Florida School Shooting, Over 20 Casualties

a-friend said:
It's like they think this thread is making a difference.
Liking each others posts, power in groups, ignoring the concerns of the other side or flat out not listening, name calling....wow, way to start the War on Guns.
Hey, but at least they leave the thread with their head held high "boy we sure got more reps than the other side today"

NBA back though, I can unwatch this circle-jerk.

Like, TEK was down for a decent discussion, and most of you didn't even realize it, you just called him a "Gun NUT" instead.
Fight on Freedom Fighters.
a-friend out
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Spot on. These guys can't be objective...name calling,circle jerking,posting a tweet from twitter which counts as win for em on a serious topic,Zero facts just pure emotion.
 
I can understand bolt action rifles for hunting

Shotguns for hunting and home defense

But what’s the point of a rifle that can fire quickly with high capacity magazines that are easily interchangeable and have mounting rails and scopes?
 
The Boys Are Not All Right
22Black-master768.jpg

Morozov Photo/iStock, via Getty Images Plus

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/21/opinion/boys-violence-shootings-guns.html

I used to have this one-liner: “If you want to emasculate a guy friend, when you’re at a restaurant, ask him everything that he’s going to order, and then when the waitress comes … order for him.” It’s funny because it shouldn’t be that easy to rob a man of his masculinity — but it is.

Last week, 17 people, most of them teenagers, were shot dead at a Florida school. Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School now joins the ranks of Sandy Hook, Virginia Tech, Columbine and too many other sites of American carnage. What do these shootings have in common? Guns, yes. But also, boys. Girls aren’t pulling the triggers. It’s boys. It’s almost always boys.

America’s boys are broken. And it’s killing us.

The brokenness of the country’s boys stands in contrast to its girls, who still face an abundance of obstacles but go into the world increasingly well equipped to take them on.

The past 50 years have redefined what it means to be female in America. Girls today are told that they can do anything, be anyone. They’ve absorbed the message: They’re outperforming boys in school at every level. But it isn’t just about performance. To be a girl today is to be the beneficiary of decades of conversation about the complexities of womanhood, its many forms and expressions.

Boys, though, have been left behind. No commensurate movement has emerged to help them navigate toward a full expression of their gender. It’s no longer enough to “be a man” — we no longer even know what that means.

But to even admit our terror is to be reduced, because we don’t have a model of masculinity that allows for fear or grief or tenderness or the day-to-day sadness that sometimes overtakes us all.

Case in point: A few days ago, I posted a brief thread about these thoughts on Twitter, knowing I would receive hateful replies in response. I got dozens of messages impugning my manhood; the mildest of them called me a “soy boy” (a common insult among the alt-right that links soy intake to estrogen).

And so the man who feels lost but wishes to preserve his fully masculine self has only two choices: withdrawal or rage. We’ve seen what withdrawal and rage have the potential to do. School shootings are only the most public of tragedies. Others, on a smaller scale, take place across the country daily; another commonality among shooters is a history of abuse toward women.

To be clear, most men will never turn violent. Most men will turn out fine. Most will learn to navigate the deep waters of their feelings without ever engaging in any form of destruction. Most will grow up to be kind. But many will not.

We will probably never understand why any one young man decides to end the lives of others. But we can see at least one pattern and that pattern is glaringly obvious. It’s boys.

I believe in boys. I believe in my son. Sometimes, though, I see him, 16 years old, swallowing his frustration, burying his worry, stomping up the stairs without telling us what’s wrong, and I want to show him what it looks like to be vulnerable and open but I can’t. Because I was a boy once, too.

There has to be a way to expand what it means to be a man without losing our masculinity. I don’t know how we open ourselves to the rich complexity of our manhood. I think we would benefit from the same conversations girls and women have been having for these past 50 years.

I would like men to use feminism as an inspiration, in the same way that feminists used the civil rights movement as theirs. I’m not advocating a quick fix. There isn’t one. But we have to start the conversation. Boys are broken, and I want to help.
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to be clear not white men, just men
 
Vatican stance on guns:

The production and the sale of arms affect the common good of nations and of the international community. Hence public authorities have the right and duty to regulate them. The short-term pursuit of private or collective interests cannot legitimate undertakings that promote violence and conflict among nations and compromise the international juridical order.
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Source:
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c2a5.htm

Message from Cardinal Dolan from 2013:
For me, regulating and controlling guns is part of building a Culture of Life, of doing what we can to protect and defend human life. The easy access to guns, including assault weapons, that exists in our nation has contributed towards a Culture of Death, where human life and dignity are cheapened by the threat of violence. No law, no piece of legislation, will ever be able to protect us from every act of aggression, or from the harm that can come from an individual bent on killing. But, we must do what we can to minimize the opportunities for such acts, by limiting the easy access to guns – and, I would add, by increasing funding for programs to treat those who suffer from mental illness, especially those that might lead someone to commit mass murder.
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Source:
http://cardinaldolan.org/index.php/advocating-for-gun-control/
 
dcallamerican said:
Yea, not sure why PART of the conversation isn't, "Metal Detectors need to be in all schools."

THAT would decrease school shootings at a more guaranteed rate than ANYTHING else.
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Yea beefing up security at all schools would def cut down on these school shootings ...but u know how ppl feel they dont send their kids to certain schools or move out to certain areas to have their kids experience what it’s like to go to a “bad school”

Optics and superiority complexes over safety :smh:
 
hipstermike said:
https://www.theatlantic.com/amp/article/553937/?__twitter_impression=true

Good read
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Quoted for emphasis. I'd like to hear people with firearms knowledge in here give feedback on this:

"In a typical handgun injury that I diagnose almost daily, a bullet leaves a laceration through an organ like the liver. To a radiologist, it appears as a linear, thin, grey bullet track through the organ. There may be bleeding and some bullet fragments.

I was looking at a CT scan of one of the victims of the shooting at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School, who had been brought to the trauma center during my call shift. The organ looked like an overripe melon smashed by a sledgehammer, with extensive bleeding. How could a gunshot wound have caused this much damage?"

........

"A year ago, when a gunman opened fire at the Fort Lauderdale airport with a 9mm semiautomatic handgun, hitting 11 people in 90 seconds, I was also on call. It was not until I had diagnosed the third of the six victims who were transported to the trauma center that I realized something out-of-the-ordinary must have happened. The gunshot wounds were the same low velocity handgun injuries as those I diagnose every day; only their rapid succession set them apart. And all six of the victims who arrived at the hospital that day survived.

Routine handgun injuries leave entry and exit wounds and linear tracks through the victim's body that are roughly the size of the bullet. If the bullet does not directly hit something crucial like the heart or the aorta, and they do not bleed to death before being transported to our care at a trauma center, chances are, we can save the victim. The bullets fired by an AR-15 are different; they travel at higher velocity and are far more lethal. The damage they cause is a function of the energy they impart as they pass through the body. A typical AR-15 bullet leaves the barrel traveling almost three times faster than, and imparting more than three times the energy of, a typical 9mm bullet from a handgun. An AR-15 rifle outfitted with a magazine with 50 rounds allows many more lethal bullets to be delivered quickly without reloading."
 
jape said:
i would not want my child to go to school where the teachers have guns
i would not want my child anywhere near guns period
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Me either. Fighting fire with fire isn't the answer here. Also arming teachers creates a culture of fear. Not exactly a nice learning environment.
 
777 said:
Spot on. These guys can't be objective...name calling,circle jerking,posting a tweet from twitter which counts as win for em on a serious topic,Zero facts just pure emotion.
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Oh please! You're still having trouble proving how the positives of gun ownership outweigh the negatives, especially since it's very likely that you are part of the 90% of the US population who doesn't need a firearm to get their food.

Btw, the officer in charge of security at Stoneman ran away from the action when it counted. That's somebody who was trained to handle this kind of situation.
 
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