OFFICIAL NBA 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

[dacomeup]

And you overgeneralizing the other side of it

If I'm overgeneralizing by saying there are people who don't see that Lonzo doesn't have wiggle and creativity and is unlikely to develop that at a high level during his career, then you definitely got it.

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

So basically Lonzo is a 3 and D PG at best?

Conceited.gif

At best he's an all star 3rd wheel if he has two high level scorers

Can't see him realistically being all NBA or a franchise cornerstone. But who really saw that anyway

 

[addict4sneakers]

And I don’t like Lonzo for a lot of the same reasons I don’t like Frank Niketalk. He doesn’t have any sauce either

 

[P C H]

At best he's an all star 3rd wheel if he has two high level scorers

Can't see him realistically being all NBA or a franchise cornerstone. But who really saw that anyway

I **** with this tbh

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

If I'm overgeneralizing by saying there are people who don't see that Lonzo doesn't have wiggle and creativity and is unlikely to develop that at a high level during his career, then you definitely got it.

Well, I asked you a simple question to begin with, who are these people you're referring to?

You replied by saying "the people on the other side of the argument"

Not everyone on the other side of the argument thinks he can vastly improve his wiggle/creativity

 

[storm2006]

Well Ben is a much better athlete who’s also bigger, and 6’10. And even still, if Ben Simmons wasn’t playing with Jojo his weaknesses probably would be more pronounced. Ben is a part of one of the best 5 man starting units in the league, that helps a ton

Simmons as the point guard has the 6ers 13th in the league offensively.. creepin up on that "Ben will never lead a top 10 offense as a point guard" theory

You drop Simmons on a majority of any playoff team in exchange for their 2nd best player and you could still say that he'd be on one of the best 5 man starting units. There's a common denominator there

Yeah I mean, he's the opposite of Lonzo. He's a high level scorer off the dribble. It helps that he's a huge athletic dude.

He does need to develop some kind of jumper that can at least disallow defenders from completely sagging off of. Will open up more passing lanes for him too.

Well I mean, what is creeping up? Are they or are they not the season is about to be over, I doubt they’ll get there in 12 games, but maybe.

And how do you know that about replacing Simmons with other guys on other teams? He’s a unique prospect that requires a certain make up of teammates for optimal success, much like Lonzo.

This is kind of what I’m getting at. Yes, Lonzo has glaring deficiencies; however, I think they are made so prevalent because of his team. Meanwhile, Ben Simmons has some glaring holes in his game but he’s playing with one of the better teams in the league so it gets a pass and he can claim he should be an all-star despite getting passed over close to 20 times.

I won’t debate size and athleticism because Simmons very clearly has the edge there but they both have a lot to improve on offensively so I think it’s unfair to be so harsh on Zo when Ben is going to have to make a lot of improvement as well, he’s just currently in a much better situation.

 

[B Sox]

And I don’t like Lonzo for a lot of the same reasons I don’t like Frank Niketalk. He doesn’t have any sauce either

Frank was just "unlucky" that guys like Mitchell and DSJ were drafted after him. In most drafts, getting an elite defender like that in that spot wouldn't be all that bad. He will be a very useful player in the league, just like Lonzo.

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

And I don’t like Lonzo for a lot of the same reasons I don’t like Frank Niketalk. He doesn’t have any sauce either

@nickmaz96 pls forgive me, but frank doesn't even belong in the same paragraph as Lonzo, that could change, but yeah

 

[addict4sneakers]

Frank was just "unlucky" that guys like Mitchell and DSJ were drafted after him. In most drafts, getting an elite defender like that in that spot wouldn't be all that bad. He will be a very useful player in the league, just like Lonzo.

I just don’t value a PG whose best asset is defense that high. Lonzo does a little more than defend but I still didn’t think he was the 2nd best guard in draft and still don’t.

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

Well I mean, what is creeping up? Are they or are they not the season is about to be over, I doubt they’ll get there in 12 games, but maybe.

And how do you know that about replacing Simmons with other guys on other teams? He’s a unique prospect that requires a certain make up of teammates for optimal success, much like Lonzo.

Just saying bro, I mean no it's not top 10 but sheesh give the man some optimism! Lol. Never was strong laugauge, that's all I'm sayin to keep it serious

Idk, we can go down a list of the playoff teams and see. Just thought it was a bit, just a bit of a slight to mention that about the starting 5 unit

 

[dacomeup]

Well, I asked you a simple question to begin with, who are these people you're referring to?

You replied by saying "the people on the other side of the argument"

Not everyone on the other side of the argument thinks he can vastly improve his wiggle/creativity

The people who are on the other side of the argument of believing that his wiggle and creativity will substantially improved. Or those who attributes these struggles to him being a rookie or young.

 

[100027]

I guess it’s a wrap for SVG

Have we ever had so many former agents in front offices before?

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

I just don’t value a PG whose best asset is defense that high. Lonzo does a little more than defend but I still didn’t think he was the 2nd best guard in draft and still don’t.

Agree with you on the first sentence

Disagree with the second, I'd say Lonzo is closer to doing a lot more than a little more than defend, considering his passing and rebounding ability

 

[dacomeup]

At best he's an all star 3rd wheel if he has two high level scorers

Can't see him realistically being all NBA or a franchise cornerstone. But who really saw that anyway

Now that last part is not what the narrative was when he was drafted or after last summer. Whether it's in this thread or in the national media. Hell, we still have someone in here posting J Kidd splits comparing him to Lonzo from early in their careers.

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

The people who are on the other side of the argument of believing that his wiggle and creativity will substantially improved. Or those who attributes these struggles to him being a rookie or young.

So again, who are these "people who refuse to see it" in regards to his wiggle, are they here on NT or analysts? Facebook or YouTube?

 

[LebronHasMoreFinalsMVPs]

Bad #2 pick

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

Now that last part is not what the narrative was when he was drafted or after last summer. Whether it's in this thread or in the national media. Hell, we still have someone in here posting J Kidd splits comparing him to Lonzo from early in their careers.

Ok well the kidd comps were a stretch but a lot of us here (who by the way were on both sides of the ball debate) knew better than that

 

[P C H]

Magic Johnson said Lonzo gonna break his assist records, and that his jersey was gonna hang next to Kobe’s lol

 

[dacomeup]

So again, who are these "people who refuse to see it" in regards to his wiggle, are they here on NT or analysts? Facebook or YouTube?

NTers. Mamba and gang.

Ok well the kidd comps were a stretch but a lot of us here (who by the way were on both sides of the ball debate) knew better than that

There's definitely people on both sides of the argument but to say that he wasn't seen as a cornerstone or future all-star is nuts. There were opinions all across the board on Lonzo. People saw him as the biggest boom or bust guy in the draft.

 

[Moheezy]

Agree with you on the first sentence

Disagree with the second, I'd say Lonzo is closer to doing a lot more than a little more than defend, considering his passing and rebounding ability

His passing the rebounding has been really good. It would have been good to see a secondary playmaker like Dlo next to Ball, but isn't that what Ingram is being catered to be?

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

Magic Johnson said Lonzo gonna break his assist records, and that his jersey was gonna hang next to Kobe’s lol

That's all magic said? Honestly shocked lol there's probably more quotes from him somewhere

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

NTers. Mamba and gang.

There's definitely people on both sides of the argument but to say that he wasn't seen as a cornerstone or future all-star is nuts. There were opinions all across the board on Lonzo. People saw him as the biggest boom or bust guy in the draft.

Cornerstone, anyone who said this should not have been taken seriously to begin with

I'm just saying there's no use spending energy on that

 

[freeze]

I mean... hes taking shots...just not quite sure at whom..lmao. i mean the pistons suck..so itd be hard to gas them right? But then he can't be giving props to thr clips when they tossed him like a bag lunch...bruh out here

 

[dacomeup]

People spend pages arguing that LeBron is washed, Westbrook sucks, Harden's style of basketball is unwatchable, and I can't point out statements made about Lonzo?

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

People spend pages arguing that LeBron is washed, Westbrook sucks, Harden's style of basketball is unwatchable, and I can't point out statements made about Lonzo?

No man, that's not what I meant at all lol

I meant that I'm not going to spend energy on that topic with you, I ain't care what y'all post about