Remy Ma-shETHER***Nicki Minaj diss***

[Magic33]

Still haven't told me how you determine winners and losers in Hip-Hop fam. Those guys who are "older" than me wouldn't be able to either.

Just because a train of thought is older doesn't make it correct, as proven by this exact conversation.

Embarassing

 

[Maximus Meridius]

That's your view and that's cool but hip hop has always been competitive, that's just a fact. From the 80's to about when the BFF era started and every now and then that competitiveness still comes out.



Yeah music is subjective but hip hop culture has always been like a sport or competition. And a lot of people just don't understand this culture.

Again, how do you go about determining winners and losers in Hip-Hop culture? Go back as far as you want culture wise, how would you do it other than sharing the same OPINION(S) as someone else.

When you say the cavs won the championship, there's actual proof of that.

When you say Biggie > Drake there's literally nothing you can use to make this true.

I don't know it you just playing dumb or what.


Of course there is no "Winner or Loser" but it's still a competitive genre. 2 rappers battling, going back and forth has been happening forever. It's one of the ways it was birthed. Like I said some ya'll just don't understand hip hop culture. It ain't for you to understand.

 

[rico x hood]

What if I think Hit me up is trash?

What if I think back to back is better than no vaseline?

How would you prove that these subjective opinions are wrong?

You can't and that's my point

That'd be you being contrary for the hell of it.

Yes music like all forms of art are subjective. But in all mediums there are works that set a standard of greatness and anything after would be compared to them. And that's how you can pick winners and losers. Which comes closer to the agreed upon standard.

 

[addict4sneakers]

I'll say it.

Hit em up was trash.

 

[P C H]

I don't know it you just playing dumb or what.


Of course there is no "Winner or Loser" but it's still a competitive genre. 2 rappers battling, going back and forth has been happening forever. It's one of the ways it was birthed. Like I said some ya'll just don't understand hip hop culture. It ain't for you to understand.

Fam all that can be true but if you can't proclaim a victor it can't be a sport.

And if you can't proclaim a victor how competitive is it really?

[emoji]129300[/emoji]

 

[skurrtskurrt29]

Again, how do you go about determining winners and losers in Hip-Hop culture? Go back as far as you want culture wise, how would you do it other than sharing the same OPINION(S) as someone else.

When you say the cavs won the championship, there's actual proof of that.

When you say Biggie > Drake there's literally nothing you can use to make this true.

You keep framing things as opinions when it's more of a general consensus between the fans that determine who wins what. If I told you Meek won the battle between him and Drake you'd laugh me off this board. Why? Because you and the people decided Drake had won and you'll give a number of examples why.

Hip Hop as a whole is the exact same way.

And I'm a fresh 26 so I don't know if I'm considered "old" or not

 

[P C H]

That'd be you being contrary for the hell of it.

Yes music like all forms of art are subjective. But in all mediums there are works that set a standard of greatness and anything after would be compared to them. And that's how you can pick winners and losers. Which comes closer to the agreed upon standard.

How you know I'm being a contrarian? Why can't I actually believe those things?

Exactly my point. You just said you can't pick winners and losers so how can it be a sport? How competitive is anything without winners and losers?

The concept of hip hop being a sport has been romanticized and passed around so much that it's taken as fact when it's the total opposite

 

[iamdef]

Because rap was about being the best, not who sold the most records.

When you first start rapping. You're trying to be the best on your block. In your school. In your city.

If you can't equate it to a sport, it's because of the generation you grew up in and because now it's not about trying to be the best emcee. Lil Uzi Vert isn't trying to be the best rapper. Lil Yachty isn't trying to be the best rapper. If Young Thug did a song with Pusha T, he's not trying to out rap him. When Nature did Banned From TV do you think he wanted to out rap Nas or Pun or just be on a song with them? You don't think Jay and Big weren't trying to have the best or wittiest verse on Young G's or BK's Finest? Meth will tell you about **** The World.

Rap used to be competitive.
 

Originally rap wasn't about being the best it was about story telling and self expression. It wasn't a competition at it's origin. It became competitive once it caught on but at it's very beginning, in it's infancy it was all about telling your personal story

What if I think Hit me up is trash?

What if I think back to back is better than no vaseline?

How would you prove that these subjective opinions are wrong?

You can't and that's my point

If nobody in here understands where you're coming from I get it. Creating a generic grading system for music/art is impossible

 

[P C H]

You keep framing things as opinions when it's more of a general consensus between the fans that determine who wins what. If I told you Meek won the battle between him and Drake you'd laugh me off this board. Why? Because you and the people decided Drake had won and you'll give a number of examples why.

Hip Hop as a whole is the exact same way.

And I'm a fresh 26 so I don't know if I'm considered "old" or not

The people voiced their opinion that drake won

All that means is that a lot of people think drake won. That doesn't mean it's right.

If I thought wanna know was better than charged up and b2b then I would think meek won and there's nothing you can do to prove that I'm wrong

 

[iamdef]

You keep framing things as opinions when it's more of a general consensus between the fans that determine who wins what. If I told you Meek won the battle between him and Drake you'd laugh me off this board. Why? Because you and the people decided Drake had won and you'll give a number of examples why.

Hip Hop as a whole is the exact same way.

And I'm a fresh 26 so I don't know if I'm considered "old" or not

But popular vote doesn't always equal truth, it's just the popular vote. There's no way to prove one is better than the other, other than saying which one was more popular

If you go to another board a people agree Meek won and Drake lost does that make him the winner all of a sudden?

 

[skurrtskurrt29]

The people voiced their opinion that drake won

All that means is that a lot of people think drake won. That doesn't mean it's right.

If I thought wanna know was better than charged up and b2b then I would think meek won and there's nothing you can do to prove that I'm wrong

Which is correct. Art is subjective.

But you're asking how do we determine winners. There's your answer.

 

[rico x hood]

How you know I'm being a contrarian? Why can't I actually believe those things?

Exactly my point. You just said you can't pick winners and losers so how can it be a sport? How competitive is anything without winners and losers?

The concept of hip hop being a sport has been romanticized and passed around so much that it's taken as fact when it's the total opposite

I didn't say you can't. I said you can. Whatever that's released that comes closest to what people have decided is the benchmark. We do it all the time I guess people never really notice it.

 

[Maximus Meridius]

I don't know it you just playing dumb or what.


Of course there is no "Winner or Loser" but it's still a competitive genre. 2 rappers battling, going back and forth has been happening forever. It's one of the ways it was birthed. Like I said some ya'll just don't understand hip hop culture. It ain't for you to understand.

Fam all that can be true but if you can't proclaim a victor it can't be a sport.

And if you can't proclaim a victor how competitive is it really?

[emoji]129300[/emoji]

Like I said it ain't for you.


It's pointless to keep going on about something YOU don't understand, even when it's broken down to you. Most hip hop fans understand and get this. The **** ain't rockets science. It's a like a sport, it's competitive, it's aggressive. Hip hop has been used for all types expressions. Dancing, clothes, battling etc. Those are just facts. YOU just don't get it.

 

[Magic33]

Originally rap wasn't about being the best it was about story telling and self expression. It wasn't a competition at it's origin. It became competitive once it caught on but at it's very beginning, in it's infancy it was all about telling your personal story

It's always been competitive.

It was about being the best DJ and rapper

You can see Melle Mel or Caz talk about it. It was about who was the best at rockin a party

Hell, watch The Get Down

 

[iamdef]

It's always been competitive.

It was about being the best DJ and rapper

You can see Melle Mel or Caz talk about it. It was about who was the best at rockin a party

Hell, watch The Get Down

It became competitive because more people got into it. The OGs didn't start rapping out the box against each other, they started rappin' about who they were, where they were from, and their life experiences.

 

[iamdef]

Which is correct. Art is subjective.

But you're asking how do we determine winners. There's your answer.

But if that's the case depending on who you ask the winners change.

 

[P C H]

Like I said it ain't for you.

It's pointless to keep going on about something YOU don't understand, even when it's broken down to you. Most hip hop fans understand and get this. The **** ain't rockets science. It's a like a sport, it's competitive, it's aggressive. Hip hop has been used for all types expressions. Dancing, clothes, battling etc. Those are just facts. YOU just don't get it.

Man literally NOTHING you said was a "Fact" fam come on

No one has broken anything down to me. It's A simple concept.  If Rap is a competitive sport, then how do we proclaim an UNEQUIVOCAL winner and loser? How sway?

You can't. You can only determine who's most popular. You can keep going on about "Culture" and how "I don't understand this" but you can't combat facts man. Hip-Hop has never, ever been a sport, its just been romanticized as one for the sake of the genre.

 

[P C H]

My man Makaveli the Don, young pac, rap god. Legend. My GOAT, out here championing himself as the victor in the east coast / west coast beef w/ what? Record sales

Why? Because that's the only tangible way to determine winners and losers if you wanna take it that route.

 

[Maximus Meridius]

Like I said it ain't for you.



It's pointless to keep going on about something YOU don't understand, even when it's broken down to you. Most hip hop fans understand and get this. The **** ain't rockets science. It's a like a sport, it's competitive, it's aggressive. Hip hop has been used for all types expressions. Dancing, clothes, battling etc. Those are just facts. YOU just don't get it.

Man literally NOTHING you said was a "Fact" fam come on

No one has broken anything down to me. It's A simple concept.  If Rap is a competitive sport, then how do we proclaim an UNEQUIVOCAL winner and loser? How sway?

You can't. You can only determine who's most popular. You can keep going on about "Culture" and how "I don't understand this" but you can't combat facts man. Hip-Hop has never, ever been a sport, its just been romanticized as one for the sake of the genre.

So hip hop ain't dancing, how you dress, battling? You really don't what the **** you talkin bout.


It's always funny to see some of ya'll expose yourselves. You, waves and the kid Flesh. Hearing ya'll lack of understanding about rap music really adds up to ya'll trash opinions.

 

[skurrtskurrt29]

I feel like y'all are making this more complicated than it needs to be.

Of course opinions change from person to person. But a general consensus is what gets mentioned in the grand scheme of things. Not what you or I think.

Man literally NOTHING you said was a "Fact" fam come on

No one has broken anything down to me. It's A simple concept.  If Rap is a competitive sport, then how do we proclaim an UNEQUIVOCAL winner and loser? How sway?

You can't. You can only determine who's most popular. You can keep going on about "Culture" and how "I don't understand this" but you can't combat facts man. Hip-Hop has never, ever been a sport, its just been romanticized as one for the sake of the genre.

What are the facts? That you clearly don't understand what's being said to you, and you don't like the answer so you keep repeating the same things over and over again?

 

[Maximus Meridius]

My man Makaveli the Don, young pac, rap god. Legend. My GOAT, out here championing himself as the victor in the east coast / west coast beef w/ what? Record sales Why? Because that's the only tangible way to determine winners and losers if you wanna take it that route.

And pull up Pac's interviews about battling and how rap is competitive.

 

[P C H]

So hip hop ain't dancing, how you dress, battling? You really don't what the **** you talkin bout.

It's always funny to see some of ya'll expose yourselves. You, waves and the kid Flesh. Hearing ya'll lack of understanding about rap music really adds up to ya'll trash opinions.

Oh this is great

 

[P C H]

And pull up Pac's interviews about battling and how rap is competitive.

 

[wavycrocket]

***** Still ain't prove P C H wrong though . I always appreciate challenging the way we think....and he's doing that, and dudes are resorting to "you don't know what you're talking about"....without rebuffing.

For the record....I do think hip hop is a competitive genre based on a losely agreed upon subjective metric and groupthink....

However, P C H has a point.

 

[Magic33]

I really think some of you are just being contrarian to be contrarian, because you can't be this obtuse

It became competitive because more people got into it. The OGs didn't start rapping out the box against each other, they started rappin' about who they were, where they were from, and their life experiences.

Who were they rapping against?

They were performing at Madison Square Garden and in clubs?