Do people really believe in Angels?

[futuremd]

See this is what I'm talking about.

You take the time to give detailed responses  but now it turns into "you don't get laid"

PLEASE tell me when that last time was. I'm curious to see when you seem to know the last time that was. 

touchy touchy, i didnt say you dont get laid you did..i should've said go get some fresh air..you claim to be so intelligent yet lack basic comprehension skills.

No. You implied that I "don't get laid" when you told me to get off line and to go do so. 

Don't play me. You wouldn't have insinuated that trope for no reason. 

 

[ice shattered]

Let's be clear, I didn't suggest that God created anything. What I did suggest is that some feel that once you begin to learn how to survive, that this is when you begin to know and worship God, especially under those circumstances. The absence of God, lies in not knowing how to survive.

It's a very fundamental belief. You do what you gotta do, as it's stated that the first right of every human being, is self preservation.

I get what you're saying but in that regard didn't God ultimately create the hole since he's all knowing/omniscient and being that it's a part of God's plan? For instances if there's a kid in Africa, never introduced to religion, and overcomes poverty homelessness starvation etc would that be God putting the motivation in him without him knowing? Or just his instinct to say I have to survive? By that logic wouldn't any atheist be doomed to die/wither away since God is absent in their life and they don't believe? Futuremd doesn't believe in God or a higher power but he obviously knows how to survive.

 

[mycoldyourdone]

Yes people do really believe in angels.

What they look like and what they do is all subjective to the person. just like their view on god. its never the same for everyone. you just have a bunch of people believing in something they dont even agree on being the exact same thing. just the "main" points. its a whole bunch of nothing and waste of thought. but whatever makes you happy.....

 

[futuremd]

See, but even then, thats just a social understanding.

Thats not a "soul" 

Otherwise "democracy" is the "soul"

You say that you've been around the dying. Once the person has deceased, did you have the chance to look them in the eye as they passed?

If so, was there a difference in their presence when they passed? Any less of a feeling, or connection? 

Was there a feeling in their presence? 

No.

I saw them die.

I felt bad, but it was what it was. Its not easy to watch, but you witnessing the death of someone doesn't mean that there is some magic that happens.

I saw them close their eyes and die.

Body went limp and cold.

Didn't cry.

Just watched.

Death is pretty unremarkable. 

 

[longstroke]

You about reps right? I just gave you one on your last respond to me. Happy now, buddy?

I am about many things, but I am not about to entertain you even further, due to your babysitter falling asleep.

 

[papageorgeo510]

I am about many things, but I am not about to entertain you even further, due to your babysitter falling asleep.

Ok buddy

 

[longstroke]

Was there a feeling in their presence? 

No.

I saw them die.

I felt bad, but it was what it was. Its not easy to watch, but you witnessing the death of someone doesn't mean that there is some magic that happens.

I saw them close their eyes and die.

Body went limp and cold.

Didn't cry.

Just watched.

Death is pretty unremarkable. 

Do you think that perhaps you are a bit jaded, not feeling as much due to being used to the experience? Some would say that a body gone cold, is the soul actually leaving the body.

 

[futuremd]

I have been RIGHT NEXT TO SOMEONE AS THEY DIED AND I HAVE BEEN AROUND CADAVERS.

WHAT IS A SOUL AND WHERE IS IT?

WHY? I don't know. 

Why do you breathe and eat down the same tube? 

HOW do we use it? Its used to have extreme/intense dreams and is theorized to be released when you die, however I don't completely understand the studies behind the latter claim. How are the measuring that release and how aware are they that the release of this chemical is that much more present than other chemicals? 

There is a lot of research with it though and I'm interested to see what it leads to.

However, how does that have ANYTHING to do with the soul or anything supernatural? 

Chemicals altering the state of perception does NOT then mean = God. 

Cause you keep bringing up cadaver like your insinuating that you've looked throw the body for scientific evidence of a soul or a compartment for a soul.  When actuality just like you've stated science doesn't have all the answer.  So to ask for scientific evidence of where the soul is makes no sense.  Especially when you yourself say science doesn't have all the answers, and some of the answers they do have are not answers at all.  More like insinuations.  Like evolution.

Evolution isn't an insinuation. Its a fact. Its the foundation of modern medicine and biology. Period.

Its observed in biology, ecology, anthropology, physiology, and genetics.

Thats how I know how little you understand what science actually is. 

I'm asking where a soul is because you clearly say it exists. 

So where is it? 

Science "changing" doesn't mean a soul doesn't exist. However, you claim to have found it. Please show where it is and collect your Nobel Prize. 

But to stop toying with you, and beating around the bush.  Not like your going to try to understand anyway.  I spent three days in ICU literally three entire days.  It was all good until the wee morning of the third day and all hope was out the window, and from that point until the end the lights where trippin for the entire time.  After it was all said and done everything went back to normal.  But I'm sure there was some type of scientific explanation, right?  The electricians where doing some work.

You survived. 

And?
 

Would you rather have died?

You neglected the fact that YOU WERE IN THE ICU. Thats MODERN MEDICINE.

How come you weren't praying to get better?

I'm PRETTY sure that hospital had something to do with it. 
 

You want evidence of something you don't believe in. 

Actually, if its true, it wouldn't matter if I believe in it. It would be true and there would be no debate about it.

Something that you need to believe in to get evidence. 

Nope.

That makes no sense.

God is not going to be out to prove himself to someone who doesn't believe in him in the first place. 

So god exists because you want god to exist.

So I guess spiderman isn't going to reveal himself to those who don't believe in him in the first place. 

If I called you out for being a fake fonie this, you ain't going to be no doctor that.  Would you bend over backwards to prove yourself to me?  No, you'd keep on with your mission to help the ones that do believe in you. 

What?

 Why?  Because you know that no matter what evidence you bring showing me your the real deal I'm still going to discard it and continue to mock you.  Why?  Because I don't want to believe in you.

Belief is not subject to the will.

What is scientific proof? 

Something that is provable, testable, and falsifiable. 

Who even gives a F about it? 

The people in the ICU whose space you wasted while you were tripping out.

Scientist and people that dedicated most of there life to it

Yeah, next time, don't go to the ER like you did. Just go pray about it.

.  Instead of being out experiencing feelings, living life to the fullest, and allowing there mind explore it's own logic.

I guess doctors and scientists don't have feelings or live life to the fullest.

Because the mind is all there is to life right. 

Feelings don't have scientific proof either other then measuring brian activity which prayer is also measureable as well. 

Actually, studies on prayer show it to be ineffective.

Feelings do have "proof" as they are linked by both brain activity patterns and systems of behavior that are typified and repeatedly observed, even among different cultures.

 Belief in God is not scientific and it will never be.

Good. That means that you're just going to make stuff up that you can't prove and believe it only because you want to believe in it.

I hope you're praying to the right god.

It's a personal thing that science will never prove for you.  Only you can you allow God to prove himself to you.

Right. I have to believe god exists for god to exist.

Do you see how little sense that makes? 

And UFO's are angels.

A UFO is an unidentified flying object. Thats anything from a stealth jet to ANYTHING that flies and you can't identify. 

From a rock in being thrown from the corner of your sight, OR a bird flying past in a blur. 

And there are good angels and bad angels

What is an angel?

 

[Master Zik]

I do think that he does have more reps than you though.....

You may not think that he's liked, but something's going on!

Checkout the year I joined, this rep thing is a new thing buddy and I could care less about it, baby girl.

@ trying to pit join date against reps as if that means anything.

You could've registered in 99 and still be a nobody.

 

[futuremd]

Was there a feeling in their presence? 

No.

I saw them die.

I felt bad, but it was what it was. Its not easy to watch, but you witnessing the death of someone doesn't mean that there is some magic that happens.

I saw them close their eyes and die.

Body went limp and cold.

Didn't cry.

Just watched.

Death is pretty unremarkable. 

Do you think that perhaps you are a bit jaded, not feeling as much due to being used to the experience? Some would say that a body gone cold, is the soul actually leaving the body.

Nope.

The body going cold is merely the fact that...ITS DEAD. There is no more biological activity present.

The metabolic and homeostatic processes within it maintain its temperature. 

 

[longstroke]

I get what you're saying but in that regard didn't God ultimately create the hole since he's all knowing/omniscient and being that it's a part of God's plan? For instances if there's a kid in Africa, never introduced to religion, and overcomes poverty homelessness starvation etc would that be God putting the motivation in him without him knowing? Or just his instinct to say I have to survive? By that logic wouldn't any atheist be doomed to die/wither away since God is absent in their life and they don't believe? Futuremd doesn't believe in God or a higher power but he obviously knows how to survive.

No.

The difference according to some faiths, is that the true God did not create this plane of existence, as this is actually the devil's doing, simply an illusion, thus we all being born of sin.

 

[futuremd]

I get what you're saying but in that regard didn't God ultimately create the hole since he's all knowing/omniscient and being that it's a part of God's plan? For instances if there's a kid in Africa, never introduced to religion, and overcomes poverty homelessness starvation etc would that be God putting the motivation in him without him knowing? Or just his instinct to say I have to survive? By that logic wouldn't any atheist be doomed to die/wither away since God is absent in their life and they don't believe? Futuremd doesn't believe in God or a higher power but he obviously knows how to survive.

No.

The difference according to some faiths, is that the true God did not create this plane of existence, as this is actually the devil's doing, simply an illusion, thus we all being born of sin.

My point is that, WHO CARES what some faiths believe?

Can any of them prove what they're saying?

Having a diversity of opinion doesn't mean anything when no one is actually trying to validate what they're saying. 

 

[longstroke]

Nope.

The body going cold is merely the fact that...ITS DEAD. There is no more biological activity present.

The metabolic and homeostatic processes within it maintain its temperature. 

So when you look into eyes of another being, you see nothing other than the reaction to social conditioning?

Or do you ever see something else in there, something much deeper?

 

[mycoldyourdone]

 

[RIP sleazyy]

Nope.

The body going cold is merely the fact that...ITS DEAD. There is no more biological activity present.

The metabolic and homeostatic processes within it maintain its temperature. 

So when you look into eyes of another being, you see nothing other than the reaction to social conditioning?

Or do you ever see something else in there, something much deeper?

wut

 

[futuremd]

Nope.

The body going cold is merely the fact that...ITS DEAD. There is no more biological activity present.

The metabolic and homeostatic processes within it maintain its temperature. 

So when you look into eyes of another being, you see nothing other than the reaction to social conditioning?

When I'm not thinking about it? Not really. 

But in the back of my mind...sure.

But I am NOT a solipsist. 

Or do you ever see something else in there, something much deeper?

You mean that pseudo-poetic means of "connecting" with people? 

Its all nonsense that people who WANT there to be things use to express themselves.

Its just all empty language that people use who never take the time to validate anything they're saying. 

 

[Johnny_Cakes]

 

[longstroke]

My point is that, WHO CARES what some faiths believe?

Can any of them prove what they're saying?

Having a diversity of opinion doesn't mean anything when no one is actually trying to validate what they're saying. 

Understood, but here's the thing, the only guarantee we have in life, is that we are going to die. 

What some beliefs do present does help people to prepare for that inevitability, probably a bit better than let's say not believing anything at all.

At this point nobody knows for sure if a soul exists, and then what happens to that soul if it indeed does exist, after we pass.

It's said that nothing is wasted in life, I am quite sure that the essence of a human being can have some value in the next life, if there is indeed one.

 

[futuremd]

Theres an angel I can believe in. 

 

[longstroke]

When I'm not thinking about it? Not really. 

But in the back of my mind...sure.

But I am NOT a solipsist. 

You mean that pseudo-poetic means of "connecting" with people? 

Its all nonsense that people who WANT there to be things use to express themselves.

Its just all empty language that people use who never take the time to validate anything they're saying. 

Naw. 

 

[offwhitewhite]

This is what I'm trying to say...

What do you call yourself as in what you do everyday, think about it, talk about it, your opinions, your beliefs, your stances on topics, etc.What do you say that is? When you hang out with your friends you never act exactly the same.  If someone asks you, "Hey you, who are you?" What are you describing? You're describing yourself aren't you? But who are you? You're more than a brain and a heart.

That's what a soul is to me. You can dictate whatever you want to be or do. We all have the same body parts and the same capabilities but we all do things differently. There is no single person that has ever lived on this planet that were every two of the same.  Quick google search... There were around 108 BILLION people to ever live the earth. There's no way two of them were ever the same.

 

[futuremd]

My point is that, WHO CARES what some faiths believe?

Can any of them prove what they're saying?

Having a diversity of opinion doesn't mean anything when no one is actually trying to validate what they're saying. 

Understood, but here's the thing, the only guarantee we have in life, is that we are going to die. 

What some beliefs do present does help people to prepare for that inevitability, probably a bit better than let's say not believing anything at all.

I don't care what beliefs let people cope with, honestly.

Its not better than not-believing in anything. 

Frankly, if you're going to believe something that isn't TRUE, REAL, or VALID I don't want you in charge of anything important. 

I'm getting to the point where I really can't understand that in 2012, why its acceptable for people to think that its reasonable to think its ok to believe things TO BE TRUE, merely because you want them to be true.

That is the pinnacle of dishonesty.

At this point nobody knows for sure if a soul exists, and then what happens to that soul if it indeed does exist, after we pass.

It's said that nothing is wasted in life, I am quite sure that the essence of a human being can have some value in the next life, if there is indeed one.

See this is what I'm talking about.

You COULD be right, but if you're going to assert that THERE IS A NEXT LIFE, the you must substantiate this claim. 

YOU MUST.

Otherwise, its equally plausible that you're actually a TV in a bowl of ice cream speaking in the language of plastic.

Doesn't make sense? Well thats too bad. You just have to believe. 

 

[futuremd]

This is what I'm trying to say...

What do you call yourself as in what you do everyday, think about it, talk about it, your opinions, your beliefs, your stances on topics, etc.What do you say that is? 

Thats a person. 

When you hang out with your friends you never act exactly the same.  If someone asks you, "Hey you, who are you?" What are you describing? You're describing yourself aren't you? But who are you? You're more than a brain and a heart.

Actually...you're just a skin bag of floating chemistry on calcium scaffolding trying to figure out how to get your next nut.

When theres a bunch of you around, you have to find a way to make money so you can bust more nuts and eat a little better.

What does this have to do with the question I keep asking you? 

What is a soul and where is it?

That's what a soul is to me. You can dictate whatever you want to be or do.

If you're talking about something that doesn't have a definition, then you're not talking about anything.

We all have the same body parts and the same capabilities but we all do things differently. There is no single person that has ever lived on this planet that were every two of the same.  Quick google search... There were around 108 BILLION people to ever live the earth. There's no way two of them were ever the same.

SO???

How does this equate to what you say a "soul" is? 

You claim a soul exists.

What is a soul and where is it?

 

[longstroke]

I don't care what beliefs let people cope with, honestly.

Its not better than not-believing in anything. 

Frankly, if you're going to believe something that isn't TRUE, REAL, or VALID I don't want you in charge of anything important. 

I'm getting to the point where I really can't understand that in 2012, why its acceptable for people to think that its reasonable to think its ok to believe things TO BE TRUE, merely because you want them to be true.

That is the pinnacle of dishonesty.

See this is what I'm talking about.

You COULD be right, but if you're going to assert that THERE IS A NEXT LIFE, the you must substantiate this claim. 

YOU MUST.

Otherwise, its equally plausible that you're actually a TV in a bowl of ice cream speaking in the language of plastic.

Doesn't make sense? Well thats too bad. You just have to believe. 

I understand what you are saying, but humor me for a moment further, while in the womb, did we actually know what was in store for us out here?

 

[frankmatthews]

This is the only thing I disagree with you on, is what I highlighted.


I don't want to be adamant about what exists and what doesn't exist.


I want to be adamant about the value of evidence and proof over wild assertions and speculation.

If you're going to assert something, you are responsible for substantiating that claim. Period. 

Anyone can craft a theory while sitting on the toilet or lounging on the couch when they're high. 

Ok ok, so what if they don't assert it then? What if they just casually mention it on the internet, in a thread, on a message board, about sneakers? Can you let em slide with that?

But yes, of course, the value of evidence and proof far outweighs wild assertions and speculation, no doubt about it. One would have to be literally insane to believe otherwise. Yet every now and then some of these wild assertions end up evidenced so perhaps it would serve you well to humble yourself on occasion.

Perhaps your brains remedial reasoning capabilities along with your primitive technologies are not sufficient enough to grasp the empirical evidence that lays in waiting for intelligent observation. Was the earth round before or after it was proven?