Plane Crashes Into Building - Austin, Texas

[southzeztpdot]

Originally Posted by Nawth21

Originally Posted by xxxoverridexxx

Originally Posted by Nawth21

I hope he's burning in hell. The end doesn't always justify the means, regardless of what his message was.

guessing you didnt read anything? 
  

I did.  Still don't care.  Those people working in that building didn't do jack *@@! to that man.  They're just going about their day trying to make a living.  Just like me, or my friends or the rest of my family. 

Innocent people die all the time. What about the innocent people that died in WW2? Can you actually name one time were change was done that wasn't caused by innocent people dieing? What do you value those lives at? Do you value those lives more so than the freedom of every American?

 

[jinkazama]

wow..that was some read. How about you guys actually sit down and take 5 min and read it. Hes standing up for us in a crazy way

Dude really had it out for the "Government" so I dont blame him.


Just got done reading his little manifesto...

Sorry guys the ends don't justify the means...setting your house on fire with your family in it...and blaming the "government", "religion", and whoever else for your oh woe is me life and the inequities you've seen as you fly your $50,000 airplane into a building is a +#**+ move no matter how you slice it IMO. 

I wonder if Mr. Stack took a second to contemplate how many people would give their life to live the inequities he witnessed and experienced...I wonder if he cared that by slamming his airplane into that building he likely has created for someone the very things he railed against...who's relative did he scar for life or potentially kill that will leave that person's dependent eating cat food or worse...who connected to that building will place false hope in a person disguised as man of god to get over the trauma of today... 

Surely a man as knowlegeable as Mr. Stack would have realized that...surely he considered this since he was watching out for we, the have nots...or maybe his little stunt wasn't about that at all...this wasn't about any of what you read in his little write up.  This was about Joe Stack, PERIOD no more, no less...a tired, sorry excuse of person, who used that 5 page dissertation to bring attention to the only thing that mattered to him...HIMSELF! 

Sorry Joe you're no martyr...you are a coward.   

 

[callhimar]

Originally Posted by Mrsouthernhospitality

Originally Posted by CallHimAR

Originally Posted by NostrandAve68

Just to play devils advocate hypothetically. If A guy name Mohammed Wasim Al-Abdur had done the EXACT same thing [flying plane into a federal building] and left the exact same note would his message be heralded in the very same way... or be described as an extremist with radical views.

It depends on who you're talking to. I'd feel the exact same way to be quite honest.

But realistically if he was he would in fact be portrayed as an extremist. Are there any news reports praising this man? No, they're saying he was insane, demented, etc etc.

THANK YOU.

its so crazy how yall will flip the script for him but if it was a minority yall would condemn that dead man

.....i love america

Way to make a gross generalization about all white people.

Before you can say that he was talking about white people in that statement it would make more sense if you would ask him what he means by the word yall he could mean all americans.
Anyway even though I don't think taking his life was a wise choice but i wonder if homie just left all his opinions on a blog instead of suicide would it be looked at in the same light I mean all this info left by him was discovered with the quickness



Ok you're right, way to generalize all Americans then. Even though most likely, he's American, so that makes no sense.

There's no way his opinions would have been viewed the same way on a blog. The only reason this message got out is because of what he did.

 

[black jesus]

Originally Posted by CallHimAR

Originally Posted by NostrandAve68

Just to play devils advocate hypothetically. If A guy name Mohammed Wasim Al-Abdur had done the EXACT same thing [flying plane into a federal building] and left the exact same note would his message be heralded in the very same way... or be described as an extremist with radical views.

It depends on who you're talking to. I'd feel the exact same way to be quite honest.

But realistically if he was he would in fact be portrayed as an extremist. Are there any news reports praising this man? No, they're saying he was insane, demented, etc etc.

THANK YOU.

its so crazy how yall will flip the script for him but if it was a minority yall would condemn that dead man

.....i love america

Way to make a gross generalization about all white people.




where did i say white people?

cause i dont see it

 

[mrsouthernhospitality]

Originally Posted by CallHimAR

Originally Posted by Mrsouthernhospitality

Originally Posted by CallHimAR

Originally Posted by NostrandAve68

Just to play devils advocate hypothetically. If A guy name Mohammed Wasim Al-Abdur had done the EXACT same thing [flying plane into a federal building] and left the exact same note would his message be heralded in the very same way... or be described as an extremist with radical views.

It depends on who you're talking to. I'd feel the exact same way to be quite honest.

But realistically if he was he would in fact be portrayed as an extremist. Are there any news reports praising this man? No, they're saying he was insane, demented, etc etc.

THANK YOU.

its so crazy how yall will flip the script for him but if it was a minority yall would condemn that dead man

.....i love america

Way to make a gross generalization about all white people.

Before you can say that he was talking about white people in that statement it would make more sense if you would ask him what he means by the word yall he could mean all americans.
Anyway even though I don't think taking his life was a wise choice but i wonder if homie just left all his opinions on a blog instead of suicide would it be looked at in the same light I mean all this info left by him was discovered with the quickness

Ok you're right, way to generalize all Americans then. Even though most likely, he's American, so that makes no sense.

There's no way his opinions would have been viewed the same way on a blog. The only reason this message got out is because of what he did.



Agreed because im pretty sure someone has stated this before

 

[JD617]

Originally Posted by JinKazama

wow..that was some read. How about you guys actually sit down and take 5 min and read it. Hes standing up for us in a crazy way

Dude really had it out for the "Government" so I dont blame him.


Just got done reading his little manifesto...

Sorry guys the ends don't justify the means...setting your house on fire with your family in it...and blaming the "government", "religion", and whoever else for your oh woe is me life and the inequities you've seen as you fly your $50,000 airplane into a building is a +#**+ move no matter how you slice it IMO. 

I wonder if Mr. Stack took a second to contemplate how many people would give their life to live the inequities he witnessed and experienced...I wonder if he cared that by slamming his airplane into that building he likely has created for someone the very things he railed against...who's relative did he scar for life or potentially kill that will leave that person's dependent eating cat food or worse...who connected to that building will place false hope in a person disguised as man of god to get over the trauma of today... 

Surely a man as knowlegeable as Mr. Stack would have realized that...surely he considered this since he was watching out for we, the have nots...or maybe his little stunt wasn't about that at all...this wasn't about any of what you read in his little write up.  This was about Joe Stack, PERIOD no more, no less...a tired, sorry excuse of person, who used that 5 page dissertation to bring attention to the only thing that mattered to him...HIMSELF! 

Sorry Joe you're no martyr...you are a coward.   

*insert clapping gif*

Innocent people die all the time. What about the innocent people that died in WW2? Can you actually name one time were change was done that wasn't caused by innocent people dieing? What do you value those lives at? Do you value those lives more so than the freedom of every American?
So...basically you're supporting terrorism. People shouldn't let a little thing like innocent lives get in the way of making a point, right?

 

[bigboi415]

saved for later

 

[undermedicated]

Originally Posted by James Earl Zones

Originally Posted by spsfinest212

He's a real American an Hero

Fixed.

Sad thing is I see domestic terrorism and acts like this rising in the coming years, maybe months.

The United States is coming to a close, maybe in our lifetimes.

I remember watching something and shortly after japan became Americanized there were alto of people who honorably killed themselves with a message to change the government and it caused a shift in their society.

 

[callhimar]

Originally Posted by Black Jesus

Originally Posted by CallHimAR

Originally Posted by NostrandAve68

Just to play devils advocate hypothetically. If A guy name Mohammed Wasim Al-Abdur had done the EXACT same thing [flying plane into a federal building] and left the exact same note would his message be heralded in the very same way... or be described as an extremist with radical views.

It depends on who you're talking to. I'd feel the exact same way to be quite honest.

But realistically if he was he would in fact be portrayed as an extremist. Are there any news reports praising this man? No, they're saying he was insane, demented, etc etc.

THANK YOU.

its so crazy how yall will flip the script for him but if it was a minority yall would condemn that dead man

.....i love america

Way to make a gross generalization about all white people.

where did i say white people?

cause i dont see it



You're right, you didn't, so you might be making generalizations about all of  America since if it had been a minority many of them would have seen this in a different light, even if the people judging him were black, hispanic, asian, etc etc. I guess that's white privilege.

Just got done reading his little manifesto...

Sorry guys theends don't justify the means...setting your house on fire with yourfamily in it...and blaming the "government", "religion", and whoeverelse for your oh woe is me life and the inequities you've seen as youfly your $50,000 airplane into a building is a +#**+ move no matter howyou slice it IMO. 

I wonder if Mr. Stack took a second tocontemplate how many people would give their life to livethe inequities he witnessed and experienced...I wonder if he cared thatby slamming his airplane into that building he likely has created forsomeone the very things he railed against...who's relative did he scarfor life or potentially kill that will leave that person's dependenteating cat food or worse...who connected to that building willplace false hope in a person disguised as man of god to get over thetrauma of today... 

Surely a man as knowlegeable as Mr. Stackwould have realized that...surely he considered this since he waswatching out for we, the have nots...or maybe his little stunt wasn'tabout that at all...this wasn't about any of what you read in hislittle write up.  This was about Joe Stack, PERIOD no more, no less...atired, sorry excuse of person, who used that 5 page dissertationto bring attention to the only thing that mattered to him...HIMSELF! 

Sorry Joe you're no martyr...you are a coward.   
I agree that setting his home on fire was completely baseless, although correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think his family was inside at the time.

Standing up for your beliefs and getting your message across to a mass of people who are so helpless, complacent and unable to think for themselves the only way you possibly can is a @#%*@ move? Not exactly. He died for what he believed in, and successfully got his message shown on every major news networks website. That sounds like a mission accomplished to me.

While he did in fact cause a great deal of hurt to many people in that building, he saw them as cogs in the machine that oppresses the middle class. Which they are.

Someone who writes something like that isn't doing it for himself, hes doing it because he feels that more people need to hear the message.

 

[spsfinest212]

Originally Posted by JD617

Originally Posted by spsfinest212

He's a real American Hero

  

settle down. I guess I'm the only person who remembers G.I. Joe.....

 

[lexuslaf]

Im white.

Lets get that out of the way.

I dont see how race should play any part of this.

If a white guy, and a middleeastern guy commit the same crime... they deserve the same punishment.

This guy did a horrific act (several) to show "The government" ...

The thought process of some people scares me.

 

[jinkazama]

Standing up for your beliefs and getting your message across to a mass of people who are so helpless, complacent and unable to think for themselves the only way you possibly can is a *%%$$ move?
The only way he possibly can...this isn't Iran.  There are a million ways to be heard in this country that don't involve jeopardizing innocent people and flying a plane into a building, GT __OH with that.  Don't reward this man for taking the easy way out.

He died for what he believed in, and successfully got his message shown on every major news networks website. That sounds like a mission accomplished to me.

and this time next week it will be forgotten...just like him...if you care that much stand and fight...don't throw the brick and hide your hand.

While he did in fact cause a great deal of hurt to many people in that building, he saw them as cogs in the machine that oppresses the middle class. Which they are.

Unfortunately for them they didn't get to choose their life...just like Joe.  They chose to make the best of it and work to improve their circumstances even if they had to be "cogs in the machine"  he chose to quit...

Someone who writes something like that isn't doing it for himself, hes doing it because he feels that more people need to hear the message
So why, pray tell, would you not want to stick around and spread it?  Why let your message die with you...I'll tell you why because it was never about anybody but you...If he cared that much he would have used his message to help as many people as he could before he met his end.  Joe was selfish all he wanted was people to hear HIM..what HE thought, what HE went through.  Joe could care less about you and I...if he really cared...he'd still be here.

 

[lexuslaf]

Originally Posted by JinKazama

Standing up for your beliefs and getting your message across to a mass of people who are so helpless, complacent and unable to think for themselves the only way you possibly can is a *%%$$ move?

The only way he possibly can...this isn't Iran.  There are a million ways to be heard in this country that don't involve jeopardizing innocent people and flying a plane into a building, GT __OH with that.  Don't reward this man for taking the easy way out.

He died for what he believed in, and successfully got his message shown on every major news networks website. That sounds like a mission accomplished to me.

and this time next week it will be forgotten...just like him...if you care that much stand and fight...don't throw the brick and hide your hand.

While he did in fact cause a great deal of hurt to many people in that building, he saw them as cogs in the machine that oppresses the middle class. Which they are.

Unfortunately for them they didn't get to choose their life...just like Joe.  They chose to make the best of it and work to improve their circumstances even if they had to be "cogs in the machine"  he chose to quit...

Someone who writes something like that isn't doing it for himself, hes doing it because he feels that more people need to hear the message
So why, pray tell, would you not want to stick around and spread it?  Why let your message die with you...I'll tell you why because it was never about anybody but you...If he cared that much he would have used his message to help as many people as he could before he met his end.  Joe was selfish all he wanted was people to hear HIM..what HE thought, what HE went through.  Joe could care less about you and I...if he really cared...he'd still be here.

And we have a winner.

 

[lexuslaf]

Originally Posted by iLLest

I HOPE they don't change the name from Andrew Joseph Stack to MOHAMMED IBIN IL QATAB THE 3RD. I will be

[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]iLLest![/font]

Why would they do that?

Sounds like you kinda want them too so you can get all butt hurt.

 

[thunderchunk69]

We are all taught as children that without laws there wouldbe no society, only anarchy.  Sadly,starting at early ages we in this country have been brainwashed to believethat, in return for our dedication and service, our government stands forjustice for all.  We are furtherbrainwashed to believe that there is freedom in this place, and that we shouldbe ready to lay our lives down for the noble principals represented by itsfounding fathers.  Remember? One ofthese was “no taxation without representation

 

[fac3 tak30v312]

Originally Posted by JinKazama

wow..that was some read. How about you guys actually sit down and take 5 min and read it. Hes standing up for us in a crazy way

Dude really had it out for the "Government" so I dont blame him.


Just got done reading his little manifesto...

Sorry guys the ends don't justify the means...setting your house on fire with your family in it...and blaming the "government", "religion", and whoever else for your oh woe is me life and the inequities you've seen as you fly your $50,000 airplane into a building is a +#**+ move no matter how you slice it IMO. 

I wonder if Mr. Stack took a second to contemplate how many people would give their life to live the inequities he witnessed and experienced...I wonder if he cared that by slamming his airplane into that building he likely has created for someone the very things he railed against...who's relative did he scar for life or potentially kill that will leave that person's dependent eating cat food or worse...who connected to that building will place false hope in a person disguised as man of god to get over the trauma of today... 

Surely a man as knowlegeable as Mr. Stack would have realized that...surely he considered this since he was watching out for we, the have nots...or maybe his little stunt wasn't about that at all...this wasn't about any of what you read in his little write up.  This was about Joe Stack, PERIOD no more, no less...a tired, sorry excuse of person, who used that 5 page dissertation to bring attention to the only thing that mattered to him...HIMSELF! 

Sorry Joe you're no martyr...you are a coward.   
While I don't condone his actions, what in this world has been achieved without bloodshed? How else are you to point out injustices without including yourself in it? More that anything else I'm shocked that it took this long for something like this too happen. However, as usually it would be swept to the wayside  in a week and forgotten in a couple of months

 

[callhimar]

The only way he possibly can...this isn't Iran.  There are a millionways to be heard in this country that don't involve jeopardizinginnocent people and flying a plane into a building, GT __OH with that. Don't reward this man for taking the easy way out.


This isn't Iran but if you have a dissenting opinion that is viewed by the masses as radical, socialist, or anything that is "Un-American" it might as well be. Again, I commend you for standing up for your belief in our system, but quite frankly many of his points are right. Our government doesn't serve us, they serve those who pay for their campaigns and those who keep us in power. We see this daily when bills that go against big business (ie. Health Care Reform) are watered down so they can still benefit a capitalist system when they were supposed to benefit the majority of the population.

and this time next week it will be forgotten...just like him...if youcare that much stand and fight...don't throw the brick and hide yourhand.
It will only be forgotten if people allow it to be. The media will forget it, but the people who this message got to and who feel the same way will certainly not forget it. It's their job to keep these ideas alive. He in no way threw the brick and hid his hand, he threw the brick and went along for the ride.

Unfortunately for them they didn't get to choose their life...just likeJoe.  They chose to make the best of it and work to improve theircircumstances even if they had to be "cogs in the machine"  he choseto quit...
They didn't choose their life? Is that a joke? They were forced to work for the IRS? He didn't choose to quit, he saw what he did as making a difference, and getting a dissenting opinion out there to the masses.

So why, pray tell, would you not want to stick around and spreadit?  Why let your message die with you...I'll tell you why because itwas never about anybody but you...If he cared that much he would haveused his message to help as many people as he could before he met hisend.  Joe was selfish all he wanted was people to hear HIM..what HEthought, what HE went through.  Joe could care less about you andI...if he really cared...he'd still be here.
Again, it is extremely hard for some people to get their message out. In essence, his message got new life with the act he committed. If he posted this on a blog somewhere it would have been forgotten a week later and maybe 100 people would have seen it. His message is now a link on every major news website in the country. Millions of people are reading it. So, as I said before, he's looking at us saying mission accomplished.

And we have a winner.
Not quite.

 

[cicero avenue dopeman]

Originally Posted by spsfinest212

He's a real American Hero

 

[jinkazama]

While I don't condone his actions, what in this world has been achieved without bloodshed?
 What has been achieved by shedding the blood of innocents?  The attempting killing of innocent people only gets your message ignored; even if they are collateral damage.  For all the great things Malcolm X and the black panthers did and stood for, the man who did the most to advance civil rights was a guy who no matter how many times he was kicked, beaten, spit on, harassed, and knocked down.  He stood back up and used his mind and not his fists. 

Blood shed is warranted when the ends justify the means.  Clearly this was not the case today. 

 

[callhimar]

Originally Posted by JinKazama

While I don't condone his actions, what in this world has been achieved without bloodshed?

 What has been achieved by shedding the blood of innocents?  The attempting killing of innocent people only gets your message ignored; even if they are collateral damage.  For all the great things Malcolm X and the black panthers did and stood for, the man who did the most to advance civil rights was a guy who no matter how many times he was kicked, beaten, spit on, harassed, and knocked down.  He stood back up and used his mind and not his fists. 

Blood shed is warranted when the ends justify the means.  Clearly this was not the case today. 
Completely untrue. Israeli's kill innocent Palestinians daily, yet their message is viewed as right and just, while there are people in Iraq killing members of our military because they see them as an occupying force and they are terrorists.

 

[illfrozn]

I know other, larger cities have experienced similar, but may I just say that it is crazy to know that I have worked/passed by that building for YEARS and am on that highway daily, to see an act like that.

God bless those affected by this ...

 

[black jesus]

Originally Posted by lexuslaf

Im white. black

Lets get that out of the way.

I dont see how race should play any part of this.

If a white guy, and a middleeastern guy commit the same crime... they deserve the same punishment.

This guy did a horrific act (several) to show "The government" ...

The thought process of some people scares me.

 

[jinkazama]

Completely untrue. Israeli's kill innocent Palestinians daily, yet their message is viewed as right and just, while there are people in Iraq killing members of our military because they see them as an occupying force and they are terrorists.

 The Israli's have gained nothing...they are still locked in a centuries old conflict, they have no peace, and THE ONLY place in the world where israel's actions are viewed as right and just is america.  Anybody with a level headed view of that conflict realizes that the Israeli's and Palestinians are two sides of the same coin...both sides want to see the total destruction of the other side and nobody with the mind to compromise is allowed to live (Rabin).  Until BOTH sides realize the bombing of cafe's and the destruction of schools, playgrounds, and entire towns only serves to advance the conflict not end it neither side will gain anything.

 

[callhimar]

Originally Posted by JinKazama

Completely untrue. Israeli's kill innocent Palestinians daily, yet their message is viewed as right and just, while there are people in Iraq killing members of our military because they see them as an occupying force and they are terrorists.

 The Israli's have gained nothing...they are still locked in a centuries old conflict, they have no peace, and THE ONLY place in the world where israel's actions are viewed as right and just is america.  Anybody with a level headed view of that conflict realizes that the Israeli's and Palestinians are two sides of the same coin...both sides want to see the total destruction of the other side and nobody with the mind to compromise is allowed to live (Rabin).  Until BOTH sides realize the bombing of cafe's and the destruction of schools, playgrounds, and entire towns only serves to advance the conflict not end it neither side will gain anything.
The Israeli's have gained nothing? That's a joke right? They aren't locked in anything. They're keeping Palestinians locked in a cage for lack of a better phrase with checkpoints, guns, and "security fences." It's the most notable example of people stealing land from an indigenous population and attempting to displace them/kill them since the colonization of America.

Also, a large portion of people on BOTH sides want peace, and don't actually want the complete destruction of the other. We are made to think that this is true, but its actually a small minority. Why do you think Rabin is looked at in Israel as a good person? Its not because the majority of people hated him.

But this is completely off topic.

 

[fac3 tak30v312]

Originally Posted by JinKazama

While I don't condone his actions, what in this world has been achieved without bloodshed?

 What has been achieved by shedding the blood of innocents?  The attempting killing of innocent people only gets your message ignored; even if they are collateral damage.  For all the great things Malcolm X and the black panthers did and stood for, the man who did the most to advance civil rights was a guy who no matter how many times he was kicked, beaten, spit on, harassed, and knocked down.  He stood back up and used his mind and not his fists. 

Blood shed is warranted when the ends justify the means.  Clearly this was not the case today. 
Seriously you gonna bring up the civil rights.
Getting back to the topic at hand he clearly stated that he did use his mind to it's full capacity and yielded zero results [read the part where he wrote about mailing local congresspeople, joining advocacy groups]. At the end of the day you need both rhetoric and force to influence change. Sticking to your civil rights example Malcolm X,  The Nation of Islam and the panthers allowed MLK Jr to take his stance opposite of them, without force on one end his rhetoric would've continued to fall on deaf ears. Usually leeway is not given because it's simple asked for but because there are no other alternative options [one other note on the topic of bloodshed and the civil rights movement .. what about the hundred -thousands of workers/advocates/supporters that were killed before it came into fruition]
If you want to look at a better example of this look into Castro and Che Guevara overthrowing of the Cuban government [by the way I'm talking about the initial campaign and not the subsequent corruption of power and isolation]
Also picking up one of his points/topics. The Government bailout. After the bailout thousands of small business owners hammered the government for leaving them at the wayside to either fold or come on the brink of folding, yet why are they still finding it hard to procure loans

Anyways like I said before I don't condone dukes actions since in this day and age one offs and shock value statements don't last and are simply swept by the wayside ..