. I liked his style.
 
liquid did actually possess ocelot but only during the tanker incident and then 2 years later at the big shell

remember at the end of the tanker incident you hear liquid speak thru ocelot, then again at the end of the big shell.

also look at his arm. it was the same color as ocelots skin. then in guns of the patriots his arm is blue

then remember how liquid ocelot doesnt speak with liquids voice in mgs 4

then big boss comes in and says ocelot just used hypnotherapy and nanomachines to become liquid, personality wise. i dont think that should have happened. kinda made it wack if you ask me
 
mgs2 caught a lot of fans by surprise with that raiden crossover but 2 was still great in its own way and certainly very memorable. i was honestly disappointed by that weak mission snake has in the beginning and i could beat it in a lil under an hour even but the remainder of the game was still :smokin kojima delivers with each game and with the craziness too. I remember gettin spooked out with that colonel codec calls, and being scared by the vamp scenese :lol: IMO 4 is definitely at the bottom of the list...regardless all of em are still top video games out there though.
 
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TroyD said:
liquid did actually possess ocelot but only during the tanker incident and then 2 years later at the big shell

remember at the end of the tanker incident you hear liquid speak thru ocelot, then again at the end of the big shell.

also look at his arm. it was the same color as ocelots skin. then in guns of the patriots his arm is blue

then remember how liquid ocelot doesnt speak with liquids voice in mgs 4

then big boss comes in and says ocelot just used hypnotherapy and nanomachines to become liquid, personality wise. i dont think that should have happened. kinda made it wack if you ask me
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Yeah, so in essence he basically said that the possession was actually faked and Ocelot only mimicked Liquid's voice.

Whereas you can clearly tell it's not the case when playing the game. That's one of the big problems for me in that MGS4 just casually sweeped everything under the rug with one big explanation.

And they said he threw away Liquid's arm and got the electro shock one before MGS4.

Which to me says that Ocelot was possessed and that's why he got the new arm.
 
Solidus Snake said:
swendro88 said:
I'm really not feeling Kojima dropping Hayter.
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Theory is that he'll be in Ground Zeros but not in Phantom Pain due to the fact voices can change when one's in a coma.

My money (and hope) is on Richard Doyle who voiced BB in MGS4. I liked his style.
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Na, he's gone.

http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1rjhhf9

"On the December break, I came home to Los Angeles for the holidays," he wrote. "I heard then, that recording sessions for MG:V were being put together.

"But I didn't hear anything about whether I'd be needed or not.

"So, I got in touch with someone involved in the production. We got together for lunch, and he told me that they 'wouldn't be needing me' on this game. No reason, or explanation was given beyond that.

"And that was it.

"I drove home through Laurel Canyon, bummed, and thinking about Snake."
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Hayter said he would play Solid Snake forever, "if it were my choice". "To hear anyone else's voice coming from Snake's battered throat, makes me a little ill, to be honest.

"But the truth is - it's not my choice. Any and all casting decisions are the sole purview of Hideo Kojima, and Konami itself. And that's fair.
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http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2...ce-of-solid-snake-waves-goodbye-to-metal-gear

What we're trying to accomplish here is to recreate the Metal Gear series," explained Kojima.

"It's a new type of Metal Gear game and we want to have this reflected in the voice actor as well," he added.

Kojima confirmed that Hayter's role would be recast, but was unable to provide more details.
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http://www.digitalspy.com/gaming/ne...deo-kojima-explains-david-hayter-absence.html

Snake still has the same VA in Japan, btw, so Kojima's explanation is pretty weak.
 
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That's why I'll stick with my theory, Kojima isn't the most truthful game developer (MGS2, MGS3 being SS, Ground Zeros/Joakim Mogren, etc..)

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The arm liquid ocelot thing bothers me much more. No idea why he threw that **** in there. Terrible decision.

Ocelot faking it does make sense in a way. Use liquids inflludence to his advantage. Keep the loyalty of liquids guys. But I just don't think that was the original intention


Kohima basically explained everything away with nano machines haha. Smh


The David hayter situation sucks. No idea what that's about. Kinda depressing.

Not knowing he was president could be explained away from being a recluse in Alaska. A reach but absolutely possible. Not recognizing him as Bb is hard to come up with a theory. Maybe someone on the MGS boards can help u out I hear they are very thorough
 
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I read a thread on there back in 2009 and it had a ton of explanations but I'm not gonna dig through 4000 pages
laugh.gif


But yeah other than throwing it away because Liquid started to become the dominant personality what other reason fits?

I'm telling ya man Hayter will be in , don't let Kojima catch you with the hokie dokie.

I just wanted to see the NT fans opinions on it. Maybe someone blows my mind tomorrow lol.
 
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If Hayter's in it'll be due to fan pressure. This is not another Kojima prank as it stands.
 
Gray Fox is overrated I think.

And were his nose and ears sliced off? The way it's worded sounds strange.
 
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DubA169 said:
I meant mgs2 had the weakest story. The boss fights in mgs2 are far more memorable than the ones in MGS 4. In fact the bosses in mgs4 were its weakest point probably. Mgs4 was a nice way to solve as many plot holes as possible and bring the game full circle. That's tough to do. I was kinda upset it decided which mgs1 ending was true though

it doesn't matter. I'm sure we can agree that the "worst" MGS is better than most of the other stuff out!
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Worst part about 2 was definitely the message and the storytelling style. The "memes" and passing legacy in the digital age was a great point, but half of it was delivered like a damn lecture. It just felt like a heavy mess. Kojima certainly learned and dialed back on that tone in the next two. As for the linear story (the Raiden twist, GW, Big Shell, etc) it wasn't the greatest setup, but nothing to complain about. It was just bogged down.

MGS3 is the best story-wise cause it didn't try too much. It didn't touch on too many heavy-handed deep issues, and the ones it did happened to be personal. So things felt more natural.
 
man mgs without hayter would be kinda weird to me. i'm so used to that voice coming from snake. i can understand if they go with doyle for big boss but hayter is snake! :rolleyes
 
GreyFoxx said:
man mgs without hayter would be kinda weird to me. i'm so used to that voice coming from snake. i can understand if they go with doyle for big boss but hayter is snake! :rolleyes
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Dude, the guy at the end of the trailer is Snake...I guess, right?
 
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