OFFICIAL NBA 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

[100027]

Because why would they not want Ben Simmons playing in the NBA as soon as he can? Or Deandre Ayton? Or Karl Anthony Towns?

That 17-18 year is likely to be developmental for most players, and you are more likely to end up with Jermaine O’Neal situations which hurt teams.

Because a year of NBA development is better than a year of college basketball. Sitting a year on the bench has been better to Ben Simmons than his time at LSU.

I’m in favor of a g league developmental solution but it hurts veterans for high schoolers to be taking roster spots and not playing.

 

[MVP]

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

Are you worth your draft value? If you are going to say I’m not backing up my statement with statistics that’s fine, but I don’t understand how you can’t agree that logically another year to see a player develop from 18-19 is going to make them easier to scout by some amount.

The issue here is that we're framing this like there needs to be 4.5 years of scouting as opposed to 4 years

Obviously the more you see something the better idea you have of what you're seeing

My stance is that there shouldn't be a requirement for an extra 6 months of evaluation, there doesn't need to be

If preps to pros returns, the number of preps drafted who "don't hit" are worth "diluting the talent" IMO. Of course, once again, these are highly subjective matters and I'm not so sure the talent would be "diluted" by such a noticeable measurement

 

[MVP]

Development against pros > development against Bible college #4.

 

[addict4sneakers]

That 17-18 year is likely to be developmental for most players, and you are more likely to end up with Jermaine O’Neal situations which hurt teams

Jermaine O’neal situation hurt what team? Portland drafted him knowing they were deep at his position. They lost patience and dealt him for Dale Davis and Joel Klein

 

[100027]

The issue here is that we're framing this like there needs to be 4.5 years of scouting as opposed to 4 years

Obviously the more you see something the better idea you have of what you're seeing

My stance is that there shouldn't be a requirement for an extra 6 months of evaluation, there doesn't need to be

If preps to pros returns, the number of preps drafted who "don't hit" are worth "diluting the talent" IMO. Of course, once again, these are highly subjective matters and I'm not so sure the talent would be "diluted" by such a noticeable measurement

Okay thank you for acknowledging my point. Yes it’s subjective and we can disagree. Personally I think the benefit of the additional year restriction outweighs the positives of letting high schoolers in a year early.

I am in a car now but can compare some 5-star freshman ratings to their draft position a year later when I am home.

 

[100027]

Jermaine O’neal situation hurt what team? Portland drafted him knowing they were deep at his position. They lost patience and dealt him for Dale Davis and Joel Klein

It hurts a team to develop a player and have them spend most of their productive seasons on a second contract. Or in general to get fewer productive seasons on a rookie contract.

 

[hardens beard]

It hurts a team to develop a player and have them spend most of their productive seasons on a second contract. Or in general to get fewer productive seasons on a rookie contract.

So should the league institute a rule against drafting foreign born players too?

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

That 17-18 year is likely to be developmental for most players, and you are more likely to end up with Jermaine O’Neal situations which hurt teams.


I’m in favor of a g league developmental solution but it hurts veterans for high schoolers to be taking roster spots and not playing.

Jermaine O'neal was obviously an exceptional talent, blame could be passed on Portland as an organization for not developing him properly. These things can happen with a high schooler or a 4 year college player

If O'neal ended up on a different team who's to say he doesn't produce quicker?

Regardless, what the league now knows about all of its history with prep players, do you really think teams would go into drafting a prep without doing extensive research? There's much more data available on preps than ever before to go along with your scouting point

The league has evolved quite a bit in 18 years, I would imagine the prep draft process would be almost unrecognizable compared to 2000

 

[MVP]

It hurts a team to develop a player and have them spend most of their productive seasons on a second contract. Or in general to get fewer productive seasons on a rookie contract.

And this is alleviated by 6 more months of scouting?

 

[addict4sneakers]

It hurts a team to develop a player and have them spend most of their productive seasons on a second contract. Or in general to get fewer productive seasons on a rookie contract.

Again, Portland every opportunity to retain his rights. They signed him to a 4 year $24 M contract and then traded him. THEY decided they wanted to win now

 

[100027]

And this is alleviated by 6 more months of scouting?

It is reduced not alleviated. Yes.

Again, Portland every opportunity to retain his rights. They signed him to a 4 year $24 M contract and then traded him. THEY decided they wanted to win now

Okay then just read my second sentence again.

 

[addict4sneakers]

Portland did an excellent job developing JO, they just lost patience. He was immediately a double double guy his first year in Indiana

 

[atransta]

all these damn 3's are keeping the raps in the game

 

[MVP]

Seems like that's an organizational issue more so than the player actually benefiting.

 

[addict4sneakers]

Notice Portland didn’t make the same mistake twice with Z Bo

 

[100027]

Seems like that's an organizational issue more so than the player actually benefiting.

And what I’m saying is they don’t make the rules to benefit the high school player. They make them to benefit the team and the league.

And before someone says it again, if high schoolers don’t get those contracts veterans and other bubble players get those contracts instead so the NBA is still paying out the same amount of $$ to deserving basketball players

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

And what I’m saying is they don’t make the rules to benefit the high school player. They make them to benefit the team and the league.

And before someone says it again, if high schoolers don’t get those contracts veterans and other bubble players get those contracts instead so the NBA is still paying out the same amount of $$ to deserving basketball players

So because a 12th man doesn't get a contract, that's diluting the talent level enough to where we should prevent Ayton or Bamba from coming over?

Again, taking a questionable prospect is on the GM. With where we're at as a society and culture today, I would theorize we'd see less "mistakes" being made when it comes to preps. Again, the draft process (which admittingly, I have no clue what it was like back then) IMO would look so much different in doing their due diligence

Veterans and bubble players can still play in Europe and make tons of money

 

[pmatic]

"Deserve got nothing to do with it"

 

[addict4sneakers]

So because a 12th man doesn't get a contract, that's diluting the talent level enough to where we should prevent Ayton or Bamba from coming over?

Veterans and bubble players can still play in Europe and make tons of money

Jared Dudley more deserving of a contract than Ayton basically

 

[MVP]

"Deserving basketball players" man what?!

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

You can certainly make the argument that a prep with more "potential" is more "deserving" of a roster spot than a veteran 12th man or bubble player

I don't buy the argument that NBA would be a noticeably better product with the 12th man instead of the unproven prep

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

Jared Dudley more deserving of a contract than Ayton basically

I mean, honestly even a prep with much less caliber than Ayton, if a GM thinks his potential outweighs giving a roster spot to Dudley then I'm not going to bat an eye at that choice

The NBA is not going to suffer, IMO, if that choice is made

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

Toronto’s bench is something serious.

The million dollar question is will Casey shorten it in the playoffs.

The reason I like the Raps' bench so much is that they all have defined roles and niches

There have been deep teams in the past that didn't have real established pecking orders, and that's where the depth can actually be almost a detriment

 

[ill steelo]

Are you worth your draft value? If you are going to say I’m not backing up my statement with statistics that’s fine, but I don’t understand how you can’t agree that logically another year to see a player develop from 18-19 is going to make them easier to scout by some amount.

They’re developing in an environment with silly rules and inferior coaching. It’s immaterial from a scouting perspective, which is why you can’t back it up with stats