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***Official Political Discussion Thread***
- Thread in 'General' Thread starter Started by rico x hood,
- Start date
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Why yall coming for
ballinsam23
like this
ballinsam23
like this
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Oh the main racist of this forum would say that. "Only the weirdo Zionists fight" and "peaceful protestors"
Gotcha.
These are the posters being handed out today btw. I’m sure yall are the angels peacefully handing them out. Real peaceful message here.
becauseWhy yall coming for
ballinsam23
thinks that to support a peaceful protest of the genocide in gaza one must be the biggest racist on an online forum
sneaksoy
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There’s nothing wrong with explaining the factors that led to October 7th. But there is something wrong with using those factors to justify October 7th.
I appreciate you being able to recognize that Hamas committed war crimes, if you want to call them that rather than terrorist attacks.
I don’t justify or condone the Israeli occupation and horror towards Palestinians at all. I’m wholly against the settlements and severe restrictions on Palestinian autonomy. But I don’t think that killing hundreds of innocent civilians - both Israelis and foreigners - is the answer. And it was foolish of Hamas when they should/know it would result in horrific casualties to the Palestinian people.
For the record, the U.S. has a military base in Israel. So if you’re going to say the October 7th attack was on “our lands” then I guess you’d support Hamas attacking that base. What do you think the result of such an action would be?
Why is October 7th the starting point? gry60 gave you the answer. Hamas attacked hundreds of innocent civilians, women, children, festival-goers, etc. So I understand you want to call it a military action, but it was also a massive terrorist attack that has now resulted in thousands of Palestinian casualties.
Like you, I am against innocent people being killed. I still want to know what feasible solution you’d support that wouldn’t result in the death of hundreds of thousands of innocents, be they Palestinian or Israeli. I want the apartheid to end but I recognize that Hamas is not helping that to occur, and thus am confused as to why you defend such an organization committing terrorist attacks that are detrimental to Palestinian people.
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Hamas systematically disabled key communications and warning systems on Oct. 7, allowing gunmen to overwhelm the Israeli military bases.
I repeat, it is clear the group carried out war crimes that day – not least by attacking civilians and taking them as hostages. However, that doesn't mean that it wasn't an armed offensive with the aim to achieve big blows to the Israeli intelligence, security and military establishments. They did, big time.
Also, in terms of why they captured civilians and children, it is in exchange for detained Palestinian civilians and children in jails. A lot of the foreigners had dual citizenship. I also do not think they knew who had Israeli citizenship, and who was a foreigner.
As for the festival, it wasn't a planned target, they landed there:
Israeli Security Establishment: Hamas Likely Didn’t Have Advance Knowledge of Nova Festival
As Hareetz reported, Israeli police report also found that most of the festival goers had managed to leave the event by the time Hamas showed up and the attacks began. The police investigation also found that an Israeli military helicopter opened fire on the assailants but also hit some people attending the festival. No further details were provided, Haaretz reported. Again, who knows what's accurate from their police reports, but it seems to go in line with other sources than Haaretz on the music festival.
There are things Hamas did on Oct 7 that were legitimate under international law, such as attacking Israeli military bases that have been enforcing the siege of Gaza for 16 years. That is the main reason why such large numbers of Israeli soldiers died that day and also taken captive for exchange.
But not ALL actions were legitimate. Why can't it be both legitimate in terms of attacking military bases and the IDF, and also accept there were war crimes for attacking unarmed civilians and taking civilians as hostages?
I think also what's missing from the mainstream Western and Israeli narrative about October 7 is the IDF friendly fire and many returned hostages and Oct. 7 survivors saying the IDF targeted and took the Israelis out. So how can we differentiate the number of civilians killed by Hamas and the IDF? I am basing this on documented testimonials from Israeli documentaries and reports. Many Israelis were killed by the Israeli army and police due to their confusion, but that is something many of you just dismiss. Blurring the distinction between what Hamas had every legal right to do – attack the Israeli army – and what it did not have a right to do, which is kill civilians and take them hostage, is for the aim of the Oct. 7 painted as wholly illegitimate as if all of the day’s events are blended into one giant atrocity, where they were able to put out propaganda lies (i.e. 40 beheaded babies & systematic & widespread SA hoaxes) to manufacture consent for genocide.
Another issue I have with the Israeli/Western Oct. 7 narrative is when they start the clock on that day. Such people want to wipe from the score card decades of atrocities by Israel towards Palestinians are the ongoing ethnic cleansing, massacres, colonization, siege, violent dispossession which lead to Oct. 7 attacks.
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aepps20
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I will say that many in America don’t have any sense of what goes on in Israel and quite frankly don’t care. Most Americans think Gaza and the West Bank are the same place and don’t want to educate themselves on what’s going on. I’m on a few forums like Democratic Underground and even people that you assume would know better apparently don’t.
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All the bad b***** are Pro-Palestine so I'm Pro Palestine.
My understanding is surface level at best. Will do some more reading and video watching this summer.
My understanding is surface level at best. Will do some more reading and video watching this summer.
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Togo's longtime leader signs a new constitution that eliminates presidential elections
Togo’s president has signed a new constitution eliminating presidential elections, a move that opponents say will allow him to extend his family’s six-decade rule.
apnews.com
Coming soon near us?
yobyellav
formerly cord15
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Noem’s career path seems to be following that of Palin’s minus the vp nod?
Haven’t read everything y’all are saying and I’m sure I’m not as informed as most of you all here about the issues between Israel and Palestine. Safe to say the actions on 10/7 were horrible and the ongoing occupation is as well. The events on 10/7 were brutal, unimaginable even. I can only imagine the “open air prison” that those in Palestine have lived in for generations is too.
Haven’t read everything y’all are saying and I’m sure I’m not as informed as most of you all here about the issues between Israel and Palestine. Safe to say the actions on 10/7 were horrible and the ongoing occupation is as well. The events on 10/7 were brutal, unimaginable even. I can only imagine the “open air prison” that those in Palestine have lived in for generations is too.
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Togo's longtime leader signs a new constitution that eliminates presidential elections
Togo’s president has signed a new constitution eliminating presidential elections, a move that opponents say will allow him to extend his family’s six-decade rule.
Coming soon near us?
Wouldn't surprise me in the least if TFG gets back in office. You know the power will go to either Jr or I eat paste Eric.
because
It goes way beyond that.
Ballin got completely ether'd in the early days of the palestine/isreal thread for posting nonstop lies. Then when multiple people called him out for it, with proof, he called everyone else antisemitic and supporters of terrorism. So he ducked that smoke and now he pops up with completely brain dead takes like "hmmmm lots of white people at these pro-palestine protests, makes you think..." as if only minorities or muslims can protest what is going on.
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Nobody got ethered, nobody ducked any smoke. Read that thread from the beginning.
That thread is a pro-Hamas thread, the posters who continue posting there even admitted they are pro-Hamas and I'm glad I got banned from it.
Its full of conspiracies, propaganda, racism, and unrealistic solutions.
I said from day one, idc if you're Pro-Palestinian and have family roots there. I can have normal conversations with a Jordanian friend and once roommate who literally lived in the West Bank for 10 years.
But I'm not gonna go back and forth with the Pro-Hamas contingent. Its completely useless and a waste of time as they will never see this in an unbiased way.
That thread is a pro-Hamas thread, the posters who continue posting there even admitted they are pro-Hamas and I'm glad I got banned from it.
Its full of conspiracies, propaganda, racism, and unrealistic solutions.
I said from day one, idc if you're Pro-Palestinian and have family roots there. I can have normal conversations with a Jordanian friend and once roommate who literally lived in the West Bank for 10 years.
But I'm not gonna go back and forth with the Pro-Hamas contingent. Its completely useless and a waste of time as they will never see this in an unbiased way.
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Once I saw their sources and their anti America anti west and pro Russian interests when the thread first started, I literally did the yep I’m out. There’s no debating in good faith with those types of people.
Sure thing buddy.
Just off the top of my head you claimed that Hamas are the only ones that shouted "Death to (another group)" then got so flustered when people posted dozens of videos of Jewish people shouting "Death to Arabs" including several elected Israeli leaders that you called everyone antisemitic.
Then you claimed that Israeli extremists are only 1% of the population and it got pointed out that the Kach controls almost 20% of the legislature and your response was to deflect and repeatedly ask "Do you support terrorism? Do you support terrosism?" over and over again.
And now you're using the "I have a black friend" argument.
I legitimately thought about blocking you way back when but your posts genuinely make me laugh so I didn't.
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Like I said. No point in going back and forth as we won't be on the same page.
You'll point to extremists. I'll point to extremists on your side.
Peace will come down to leadership.
Israel will 100% get a better leader after Bibi. Especially since it was already leaning left before the war.
There were good ones before. Just like here in the U.S.
But until Gaza or the West Bank have more competent non-ideologic political leadership, who use their money on their actual people and not only on their military and themselves, who don't bow down to big boss Iran, there will continue to never be peace in that region.
You'll point to extremists. I'll point to extremists on your side.
Peace will come down to leadership.
Israel will 100% get a better leader after Bibi. Especially since it was already leaning left before the war.
There were good ones before. Just like here in the U.S.
But until Gaza or the West Bank have more competent non-ideologic political leadership, who use their money on their actual people and not only on their military and themselves, who don't bow down to big boss Iran, there will continue to never be peace in that region.
More deflection and evasion as usual.
And I just remembered another one of your absolutely foolish arguments. "Hamas specifically targeted civilians! They're evil!" and then people posted videos of Israel using drones, snipers, and planes to target civilians. And your response, as expected, was that we all supported terrorism.
Absolutely pathetic
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From the front page:Wouldn't surprise me in the least if TFG gets back in office. You know the power will go to either Jr or I eat paste Eric.
Home
Harper’s Magazine, the oldest general-interest monthly in America, explores the issues that drive our national conversation, through long-form narrative journalism and essays, and such celebrated features as the iconic Harper’s Index.
harpers.org
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Remove Aileen Cannon petitions pass 300K signatures
The Florida judge is facing calls to recuse herself or be removed from Trump's classified documents case.
www.newsweek.com
