Would the Thunder be better WITHOUT westbrook?

Originally Posted by jmb1523

If it was Rondo instead of Russy, What would the Thunder do in late game situations where Rondo can be liability due to his poor FT shooting and tentative play?

Exactly what I wanted to say.

I can see scenarios where if you're Thunder fan where you'd be like "Damn...wish we had Rondo for situations like this"...and I also see ones where you'd be like "Damn...wish we still had Westbrook for situations like this".
 
Deron Williams or CP3 would definitely be a better fit. Both can still score when needed but are MUCH better passers then Westbrook. In the end it doesn't matter, because they're winning ball games, once that stops (if it ever does) trade rumors will start coming out.
 
Originally Posted by DIOR PAINT

Originally Posted by Mister Friendly

Honestly I'm not sure how much better Durant is than Westbrook when all things are considered. Yes Durant is far more talented but I think Westbrook is kinda like the Kobe to the Shaq, kinda like that 1A and 1B option even though we know one player should be way more dominant then the other.
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Reading is fundamental. You cant just pick some of my words and try to chance the spirit of it.
 
Originally Posted by verizonflow

Deron Williams or CP3 would definitely be a better fit. Both can still score when needed but are MUCH better passers then Westbrook. In the end it doesn't matter, because they're winning ball games, once that stops (if it ever does) trade rumors will start coming out.

Yet Williams is still leading the league in turnovers, although it doesn't really matter because all the top pgs and top players in general are within the 3-4 per game range and separated by fractions.

If D Will was on the Thunder, whatever team Westbrook was on would probably win because Russ always shuts his down and abuses him, ditto Rondo minus shutting him down but those are some of his better games too come against, in, Boston.

Plus defenders sandbagging off Rondo throw the whole spacing off would ruin any sets that involve cross screen action or cuts down the middle because his defender is is in the paint even though Rondo is at the 3 pt line. And as someone else mentioned, he can't shoot fts so I don't know what you do in late games with him. Teams either back so far off and force him to shoot or just foul him.

It won't matter how good of a passer you are the inevitable couple amount of times a game (and more in last yr's playoff) when the "offense" fails and KD doesn't get open enough for you to pass him the ball (doesn't always seal his defender well enough but still just stands there with his hand up after you standing at the top of the key waiting and now there's only 5 left on the clock and you have to say %$%* it and go 1 on 1 to create something.
 
why does russy get no respect...jeeez...dont let other ppl hype u up...hes an elite guard BAR NONE
 
Originally Posted by Wade187

Originally Posted by finnns2003

Originally Posted by Wade187

Only Rose and Deron really can have that team looking that good. A pass first pg like rondo who gets no respect from the D isn't gonna get the job done imo. He might get more people involved, but your removing Russys scoring and allowing the d to focus on durant making it more difficult for your number one option to score. He doesn't make this team better imo. CP3 I feel like would slow the team down too much, and again he has that pass first mentality, but can score. He might make them better, might not. 
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So when Rondo was putting up big numbers and no one else was stepping up, he got no respect? Ridiculous notion.

Rondo would make the Thunder a better team. There's a reason he has put up 7 or 8 straight games of 12+ assists
What made you think anything you just said even made a good enough response for you to press the post button? Do you know what a lack of respect is on D? After Rondo put up those big numbers they stopped sagging off him? Because at his best he averaged 12+ for 7 or 8 games that would replace Russy who averages 24+ points his career not just 7 or 8 games (12 assists=24 points 3's not considered). Not to mention the defense can now focus on locking down Durant, which will bring his numbers down unless all 12 of rondo's assist are going to him to make up for it. I don't even know why I'm writing all this seeing as how your reply wasn't even in context to what I said, if you choose to reply get Rondo's nuts out of your mouth long enough to gather your thoughts correctly please. 
The #@$!@ out of here with that garbage. Right now Rondo plays with a bunch of guys that are nowhere near KD's caliber. Westbrook is much too selfish for the team's good, and a guy like Rondo would compliment KD and Harden with the ability to drive and dish, as well as creating more space on the floor. Right now the C's offense struggles because the Celtics are not creating space, shooting far too many jumpers, and standing in place. 
Now, if you choose to stop with that fake basketball guru @!$!, use your brain and reply.
 
His defender is ALWAYS at least 6ft off of him, sagging into the paint daring him to shoot. How does that help create space?
 
Originally Posted by Scientific Method

His defender is ALWAYS at least 6ft off of him, sagging into the paint daring him to shoot. How does that help create space?
That's actually been helping lately as defenders are so far off that a big sets a screen, usually drawing their defender with them. Rondo will go around and usually pass to a big who has a mismatch and can drive to the basket. He's been piling up assists, but was scoring 20-30 ppg when scoring was needed. Acting like the Celtics' supporting cast is anywhere near OKC's is ridiculous. 
 
They're better catch and shooters though in terms of assists, not to mention a lot of his assists are questionable anyways (guys dribble, spin, pump fake, and score and he still gets credit). Harden and Durant like to iso a lot and drive, or draw fouls. Look at Harden's masterful pick and roll navigation, that's not going to get any assists for the point guard.
 
Originally Posted by Scientific Method

They're better catch and shooters though in terms of assists, not to mention a lot of his assists are questionable anyways (guys dribble, spin, pump fake, and score and he still gets credit). Harden and Durant like to iso a lot and drive, or draw fouls. Look at Harden's masterful pick and roll navigation, that's not going to get any assists for the point guard.
Good point but I think the added element of high pick and rolls could open a lot of movement for OKC. Not that it matters, Westbrook will not be traded and Rondo could be, so I don't really care.
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He seems to be passing lot more lately when I watch Thunder games.. well the highlights I see lol.
 
Best team in the West...complain about integral part of team scoring too many points. NT never ceases to amaze.
 
I like Westbrook and I think he could be greater than KD. Westbrook has that killer in him that I don't see in KD as much, from what I actually see. Especially because I think the pressure could be more detrimental to KD than Westbrook, relatively speaking. Meaning it could hamper KD, while I think Russ would thrive in it, a la Bird, Jordan, Kobe. KD seems too nice a guy and it wouldn't surprise me if Westbrook became the better player. Sure he still has to figure "it" out, whatever "it" actually is. But, I can definitely see him and Durant winning a couple and splitting Finals MVPs, although I'm a Lakers fan and I ONLY want the Lakes to win it.

I do believe their personalities mesh well, and that is the biggest reason, other than talent, they are so successful.
 
Originally Posted by finnns2003

Originally Posted by Scientific Method

His defender is ALWAYS at least 6ft off of him, sagging into the paint daring him to shoot. How does that help create space?
That's actually been helping lately as defenders are so far off that a big sets a screen, usually drawing their defender with them. Rondo will go around and usually pass to a big who has a mismatch and can drive to the basket. He's been piling up assists, but was scoring 20-30 ppg when scoring was needed. Acting like the Celtics' supporting cast is anywhere near OKC's is ridiculous. 

Not sure how Rondo still goes so unappreciated when he can rack up 18 points, 17 rebounds, and 20 assists in one game. Like, really? 
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Also unsure of how people accuse him of only getting his assists because of who he plays with. If that were true, he wouldn't be improving pretty much every year as the Big 3 get older and older. Their stats would be trending in similar directions, not the opposite, but whatever. 
 
Originally Posted by finnns2003

Originally Posted by Wade187

Originally Posted by finnns2003

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So when Rondo was putting up big numbers and no one else was stepping up, he got no respect? Ridiculous notion.

Rondo would make the Thunder a better team. There's a reason he has put up 7 or 8 straight games of 12+ assists
What made you think anything you just said even made a good enough response for you to press the post button? Do you know what a lack of respect is on D? After Rondo put up those big numbers they stopped sagging off him? Because at his best he averaged 12+ for 7 or 8 games that would replace Russy who averages 24+ points his career not just 7 or 8 games (12 assists=24 points 3's not considered). Not to mention the defense can now focus on locking down Durant, which will bring his numbers down unless all 12 of rondo's assist are going to him to make up for it. I don't even know why I'm writing all this seeing as how your reply wasn't even in context to what I said, if you choose to reply get Rondo's nuts out of your mouth long enough to gather your thoughts correctly please. 
The #@$!@ out of here with that garbage. Right now Rondo plays with a bunch of guys that are nowhere near KD's caliber. Westbrook is much too selfish for the team's good, and a guy like Rondo would compliment KD and Harden with the ability to drive and dish, as well as creating more space on the floor. Right now the C's offense struggles because the Celtics are not creating space, shooting far too many jumpers, and standing in place. 
Now, if you choose to stop with that fake basketball guru @!$!, use your brain and reply.
Son you in here arguing about Rondo and the Celtics as if it's relevant. The question was does Rondo make OKC a better team, not if Rondo is a better pg then Russ or the celtics or whatever the hell it is your rambling about. Westbrook is much too selfish for the teams good? Yet their winning? Makes perfect sense. His selfishness is effecting all the iso plays their running
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. KD and Harden don't need Rondo to compliment them, they get buckets on their own, Rondo in the game just places another defender in the vicinity because he sure as hell aint on Rondo. Scoring is not a issue for OKC with Westbrook on the squad, he is the number 2 scoring option on this squad, so how is Rondo making this team better? 
 
No, the thunder are not better without westbrook. he is a crucial part of a championship caliber team. if ty lawson was on the team instead of westbrook, they wouldnt be nearly as good
 
Originally Posted by MR J 858

Like I've said before here in S&T.

The Thunder are this decades new version of what the Sacramento Kings were during their heyday (2000 to 2003)

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Laker Fans 
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No way the Thunder would be better, but they should trade him for Rondo. Harden, KD, and that strong defensive front court would all up they're averages. 
 
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