***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[doitallpaul]

i never really though romney would win but obama needs to extend the bush tax cuts because today's market is a prime of example of what's going to happen without them...

 

[sundoobie]

Can someone explain the consequences of the bush era taxes expiring this year and the effect on our tax returns and taxes for next year

They will extend it again but this time it might be stalled because big dog Obama doesn't want to extend it for the rich folks (250k up).

Not just the Bush tax cuts but the FICA tax cuts expire too. If they don't extend that, expect to pay $20 more per $1,000 earned.

Here's a good article..
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505123_162-57546009/obama-win-what-it-means-for-your-tax-bill/

it's estimated that 80 percent of Americans would see some form of tax increase next year. The Tax Policy Center estimated that a typical U.S. household would face an average of a $3,700 jump in taxes.

The reason is that a bunch of tax cuts are set to expire, including:

-- Bush-era tax cuts, which will bring the tax system back to 2001 levels

-- President Obama's 2 percent payroll tax cut holiday

-- A series of other temporary tax cuts, including: The enhanced dependent care credit, the enhanced child credit, the enhanced adoption credit, a portion of the enhanced earned-income credit, the repeal of personal exemption phase-out, the repeal of limit on itemized deductions, the enhanced student loan interest deduction; and the exemption for mortgage debt forgiveness.

-- Additionally, the following tax cuts have already expired, but are up for renewal in 2013: AMT adjustment, deduction for state and local sales taxes, IRA charitable donation provision for taxpayers 701/2 and older and Educator's classroom deduction.

 

[deuce king]

Rush Limbaugh comes on at 12 o'clock. Hannity right after.

Can anyone provide a stream for his show if it is available?? 

Iheart radio or tunein.

Well thank you champ.  See, you and I can be civil towards one another. 

 

[Nike Jordan]

 

[ninjahood]

Here you go Ninja
Link
Link

Oh yeah and this is one pretty funny..

Here you go
Link

Such a terrible record..

that's exactly what i'm talking about though. there's this common misnomer among conservatives, republicans, and their ideologues that obama has a horrible record, or something quite close to it. it's simply not true. his efforts alone towards health care reform, passed in his first year, thrust him into the top quarter of any presidential administration ever. coupled with bin laden's execution, a diverted greater depression, and social progress on equality rights, it's very likely he will be considered with policy heavyweights like fdr, jefferson, and clinton and populist favorites like reagan, kennedy, and washington.

Aka more spending & more taxing while our deficits continue to rise...

Our GDP is crap, unemployment is crap, pay isnt keeping up with inflation, jobs aint keeping up with

Da population.. get ur heads out da liberal **** and think centrist. We HAVE TO PAY for all of that.

 

[aeropower]

still can't believe obama added on 6 trillion in debt for our country....in the X amount of years before he was president we had a total of 10 trillion...

Just to defend Mr. Obama, the 6 trillion isn't all spend. Some of it is interest.

 

[nawghtyhare]

Can someone explain the consequences of the bush era taxes expiring this year and the effect on our tax returns and taxes for next year

They will extend it again but this time it might be stalled because big dog Obama doesn't want to extend it for the rich folks (250k up).

Not just the Bush tax cuts but the FICA tax cuts expire too. If they don't extend that, expect to pay $20 more per $1,000 earned.

Here's a good article..
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505123_162-57546009/obama-win-what-it-means-for-your-tax-bill/

it's estimated that 80 percent of Americans would see some form of tax increase next year. The Tax Policy Center estimated that a typical U.S. household would face an average of a $3,700 jump in taxes.

The reason is that a bunch of tax cuts are set to expire, including:

-- Bush-era tax cuts, which will bring the tax system back to 2001 levels

-- President Obama's 2 percent payroll tax cut holiday

-- A series of other temporary tax cuts, including: The enhanced dependent care credit, the enhanced child credit, the enhanced adoption credit, a portion of the enhanced earned-income credit, the repeal of personal exemption phase-out, the repeal of limit on itemized deductions, the enhanced student loan interest deduction; and the exemption for mortgage debt forgiveness.

-- Additionally, the following tax cuts have already expired, but are up for renewal in 2013: AMT adjustment, deduction for state and local sales taxes, IRA charitable donation provision for taxpayers 701/2 and older and Educator's classroom deduction.

So no more earned income credit? And child tax credit? |I

 

[niketalker23]

Here you go Ninja
Link
Link

Oh yeah and this is one pretty funny..

Here you go
Link

Such a terrible record..

that's exactly what i'm talking about though. there's this common misnomer among conservatives, republicans, and their ideologues that obama has a horrible record, or something quite close to it. it's simply not true. his efforts alone towards health care reform, passed in his first year, thrust him into the top quarter of any presidential administration ever. coupled with bin laden's execution, a diverted greater depression, and social progress on equality rights, it's very likely he will be considered with policy heavyweights like fdr, jefferson, and clinton and populist favorites like reagan, kennedy, and washington.

That's because they live in a bubble. A bubble in which real facts are disputed, and fictitious facts are created out of thin air .

 

[ninjahood]

Can someone explain the consequences of the bush era taxes expiring this year and the effect on our tax returns and taxes for next year

They will extend it again but this time it might be stalled because big dog Obama doesn't want to extend it for the rich folks (250k up).

Not just the Bush tax cuts but the FICA tax cuts expire too. If they don't extend that, expect to pay $20 more per $1,000 earned.

Here's a good article..
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505123_162-57546009/obama-win-what-it-means-for-your-tax-bill/

it's estimated that 80 percent of Americans would see some form of tax increase next year. The Tax Policy Center estimated that a typical U.S. household would face an average of a $3,700 jump in taxes.

The reason is that a bunch of tax cuts are set to expire, including:

-- Bush-era tax cuts, which will bring the tax system back to 2001 levels

-- President Obama's 2 percent payroll tax cut holiday

-- A series of other temporary tax cuts, including: The enhanced dependent care credit, the enhanced child credit, the enhanced adoption credit, a portion of the enhanced earned-income credit, the repeal of personal exemption phase-out, the repeal of limit on itemized deductions, the enhanced student loan interest deduction; and the exemption for mortgage debt forgiveness.

-- Additionally, the following tax cuts have already expired, but are up for renewal in 2013: AMT adjustment, deduction for state and local sales taxes, IRA charitable donation provision for taxpayers 701/2 and older and Educator's classroom deduction.

Repped.

 

[RustyShackleford]

still can't believe obama added on 6 trillion in debt for our country....in the X amount of years before he was president we had a total of 10 trillion...

Not all of that spending was Obama's.

 

[True Blues]

Here you go Ninja
Link
Link

Oh yeah and this is one pretty funny..

Here you go
Link

Such a terrible record..

that's exactly what i'm talking about though. there's this common misnomer among conservatives, republicans, and their ideologues that obama has a horrible record, or something quite close to it. it's simply not true. his efforts alone towards health care reform, passed in his first year, thrust him into the top quarter of any presidential administration ever. coupled with bin laden's execution, a diverted greater depression, and social progress on equality rights, it's very likely he will be considered with policy heavyweights like fdr, jefferson, and clinton and populist favorites like reagan, kennedy, and washington.

Aka more spending & more taxing while our deficits continue to rise...

Our GDP is crap, unemployment is crap, pay isnt keeping up with inflation, jobs aint keeping up with

Da population.. get ur heads out da liberal **** and think centrist. We HAVE TO PAY for all of that.

Again, barring a complete mishandling of the so-called fiscal cliff, this:

Economy Set for Better Times Whether Obama or Romney Wins
By Rich Miller and Steve Matthews - Nov 4, 2012
Mitt Romney says Barack Obama’s policies will consign the U.S. to an extended period of sluggish economic growth, at best. The president says his Republican challenger’s plans will sow the seeds of another mammoth recession. Both are wrong.

No matter who wins the election tomorrow, the economy is on course to enjoy faster growth in the next four years as the headwinds that have held it back turn into tailwinds. Consumers are spending more and saving less after reducing household debt to the lowest since 2003. Home prices are rebounding after falling more than 30 percent from their 2006 highs. And banks are increasing lending after boosting equity capital by more than $300 billion since 2009.

“The die is cast for a much stronger recovery,” said Mark Zandi, chief economist in West Chester, Pennsylvania, for Moody’s Analytics Inc. He sees growth this year and next at about 2 percent before doubling to around 4 percent in both 2014 and 2015 as consumption, construction and hiring all pick up.

The big proviso, according to Zandi and Yale University professor Ray Fair, is how the president-elect tackles the task of shrinking the $1.1 trillion federal-budget deficit. The Congressional Budget Office has warned that the U.S. will suffer a recession if more than $600 billion in scheduled government- spending reductions and tax increases -- the so-called fiscal cliff -- take effect next year.

Positive Signs

“There are a lot of things that are positive going forward for the economy,” Fair said. “Hopefully, we can get a handle on the deficit” without dragging down growth too much.

While concern about the threatened fiscal squeeze may hit gross domestic product this quarter and next, the expansion should pick up strength by the middle of 2013, said Eric Green, a Philadelphia-based fund manager at Penn Capital Management Co. GDP “will surprise to the upside,” said Green, whose firm manages $7.2 billion. “We could grow at a 3 to 4 percent rate over the next couple of years.”

Full Bloomberg Coverage of 2012 Election

Hiring in the U.S. increased more than forecast in October as employers looked past slowing global growth and political gridlock at home. In the last jobs report before tomorrow’s election, the Labor Department said a net 171,000 workers were added to payrolls, beating the 125,000 median forecast of economists surveyed by Bloomberg.

‘Defensive’ Stocks

Shares of manufacturers, materials producers and energy and technology companies should rise as the expansion gains speed, Green said. More “defensive” stocks that aren’t as affected by rising demand, such as real-estate investment trusts, health- care providers and consumer staples, won’t perform as well. The Standard & Poor’s 500 Index is up about 12 percent this year.

Slideshow: Battle for the Presidency ... of Ohio?

The U.S. also should benefit next year from a rebound in the rest of the world, according to Green, especially as China, the second-largest economy, “seems to be bottoming out.”

Chinese manufacturing expanded in October for the first time in three months, according to a purchasing managers’ index compiled by the government. A similar gauge from HSBC Holdings Plc and Markit Economics posted the biggest gain since 2010.

While manufacturing in the euro area continues to contract, the region “can’t be in a recession forever,” said Allen Sinai, chief executive officer of Decision Economics Inc. in New York. Economists surveyed by Bloomberg see the 17-nation group expanding 0.2 percent next year and 1.2 percent in 2014.

‘Albatross’ Deficits

U.S. growth will pick up only gradually during the next few years, to a little more than 3 percent in 2015, held back by an “albatross” of deficits and debt, Sinai said.

Mohamed El-Erian, chief executive officer of Pacific Investment Management Co., is more downbeat, emphasizing the structural challenges the U.S. faces rather than the cyclical forces Zandi highlights.

“The prospect is for 2 percent growth,” said El-Erian, whose Newport Beach, California-based company manages more than $1.9 trillion in assets. “The downside risks are larger than the upside risks.”

He argues that policy makers must tackle such “deep-seated problems” as elevated youth and long-term unemployment and a broken housing-finance system to enable the U.S. to grow faster. And while the president-elect will face an economy in much better shape than four years ago, he and the Federal Reserve will have less leeway to support expansion by employing fiscal and monetary policies, as they have already been loosened considerably, El-Erian said.

Optimistic Households

Households seem increasingly inclined to side with the optimists, preferring to see the economic glass as half-full rather than half-empty. Consumer confidence climbed in October to a more than four-year high as Americans took comfort from an improving job market, according to figures from the New York- based Conference Board.

Adam and Allyson Straight are among those looking ahead to more prosperous times. Adam, a 35-year-old official at the Georgia Dome stadium, and his 27-year-old wife bought a $227,000 three-bedroom house in Roswell, Georgia, on Oct. 26 after renting for the past 10 months. They moved in the following weekend and spent $2,500 on new living-room and dining-room furniture.

“I am optimistic,” said Allyson, a civil attorney. The economy “seems to be moving in a better direction.”

Romney disagrees. He told supporters in Ames, Iowa, on Oct. 26 that Obama has the nation headed in the wrong direction, with “trickle-down government policies that have failed us.

Better Future

‘‘It’s time for new, bold changes that measure up to the moment and that can bring America’s families the certainty that the future will be better than the past,” he said.

The day before, Obama said Romney is the one proposing policies that have failed, such as lower tax rates for all Americans, including the wealthiest.

“We just tried that philosophy in the decade before I took office,” the president said in Cleveland, Ohio. “And we know what happened.”

Slideshow: Battle for the Presidency ... of Ohio?

Pent-up demand, more than presidential policies, will drive the expansion forward in the next few years, said Peter Hooper, chief economist at Deutsche Bank Securities in New York and a former Fed official. Households that put off purchases during the recession and its aftermath are starting to buy amid rising optimism about their prospects.

Retail sales jumped 1.1 percent in September as Americans snapped up goods from cars to iPhones, according to Commerce Department data. The gain followed a 1.2 percent increase in August, the best back-to-back showing since late 2010.

‘Strong’ Quarter

While U.S. sales of cars and light-duty trucks will suffer temporarily from the disruption caused by Hurricane Sandy, the industry “will have a strong fourth quarter and continue growing next year,” Kurt McNeil, vice president of U.S. sales for General Motors Co. (GM) in Detroit, said in a Nov. 1 conference call with analysts.

Easier credit terms are contributing to the rise in consumer spending. Banks reported that they continued to ease standards on auto loans and credit cards last quarter, according to a Fed survey of senior lending officers.

Financial institutions “are very well capitalized,” Zandi said. “They are slowly but surely lowering their lending standards.”

Commercial banks and savings institutions recorded a 21 percent rise in net income for April-June, the 12th straight quarter that earnings have risen on a year-over-year basis, according to the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. in Washington. The 19 biggest banks have boosted equity capital by more than $300 billion since 2009, Fed Chairman Ben S. Bernanke said in a speech earlier this year.

Increasing Demand

Demand for auto loans and residential mortgages increased last quarter, the Fed survey found. Households are feeling more comfortable about credit after reducing their cumulative debt as a share of disposable income to 113 percent in the second quarter, the lowest in nine years, Fed figures show.

The housing market is one of the beneficiaries. New-home sales climbed 5.7 percent in September to the highest level in two years, based on Commerce Department data. Demand was 27 percent higher than a year ago.

“Clearly, demand conditions have changed for the better,” Richard Dugas, chief executive officer of PulteGroup Inc., the largest U.S. homebuilder by revenue, told analysts on Oct. 25.

The last time residential construction contributed to growth over the course of an entire year was 2005, when it accounted for 0.4 percentage point of the 3.1 percent increase in GDP. From 2006 to 2009, the homebuilding slump subtracted an average of 0.8 percentage point from the economy. Through the first three quarters of 2012, it’s contributed 0.3 point.

Distressed Properties

“Housing typically adds 1 to 2 percentage points” in a recovery, said Dean Maki, New York-based chief U.S. economist at Barclays Plc, who worked at the Fed from 1995 to 2000. As the overhang of distressed properties is cleared away, “you may get a bigger kick from housing” in 2015 and 2016, he said.

Home values already are rising. Residential real-estate prices increased in the year ended August by the most in two years, according to the S&P/Case-Shiller index of property values in 20 cities.

The improvement in the housing market is alleviating one of the headwinds holding back the economy, Dennis Lockhart, president of the Federal Reserve Bank of Atlanta, told reporters Nov. 1.

If concerns about the U.S. fiscal cliff and European debt crisis also abate, “there would be the impetus for more economic activity, more investment and more hiring,” he said.

While tomorrow’s presidential contest “may have some influence on the decision of businesses,” more generally “I don’t think the election results per se are going to have a noticeable effect on how this economy is evolving.”

To contact the reporters on this story: Rich Miller in Washington at [email protected]; Steve Matthews in Atlanta at [email protected]

To contact the editor responsible for this story: Chris Wellisz at [email protected]

 

[david bowman]

i never really though romney would win but obama needs to extend the bush tax cuts because today's market is a prime of example of what's going to happen without them...

so when they win, they hoard the money and don't hire. When they lose they complain and whine and moan and still hoard the money

the tax rate is the lowest it's ever been. going back to clinton rates won't break them

 

[rashi]

Just to defend Mr. Obama, the 6 trillion isn't all spend. Some of it is interest.

No it isn't. You don't want to know how much debt is owed including future obligations, unfunded liabilities and interest.

 

[lobotomybeats]

No it isn't. You don't want to know how much debt is owed including future obligations, unfunded liabilities and interest.

Not to mention 3 first round and 2 second round draft picks

 

[Betonblck]

i never really though romney would win but obama needs to extend the bush tax cuts because today's market is a prime of example of what's going to happen without them...

We get it. You are salty about the loss. What's next, you are going to bring up Libya?

 

[sawyer]

Aka more spending & more taxing while our deficits continue to rise...
Our GDP is crap, unemployment is crap, pay isnt keeping up with inflation, jobs aint keeping up with
Da population.. get ur heads out da liberal **** and think centrist. We HAVE TO PAY for all of that.

do you just regurgitate popular conservative talking points with no regard to their validity or legitimacy?

what is this nonsense you keep repeating about 'more taxing'? americans are paying less in individual tax rates than anyone still alive ever has. no one who is alive in america has paid less in individual income tax rates than they have right now. stop. you're not just wrong, you're really wrong.

a substantial portion of our debt is owed to the fact that bush cut taxes across the board while going to war in 2 separate countries. any potention econ major in his or her freshman year will tell you how absolutely insane that is. it is fundamental economics.

your understanding of deficit spending isn't even worth responding to. do you have any type of formal education on these matters? do you know the word deficit is not interchangeable with the word debt?

unemployment has been trending downward for 2 years now, our gdp has expanded for multiple consecutive quarters, and jobs are keeping up with population growth (although just barely). collective social progress has been achieved through healthcare reform and we've averted a economic national disaster.

any sane-minded economist or financier will tell you that now is not the time to pay down our debt. austerity leaves future generations in social and infrastructure debt.

 

[big j 33]

 

[True Blues]

Ninja,

You don't have to answer in here, but I am curious: What is your formal training?

 

[thepointgod]

They will extend it again but this time it might be stalled because big dog Obama doesn't want to extend it for the rich folks (250k up).
Not just the Bush tax cuts but the FICA tax cuts expire too. If they don't extend that, expect to pay $20 more per $1,000 earned.
Here's a good article..
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505123_162-57546009/obama-win-what-it-means-for-your-tax-bill/

^^ that article is misleading.

Yes, there are a lot of tax cuts that are about to expire--that doesn't mean that all of them will not be renewed. Providing a figure of a $3,700 average tax increase across all households is (1) unhelpful because it's based on tax cuts that may be renewed and (2) wouldn't provide a clear picture of the types of households that will experience an increase (it's simply an average).

 

[cj863]

Ninja,

You don't have to answer in here, but I am curious: What is your formal training?

da interwebz b

 

[Ace Ready]

Rush Limbaugh comes on at 12 o'clock. Hannity right after.

 

[andycrazn]

do you just regurgitate popular conservative talking points with no regard to their validity or legitimacy?

what is this nonsense you keep repeating about 'more taxing'? americans are paying less in individual tax rates than anyone still alive ever has. no one who is alive in america has paid less in individual income tax rates than they have right now. stop. you're not just wrong, you're really wrong.

your understanding of deficit spending isn't even worth responding to. do you have any type of formal education on these matters? do you know the word deficit is not interchangeable with the word debt?

unemployment has been trending downward for 2 years now, our gdp has expanded for multiple consecutive quarters, and jobs are keeping up with population growth (although just barely). collective social progress has been achieved through healthcare reform and we've averted a economic national disaster.

any sane-minded economist or financier will tell you that now is not the time to pay down our debt. austerity leaves future generations in social and infrastructure debt.

when should we pay it down then? the interest payments is a heavy burden on us just like a person thats working minimum wage and has over Xk in debt. its unsustainable and what needs to be done is austerity or default. or do the ben bernanke way and just print our way out of this.

 

[ninjahood]

Asking Republicans to loosen up on social issues is asking oil companies to stop drilling oil.

Not gonna happen.

Not true when you look at historical precedents.

Da slide to da more extreme right is a recent thing.

 

[caleekicks]

 

[lobotomybeats]

Not true when you look at historical precedents.
Da slide to da more extreme right is a recent thing.

But don't you think that is more reactionary than anything, Ninjahood? I kinda see it as they felt like they had to be the polar opposite to be heard. It's like Fox News in a sense.