Black Culture Discussion Thread

If you play any music from the 60s, 70s, 80s or 90s (ironically, a lot of these drill songs sample love ballads from the 90s and 2000s) for these young kids, and even some adults, they’ll tell you to turn that music off or that it’s boring. They want music to turn up to… to smoke and drink to.

But when their relative or friend gets murdered, they’ll be the first one screaming RIP and say we need to “Stop killing each other”.

There’s absolutely NO balance in the music industry anymore
 
Hmmmm…. Society as a WHOLE promotes violent music, people don’t want R&B music… they don’t want conscious rap (they don’t want the de la souls, tribes, the roots, etc)….

Then they want to cry about violence? It’s a such a cop out. We live in a lackluster society currently. People are aloof, desensitized and have low attention spans. The causation is not the music. Again, people want the violent music, they don’t want consciousness, R&B, jazz, etc so who’s really to blame? It’s the parents, the elders and they fans

the thing is i don't honestly believe most people make decisions based solely off their own identity. I think a lot of this is swayed by public perception & when the industry shifts to pushing billions of dollars behind a certain messaging society will start to feel the effects.

This current generation are the kids of our generation, who are old enough to have been around when the flip in hiphop music came, once it was realized how profitable it could be the mainstream America. Our generation ushered it in, you give it 20+ years to grow & then take away all gatekeepers & "old heads" add in the internet & you get the results we have now.

again music surely isn't the only factor in this, but it's been Gasoline and the flames keep getting bigger by the year.
 
Poverty and inequality are always the main factors contributing to violent crimes.

and very rarely is anyone not in agreeance with that notion.

however when already living in poverty, do you think hearing from the people you look up too, who made it out of the circumstances your in tell you to spend all your money on material things & to value your worth around that, to the point that goin to jail behind them is worth it..... is that not detrimental

If your a group dealing with inequality at the hands of others, logic would tell you we should be together, work together, help each other build.... so is it not detrimental that the music is literally telling you SOLELY to hate others who look like you from the same neighborhoods, telling you to rob them because their more successful, to try & get at they girl & ruin their relationship

I think everyone agrees behind what got us at this point, the point people in the thread are making is that we cannot afford to have self inflicted factors on top of what is already placed there. We KNOW this culture is unhealthy yet we continue to watch it be fed to our youth as if there's no issue with it.
 
While it's good statistical numbers to have Chinese culture & american culture are so vastly different idk how much that helps explain things

Definitely cultural differences - which is why IMHO Jamaican Government is seeking to change the culture.

The failure is refusing to change the environment.

People in Jamaica need jobs / industry.

Everything else is a Red Herring IMHO.


An island country in the Caribbean Sea, Jamaica shipped US$1.22 billion worth of goods around the globe in 2020.

That dollar amount reflects a -7% drop from $1.31 billion in 2017.

Year over year, revenues from Jamaican export sales declined by -26.2% from $1.65 billion during 2019.

The top 5 goods by value exported from Jamaica are aluminum oxide or hydroxide, refined petroleum oils, aluminum ores and concentrates, liquor, then a subgroup of yams, sweet potatoes and artichokes. Combined, Jamaica’s quintet of most valuable exported products accounted for 71.3% of the Caribbean island’s overall export tally.

Based on the average exchange rate for 2020, the Jamaican dollar depreciated by -11.3% against the US dollar since 2017 and fell by -6.8% from 2019 to 2020. Jamaica’s weaker local currency made Jamaican exports paid for in stronger US dollars relatively less expensive for international buyers.

Below are exports from Jamaica that result in negative net exports or product trade balance deficits. These negative net exports reveal product categories where foreign spending on home country Jamaica’s goods trail Jamaican importer spending on foreign products.

  1. Mineral fuels including oil: -US$643.5 million (Down by -51.9% since 2019)
  2. Machinery including computers: -$405.7 million (Down by -23.5%)
  3. Vehicles: -$404.2 million (Down by -24.7%)
  4. Electrical machinery, equipment: -$261.8 million (Down by -20.6%)
  5. Plastics, plastic articles: -$199.3 million (Down by -6.9%)
  6. Pharmaceuticals: -$164.4 million (Up by 2%)
  7. Cereals: -$145.9 million (Down by -8.5%)
  8. Miscellaneous food preparations: -$115.4 million (Down by -12.7%)
  9. Articles of iron or steel: -$100.5 million (Down by -27.2%)
  10. Paper, paper items: -$98.4 million (Down by -18.4%)
Jamaica incurred highly negative net exports and therefore deep international trade deficits under the mineral fuels including oil category. Deficits are greatest particularly for both refined and crude petroleum oils and, to a lesser extent, petroleum gases and coal.



With a 26% drop in exports and a 11% drop in currency (before the recession), and all the things people need to survive becoming more and more expensive - they could play Ave Maria on loudspeaker 24/7 and nothing would change.

 
I didn’t say it’s the root of the problem. However it is one of the problems. You want your schoolaz son or daughter singing ensure song? I don’t even know if there is a age restriction on content in Jamaica and if it is, it doesn’t appear to be enforced.

It is much better for everybody to implement content-rating boards/commissions that would classify media according to content/subject matter/age. However, it's a much more elaborate solution that requires an investment in time and money that elected officials are not always willing to make. Wholesale bans of problematic media are much easier and quicker to enact.
 
and very rarely is anyone not in agreeance with that notion.

however when already living in poverty, do you think hearing from the people you look up too, who made it out of the circumstances your in tell you to spend all your money on material things & to value your worth around that, to the point that goin to jail behind them is worth it..... is that not detrimental

If your a group dealing with inequality at the hands of others, logic would tell you we should be together, work together, help each other build.... so is it not detrimental that the music is literally telling you SOLELY to hate others who look like you from the same neighborhoods, telling you to rob them because their more successful, to try & get at they girl & ruin their relationship

I think everyone agrees behind what got us at this point, the point people in the thread are making is that we cannot afford to have self inflicted factors on top of what is already placed there. We KNOW this culture is unhealthy yet we continue to watch it be fed to our youth as if there's no issue with it.
But regardless of what they’re “fed” if theyre living in poverty, with less resources educationally, the prison industrial complex feeding them to prisons — how is the content of the music the solve for that?

The music could be detrimental, sure. But the 80s was nuts before rap even veered this direction. How do we explain that?
 
But regardless of what they’re “fed” if theyre living in poverty, with less resources educationally, the prison industrial complex feeding them to prisons — how is the content of the music the solve for that?

The music could be detrimental, sure. But the 80s was nuts before rap even veered this direction. How do we explain that?

I’m not sure how many times I’ve stated that I don’t expect the music changing to solve all black people ills

But y’all got it man 😂

On a whole other note imagine Malcolm X trying to be Malcolm X in todays climate, I know the times weren’t welcoming to him then but now?
 
Definitely cultural differences - which is why IMHO Jamaican Government is seeking to change the culture.

The failure is refusing to change the environment.

People in Jamaica need jobs / industry.

Everything else is a Red Herring IMHO.


An island country in the Caribbean Sea, Jamaica shipped US$1.22 billion worth of goods around the globe in 2020.

That dollar amount reflects a -7% drop from $1.31 billion in 2017.

Year over year, revenues from Jamaican export sales declined by -26.2% from $1.65 billion during 2019.

The top 5 goods by value exported from Jamaica are aluminum oxide or hydroxide, refined petroleum oils, aluminum ores and concentrates, liquor, then a subgroup of yams, sweet potatoes and artichokes. Combined, Jamaica’s quintet of most valuable exported products accounted for 71.3% of the Caribbean island’s overall export tally.

Based on the average exchange rate for 2020, the Jamaican dollar depreciated by -11.3% against the US dollar since 2017 and fell by -6.8% from 2019 to 2020. Jamaica’s weaker local currency made Jamaican exports paid for in stronger US dollars relatively less expensive for international buyers.

Below are exports from Jamaica that result in negative net exports or product trade balance deficits. These negative net exports reveal product categories where foreign spending on home country Jamaica’s goods trail Jamaican importer spending on foreign products.

  1. Mineral fuels including oil: -US$643.5 million (Down by -51.9% since 2019)
  2. Machinery including computers: -$405.7 million (Down by -23.5%)
  3. Vehicles: -$404.2 million (Down by -24.7%)
  4. Electrical machinery, equipment: -$261.8 million (Down by -20.6%)
  5. Plastics, plastic articles: -$199.3 million (Down by -6.9%)
  6. Pharmaceuticals: -$164.4 million (Up by 2%)
  7. Cereals: -$145.9 million (Down by -8.5%)
  8. Miscellaneous food preparations: -$115.4 million (Down by -12.7%)
  9. Articles of iron or steel: -$100.5 million (Down by -27.2%)
  10. Paper, paper items: -$98.4 million (Down by -18.4%)
Jamaica incurred highly negative net exports and therefore deep international trade deficits under the mineral fuels including oil category. Deficits are greatest particularly for both refined and crude petroleum oils and, to a lesser extent, petroleum gases and coal.



With a 26% drop in exports and a 11% drop in currency (before the recession), and all the things people need to survive becoming more and more expensive - they could play Ave Maria on loudspeaker 24/7 and nothing would change.


Jamaica isn't the only country within the Caribbean to be going through the struggles you highlighted. If you look across the region you'll see a number of the countries are experiencing similar issues for the period you've listed. In fact, some are experiencing a much higher decrease in goods exported ( see Barbados for example).

Back to your comment In regards to industry development within Jamaica. Throughout the various economic sectors, there is a development and an increase across the board within the last few years.

Jamaica: Share of economic sectors in the gross domestic product (GDP) from 2011 to 201
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Jamaica's GDP has also increased.


Annual percentage growth rate of GDP at market prices based on constant local currency. Aggregates are based on constant 2010 U.S. dollars. GDP is the sum of gross value added by all resident producers in the economy plus any product taxes and minus any subsidies not included in the value of the products. It is calculated without making deductions for depreciation of fabricated assets or for depletion and degradation of natural resources.
  • Jamaica gdp growth rate for 2021 was 4.60%, a 14.6% increase from 2020.
  • Jamaica gdp growth rate for 2020 was -10.00%, a 10.89% decline from 2019.
  • Jamaica gdp growth rate for 2019 was 0.89%, a 1% decline from 2018.
  • Jamaica gdp growth rate for 2018 was 1.89%, a 0.89% increase from 2017.


Funny you put that song cause War Lord cause he had the following to say

bounty killa.png
 
I’m not sure how many times I’ve stated that I don’t expect the music changing to solve all black people ills

But y’all got it man 😂

On a whole other note imagine Malcolm X trying to be Malcolm X in todays climate, I know the times weren’t welcoming to him then but now?
I mean I hear you I just think its more of a distraction to focus on that stuff than the root issues. Like a said, how do we explain the 80s? “Gangster” rap wasn’t even big yet.
 
I mean I hear you I just think its more of a distraction to focus on that stuff than the root issues. Like a said, how do we explain the 80s? “Gangster” rap wasn’t even big yet.

I'm trying to get people to focus on smaller issues that can actually be obtainable.... Unless your willing to grab weapons & literally go to war against America your not fixing or correcting the root issues. Have you seen this country, have you been here the past few years? what about this society or government gives you hope that America is going to come together & rid us of the root issues

this country literally didn't view black people as human, racism & inequality is literally what built this country, do you think america is gonna up end their own system to make things fair for black people?

At some point we have got to realize that any change is going to have to come from us & realize when **** is going off the rails. The **** that's celebrated in this culture have to reimagined because that can happen way easier then ending poverty or inequality, you can't even begin to challenge those issues when the most popular music in your culture in promoting hate against each other & reliance on europeans
 
I'm trying to get people to focus on smaller issues that can actually be obtainable....
I agree with this. But rap music being it? Not going to work, IMO. Would rather focus on working with youth in these areas we live in, making sure they have opportunities available, mentorship, etc. Each of these things are independent of rap music — if you agree that kids are being fed these things to idolize, why not step up and make that a first step.
this country literally didn't view black people as human, racism & inequality is literally what built this country, do you think america is gonna up end their own system to make things fair for black people?
This is a straw man, though. Literally never said or suggested this.
The **** that's celebrated in this culture have to reimagined because that can happen way easier then ending poverty or inequality, you can't even begin to challenge those issues when the most popular music in your culture in promoting hate against each other & reliance on europeans
I hear you, but think that this is like a chicken or the egg conversation. It’s hard to address crime without addressing poverty — I think honestly that suggesting that there’s some deep seeded cultural issues with Black people plays right into the white supremacist playbook, IMO.
 
I agree with this. But rap music being it? Not going to work, IMO. Would rather focus on working with youth in these areas we live in, making sure they have opportunities available, mentorship, etc. Each of these things are independent of rap music — if you agree that kids are being fed these things to idolize, why not step up and make that a first step.

This is a straw man, though. Literally never said or suggested this.

I hear you, but think that this is like a chicken or the egg conversation. It’s hard to address crime without addressing poverty — I think honestly that suggesting that there’s some deep seeded cultural issues with Black people plays right into the white supremacist playbook, IMO.

wwe-stone-cole.gif
 
Do Black people from upper-middle class or upper class backgrounds have these issues too?

Yes obviously being poor increases these issues, but they still suffer from the same cultural issues.

distrust & jealousy of one another, Drug abuse, the idolization of European standards & things, The disrespecting of women, the same pressure to be "street" even tho that isn't their upbringing. Hiphop culture isn't exclusive to just black people living in poverty

I don't know how many stories have been told about kids who left their comfy upbringing to go do hood **** because it was "cool". that is my issue, yes obviously other things must be done to change the current state.

All some people in the thread have been saying is that this current culture is polluting the mindset of the youth & it makes it harder to get results. good luck mentoring a kid when they idolize a dopeboy more than the college grad in the hood, good luck trying to get a kid to focus on school/sports when they have a perk addiction at 14, good luck trying to steer a kid into a proper career path when all they idolize is fast money
 
Yes obviously being poor increases these issues, but they still suffer from the same cultural issues.
I think this is wayyyy off. Of course you can find outliers to prove your point, but Black upper class kids (that I’ve been around or have proximity to) by and large do not have these same issues.
good luck mentoring a kid when they idolize a dopeboy more than the college grad in the hood, good luck trying to get a kid to focus on school/sports when they have a perk addiction at 14, good luck trying to steer a kid into a proper career path when all they idolize is fast money
But dope boys being idolized and the fast money thing goes back to the same issue lol. If you’re saying you want to focus on small things, how can you be dismissive of focusing on helping individual kids to try and change their course, provide guidance, etc., — but willing to point to rap music as the thing that’s going to be the major help to change the culture here.


distrust & jealousy of one another, Drug abuse, the idolization of European standards & things, The disrespecting of women, the same pressure to be "street" even tho that isn't their upbringing. Hiphop culture isn't exclusive to just black people living in poverty
I think few of these things are specific to hip hop culture. Obviously we agree with the idea that hip hop glorifies some of these things, but a lot of this is poverty/white supremacy. Not like the white homes are so respectful of women. White culture is laden with sexism for example.
 
I think this is wayyyy off. Of course you can find outliers to prove your point, but Black upper class kids (that I’ve been around or have proximity to) by and large do not have these same issues.

But dope boys being idolized and the fast money thing goes back to the same issue lol. If you’re saying you want to focus on small things, how can you be dismissive of focusing on helping individual kids to try and change their course, provide guidance, etc., — but willing to point to rap music as the thing that’s going to be the major help to change the culture here.



I think few of these things are specific to hip hop culture. Obviously we agree with the idea that hip hop glorifies some of these things, but a lot of this is poverty/white supremacy. Not like the white homes are so respectful of women. White culture is laden with sexism for example.

Aite we'll just agree to disagree bro because this is obviously gonna go nowhere
 
Neither one of y'all are wrong.

From what I read it sounds like y'all saying the same thing with different words.

Boils down to accountability.

“Radio has to be radio still, so I can’t disagree. I had songs been banned in the past when there wasn’t even no internet and it didn’t affect the songs it even made dem more in demand,” Bounty stated.

“But, it’s the disc jocks dem that loves to follow what’s playing in parties and the streets. Radio should stick to its format. Not every song was made for radio. Simple,” he added.

Bounty was at pains to point out those who did not comprehend the BCJ’s statements about songs unfit for airplay, that the directive had nothing to do with Jamaica’s anti-crime measures, as was being bandied about.

Instead, the Coppershot artist made it clear that the Commission was simply carrying out its mandate by reinforcing the fact that certain types of songs have never belonged on public radio, this after one commenter stated that “the real cause of crime is not the music” and that music was being scapegoated “because the government has know solution for how to fight the monster called crime”.

“The way we live amongst ourselves is much more of an influence than music, sports or fashion. Art imitates life so anything the music saying is what society doing right or wrong, like it or not. But the radio is being governed by a commission so that’s their rights to decides what plays or not but it has ntn to do with crime,” the Living Dangerously artist countered.

“Is corruption, injustice, prejudice, inequalities etc breeds crime; not music or any form of entertainment. Then I would surly become like Scar Face or Rambo in the early 90s. Radio can’t affect music certain again anymore so no sleeps lost here👌🏾,” Bounty Killer added.

A while later he declared: “… banning songs only hurt the fans who has no internet access today I could think bcuz how much percentage of fans had no internet access in this day and age… Not every song that’s good for radio is for the parties all the times it goes both ways”.


Last week, Cordell Green, the Executive Director of the Broadcasting Commission of Jamaica issued a stern rebuke to radio disc jockeys who expressed disapproval about the State agency’s directive prohibiting the airing of songs that promote/glorify violence, scamming, and use of the drug “Molly.”

Green had said that there has been a systemic violation of the rules by many disc jockeys employed by some radio stations, who push unwholesome music, while their artistes who record clean, wholesome content are brushed aside and ignored.

As for disc jockeys who expressed disagreement with the directive, Green said they should leave public radio, as their utterances objecting to the crackdown on the illicit activities, is proof that they ought not to be on public airwaves in the first place.

Last week Tuesday, 13 years after the BCJ ordered radio stations that were playing violent musical content, on the national airwaves to quit, the State had issued another similar directive, this time adding the prohibition of the party drug molly, and lotto scamming to the mix.

The directive which came under the signature of Green, was similar to one issued in February 2009 by then BCJ chairman Dr Hopeton Dunn, prohibiting the “transmission of any recording, live song or music which promotes or glorifies any offence such as murder, rape mob violence and other offences such as arson”.

Green, in his directive had stated that the “airwaves have to be kept free of harmful content given the important role traditional media still plays as agents of socialisation” and “that the use of the public airwaves to broadcast songs that promote/glorify illegal activity could give the wrong impression that criminality is an accepted feature of Jamaican culture and society.”

 
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