'We all suffer’: why San Francisco techies hate the city they transformed

[boris]

Treating people that defecate on streets / clearly mental problems to remain on the streets and have “freedom”.

To me, there is no difference between them and a 5 year old. I think it’s our responsibility as a society to bear the cross of costs to get them off the streets and into a safe space. A lot of liberals would call this forced help an affront to personal freedom and incarceration of someone that’s committed no crime.

It looks like they passed something recently to force people into treatment? However, I do see many issues with this.

And rent control.

Can you elaborate on why this stops common sense solutions?

And zoning laws.

I'm not sure zoning laws are limited to liberals.

And overall state / city / county budget policies toward social programs instead of public transportation infrastructure.

There are plenty of conservative policies that divert money away from public transportation infrastructure.

 

[moderndarwin]

I didn’t mean liberal as in democratic / republican. I don’t have a horse in that race. I meant liberal as in California (and US) in general is very sensitive and afraid to make hard decisions about human life.

Be it something like the death penalty or the forced care of mental problem homeless.

I’m also not saying that I’m right - just saying there’s consequences to our due process way of doing stuff here. And an immediate visceral consequence is that we’ve spent milllions and millions and there’s still people defecating on streets and with clear mental problems allowed to roam the streets.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion on it. That’s what makes democracy great. I also believe that’s where it has flaws. People are generally “good” but not objective. And we’re relying on people to vote and make tough decisions whereas most people don’t want to do that.

Personally, I’m actually fine with the way things are. I used to more strongly believe in the authoritatian way of getting stuff done (eg modern China). However, after Trump was elected that was enough to shock some sense into me on just how important our slow deliberate checks and balance system is. It’s unfortunate large scale stuff like infrastructure can’t get done but it also prevents a madman from taking over and enacting a bunch of policies that irreversibly change the fabric of our world.

 

[ajiiiplatinum]

Treating people that defecate on streets / clearly mental problems to remain on the streets and have “freedom”.

To me, there is no difference between them and a 5 year old. I think it’s our responsibility as a society to bear the cross of costs to get them off the streets and into a safe space. A lot of liberals would call this forced help an affront to personal freedom and incarceration of someone that’s committed no crime.

And rent control.

And zoning laws.

And overall state / city / county budget policies toward social programs instead of public transportation infrastructure.

Its disheartening to see America fall into the same issues as old 3rd world countries. We’re headed in a direction of elitism and the small have and different classes of have nots. It’s how in other countries (e.g., India, Brazil, etc) you end up mansions or complexes guarded by personal security teams next to the slums.

I see what you are saying but both liberals and conservatives would have issues with institutionalization if a homeless person has not committed a crime.
I agree that institutionalization is needed in many cases but personal liberties and freedom rights are a hurdle for liberals and conservatives.
You cant just pick up a person speaking to themselves and institutionalize them. The courts would have a problem.

 

[danikerhino]

Nevermind.

 

[moderndarwin]

I think we’re all saying reasonable stuff and just have different opinions on what degree of change is needed or how policies impact economics. It’s all good discourse.

To me it’s very fundamental. I think living on the street should be illegal. I think loitering on the street should be illegal. The street is not a place of residence or a place of business.

I get that the fallout from this can be handled in a multitude of ways - some oppressive, some unjust, some racist, etc. But personally, I’d be willing to go through the tough times of that for the better tomorrow. If we have to completely stop spending on 20 other programs to solve this problem i’m okay with that hard choice. To me, there is nothing worse than a developed “civilized” nation that is unwilling to take care of its most vulnerable citizens and allows them to live on the streets. I can’t get behind anything we do as a society if we as citizens allow that to be a reality of our life.

And I say this having travelled the world and seeing how continued exposure to this makes it seem like it’s okay and the norm. I never want to feel sensitized to it and I don’t want our country to feel sensitized to it either and allow it get worse as we continue to divide further between the haves and have nots.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Blaming "liberal" policies is just trying to pass off correlation as causation.

Any time house demand outpaces housing supply displacement is caused. Go look at what's happening in Boise right now. A deep red state.

NIMBYISM is found across the political spectrum. Local landowners always conspire against project that will lower housing cost

Zoning Laws are bad across the country, reforming them are popular with mainly wonks of the left. In fact it is older, richer, whiter boomers that like to keep zoning laws to protect property values. Guess which end of the ideological spectrum that demographic falls.

California's ****ty tax code is not he fault of any liberal policy.

It was conservatives that red lined minorities in urban areas decades ago, if minorities were allowed to follow whites to the cheaper suburbs at equal rates, then there would be more space in urban area to absorb the new influx

I grew up in the developing world. Defunding your social programs is a great way to make your state more like it. Go look at the find job the Deep South is doing in that area.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Americans, especially California, could solve housing affordability very easily if they were willing to make the tough decisions on zoning and taxation.

Also, public housing could solve the slum problem but god forbid Americans get comfortable for building decent public housing for anyone other than affluent college students.

 

[hand2handking]

Blaming "liberal" policies is just trying to pass off correlation as causation.

Any time house demand outpaces housing supply displacement is caused. Go look at what's happening in Boise right now. A deep red state.

NIMBYISM is found across the political spectrum. Local landowners always conspire project that will lower housing cost

Zoning Laws are bad across the country, reforming them are popular with mainly wonks of the left. In fact it is older, richer, whiter boomers that like to keep zoning laws to protect property values. Guess which end of the ideological spectrum that demographic falls.

California's ****ty tax code is not he fault of any liberal policy.

It was conservatives that red lined minorities in urban areas decades ago, if minorities were allowed to follow whites to the cheaper suburbs at equal rates, then there would be more space in urban area to absorb the new influx

I grew up in the developing world. Defunding your social programs is a great way to make your state more like it. Go look at the find job the Deep South is doing in that area.

dont forget to specifically point out the conservative asians contributing to the problem as per アミーゴ said

 

[RustyShackleford]

dont forget to specifically point out the conservative asians contributing to the problem as per アミーゴ said

Don't involve me with anything you have to say about any member of the Asian community famb.

 

[hand2handking]

Don't evole me with anything you have to say about any member of the Asian community famb.

famb

i didnt

i told you to say what he said

but since you wanna be that way

ofay okay my b typo

 

[sooperhooper]

I just hope Austin doesn't become the next sf bc it's already too expensive here by my standards.

 

[RustyShackleford]

I think we’re all saying reasonable stuff and just have different opinions on what degree of change is needed or how policies impact economics. It’s all good discourse.

To me it’s very fundamental. I think living on the street should be illegal. I think loitering on the street should be illegal. The street is not a place of residence or a place of business.

I get that the fallout from this can be handled in a multitude of ways - some oppressive, some unjust, some racist, etc. But personally, I’d be willing to go through the tough times of that for the better tomorrow. If we have to completely stop spending on 20 other programs to solve this problem i’m okay with that hard choice. To me, there is nothing worse than a developed “civilized” nation that is unwilling to take care of its most vulnerable citizens and allows them to live on the streets. I can’t get behind anything we do as a society if we as citizens allow that to be a reality of our life.

And I say this having travelled the world and seeing how continued exposure to this makes it seem like it’s okay and the norm. I never want to feel sensitized to it and I don’t want our country to feel sensitized to it either and allow it get worse as we continue to divide further between the haves and have nots.

If you are talking the welfare state, then you are talking about people dying. Because to fund large scale programs you need tons of funding, and if you are gonna do it through austerity measures elsewhere then health services have to be touched which means people will die. Not to mention the economic fallout that will happen with such austerity measures.

How about California reform its tax code that handcuffs them revenue wise, and making the richest pay more, before suggesting other vulnerable in society needing to be martyred

There are other golden gooses that can be slaughtered before we have to touch the social safety net.

 

[northoaklandfc]

good luck actually having a democratic Presidential nominee addressing this homeless situation out in da West coast.

Yo please tell me which one of your cracker friends got the answer on that conservative ticket.

Americans, especially California, could solve housing affordability very easily if they were willing to make the tough decisions on zoning and taxation.

We've been fighting this battle in the state legislature in the past 12 months. Unfortunately we've lost a couple battles, most notably the tactical stalling of Senate Bill 50.

I want to hope that momentum is gathering, most people seem to be onboard with dense, transit oriented, housing supply.

 

[ninjahood]

Yo please tell me which one of your cracker friends got the answer on that conservative ticket.

why would they rush to help a problem that was created, cultivated, and matured by liberals?

 

[ninjahood]

according to da whole internet, San Fran smells like piss when it rains

 

[datboi81]

Bruh they even changing the names of nieghborhoods and **** - like, "Ay check this out we ain't callin' it that no mo'."...

...the corner store in the hood I grew up in (LeDroit Park) now sells Port Wine and paninies.

That name change got me last time I was home. No longer “PG Plaza,” but now “The Mall at Prince George’s” I can only imagine what DC going to look like when I go home in August.

 

[blastercombo]

“Liberal politics are the problem”

*gets put in his place*

“When I say liberal politics I don’t man liberal politics.......”






The answer to the majority of problems is taxing those who have the most and continue to have the power to sway taxation to help themselves.

 

[M. Fresh]

I just hope Austin doesn't become the next sf bc it's already too expensive here by my standards.

Imo it already feels like it’s changing. A lot of transplants (from California) are trying to change the culture.

 

[DCAllAfrican]

Someone pooped in the self checkout area at target on lake in Minneapolis. **** was wild.

Maybe it was a got damn dog that Gentrifiers feel they should have the right to bring into any/every establishment in America.

I hate that man

 

[Platinum State]

I just hope Austin doesn't become the next sf bc it's already too expensive here by my standards.

That would suck because Austin is at the top of my list of cities I'd move to.
Seems a lot of cities are going through gentrification. I had no idea Denver was so damn expensive for example.

 

[アミーゴ]

dont forget to specifically point out the conservative asians contributing to the problem as per アミーゴ said

I said my building was mostly Asian - that is a fact. I NEVER said they were conservative. That isn’t my narrative.

I was still waiting for your take on what I said earlier. You said this belonged in the white thread when in fact not EVERY gentrifier is white.

 

[finessesosa]

I just hope Austin doesn't become the next sf bc it's already too expensive here by my standards.

its changing already it's too bad. Probably gonna end up like SF but not nearly as bad.

 

[ninjahood]

Imo it already feels like it’s changing. A lot of transplants (from California) are trying to change the culture.

Austin Texas will be safe because state governments will act as a backstop before it gets out of control like California has.

 

[finessesosa]

Austin Texas will be safe because state governments will act as a backstop before it gets out of control like California has.

This is true. It'll never end up like California or San Fran for that matter.

 

[freakydestroyer]

Anyone is going to sell their house to gentrifiers for the right price whether or not they agree with gentrification. Just like the same bozos who say "no snitching", but sing a different tune when they are facing some years.

So is it really the gentrifier's fault?