Government Shutdown 2013-2014 My Civil Servant Brethern...what you think

[rillo561]

da IRS is being used as da enforcement arm for obamacare....

http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapot...y-expand-the-internal-revenue-services-power/

This makes sense, since the penalty is paid at the end of the year and is taken out of your taxes. The alternative would be to create another agency to oversee it, but we know that won't fly either.

 

[ninjahood]

we're approaching day 4...and there's no budging from either side.

 

[rillo561]

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2013-10-03/frustrated-republicans-pressure-boehner-to-end-shutdown

Sad, the GOP is seriously divided.

 

[milestailsprowe]

we're approaching day 4...and there's no budging from either side.

Its fine. Wont last more then a week.

ACA is here to stay and Boehner will lose his career before next thursday

 

[duba169]

Once wall street and the rich doners start to be affected (debt ceiling) this was all be done. The minions will get their orders. Nobody give a **** about who's being effected now. Bunch of "nobodies"

The fact that these losers have the balls to pay themselves is kinda funny

 

[rico x hood]

I predict this will go until the 16th at 11:59pm.

 

[andycrazn]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-...s-which-prove-almost-everything-still-running

All of this whining and crying about a "government shutdown" is a total joke. You see, there really is very little reason why this "government shutdown" cannot continue indefinitely because almost everything is still running. 63 percent of all federal workers are still working, and 85 percent of all government activities are still being funded during this "shutdown".

Yes, the Obama administration has been making a big show of taking down government websites and blocking off the World War II Memorial, but overall business in Washington D.C. is being conducted pretty much as usual. It turns out that the definition of "essential personnel" has expanded so much over the years that almost everyone is considered "essential" at this point.

In fact, this shutdown is such a non-event that even referring to it as a "partial government shutdown" would really be overstating what is actually happening. The following are 36 facts which prove that almost everything is still running during this government shutdown...

#1 According to U.S. Senator Rand Paul, 85 percent of all government activities are actually being funded during this "government shutdown".

#2 Approximately 1,350,000 "essential" federal employees will continue to work during this "government shutdown".

#3 Overall, 63 percent of the federal workforce will continue to work during this "government shutdown".

#4 The U.S. Postal Service will continue to deliver our mail.

#5 U.S. military personnel will remain on duty and will continue to get paid.

#6 Social Security recipients will continue to get their benefits.

#7 Medicare recipients will continue to get their benefits.

#8 Medicaid recipients will continue to get their benefits.

#9 Food stamp recipients will continue to get their benefits.

#10 Those on unemployment will continue to get their benefits.

#11 Federal retirees will continue to get their pensions.

#12 The federal school lunch program has enough money to go through at least the end of this month.

#13 Public schools all over the country will continue to stay open.

#14 Almost all federal law enforcement officials will continue working.

#15 The Federal Reserve will remain "completely functional".

#16 The Supreme Court will continue to operate normally and federal courts have enough money to keep going for at least two weeks.

#17 TSA employees will continue to molest travelers at our airports.

#18 Air traffic controllers will continue to monitor traffic at our airports.

#19 Hopelessly outmanned border patrol agents will continue to try to stem the tide of illegal immigration.

#20 Visas and passports will continue to be issued by the State Department.

#21 The Veterans Administration will continue to offer substandard medical services, and it will be able to continue processing benefit payments at least for now.

#22 The Obama administration apparently has plenty of money to spend on closing open-air memorials that are usually open to the public 24 hours a day.

#23 The Department of Defense announced the awarding of 94 new contracts worth a combined total of more than 5 billion dollars on September 30th - the day right before the "government shutdown".

#24 The "government shutdown" has not prevented the new two billion dollar NSA spy center from opening up.

#25 Federal prisons will continue to operate normally.

#26 Amtrak trains will continue to run.

#27 The Patent and Trademark Office will be open.

#28 The Consumer Product Safety Commission will continue to issue product recalls if the products "create an immediate threat to the safety of human life".

#29 The National Weather Service and the National Hurricane Center will continue to track weather patterns.

#30 If the federal government needs to respond to a natural disaster, this "shutdown" will not affect that.

#31 NASA will continue to support the Mars Rover and the two American astronauts up on the International Space Station.

#32 All city employees of the D.C. government have been deemed "essential" and will continue to go to work.

#33 Even though the Obamacare exchanges are not working properly, people will still be able to access them.

#34 The IRS will continue to collect taxes, but it will be suspending punitive audits of conservative organizations.

#35 Barack Obama will continue to get paid for the full duration of this "shutdown".

#36 The U.S. Congress will continue to get paid for the full duration of this "shutdown".

Of course not everything is operating normally during this government shutdown. Government parks are closed. The EPA and the Department of Energy have almost totally closed up shop. But overall, most Americans are not going to notice much of a difference.

And perhaps now is a good time for the American people to evaluate whether or not they actually need a gigantic federal government that wastes enormous mountains of our money.

For example, our federal government recently spent $98,670 to construct a single outhouse in Alaska.

That is more than a lot of Americans pay for their entire houses.

For many more examples like this, please see my previous article entitled "The Waste List: 66 Crazy Ways That The U.S. Government Is Wasting Your Hard-Earned Money".

It is about time that Washington D.C. started experiencing some of the "belt-tightening" that the rest of the country has been going through. For far too long, the fatcats in D.C. have been living in an alternate reality where they have been able to live the high life at our expense. A recent blog post by Daniel Greenfield discussed how this shutdown is going to affect the alternate reality that the Obamas have been living in...

The government shutdown has forced Obama to make do with only a quarter of his 1,701 person staff. That would leave 436 “vital” employees. The 90 people who look after his living quarters would be slashed to 15 to “provide minimum maintenance and support”.



Buckingham Palace, which is twelve times the size of the White House and has its own clockmaker, only has an 800 person staff. King Harald V of Norway and his court make do with 152 staffers. King Carl XVI Gustaf of Sweden gets by with 203.



On Twitter, Michelle Obama announced that she is unable to Tweet on her own without the aid of all of her sixteen assistants; many of whom take home six figure salaries. There are more directors, associate directors and deputy associate directors on Michelle Obama’s staff than there were in George Washington’s entire administration.



Presidents have fought wars and made peace, explored and annexed vast territories and built a nation out of a handful of colonies with fewer senior staffers than are needed to handle Michelle Obama’s Twitter account.

Oh the humanity! Will Michelle Obama ever tweet again? And how will the White House continue to function without at least one projectionist on duty at the White House 24 hours a day?

No wonder Barack Obama is so upset about this shutdown.

In the end, this shutdown could turn out to be very good for America. We have a government that is wildly out of control and that desperately needs to be reigned in.

During the Obama administration, federal debt held by the public has risen by 90 percent, and overall federal government spending has risen by a whopping 317 percent since 1990.

So is it really a bad thing that the federal government has been forced to cut back for a little while?

Our politicians can whine and cry all they want. They won't be getting any sympathy from me.

 

[andycrazn]

Speaking of "freedoms". 

Isn't our freedom being violated by the GOP right now?

The American people voted for the guy who was pushing Obamacare. He won, and won convincingly.

Now the losing side wants to tell the American people that they made the wrong decision, and until they're mistake is fixed they're going to stop paying you.

its government violating individual freedoms. this whole collective vs collective garbage irks me.

 

[andycrazn]

-No one is required to have ID when walking the streets.

-The government got involved in slavery. White plantation owner lost the right to own slaves, a lost some freedom by definition right. See how that logic can get turned against you B

Matter of fact why aren't I free to murder who I want, to rape who i want, why do I gotta stop at traffic lights, why I gotta pay taxes, pay my rent, why can't I give golden showers to old ladies in the park, to burn kittens to death. Why don't I have freedom to do such things.

Oh what that you say, there are laws to prevent acts. Laws!? kinda like how Obamacare is a la.......w.............ohhhhhhhhhh.

definition of freedom

free·dom

noun
noun: freedom

1.
the power or right to act, speak, or think as one wants without hindrance or restraint.

why do you guys think freedom to do whatever you want involves involuntary actions to another party?

 

[andycrazn]

Freedom to starve, die in the streets and go bankrupt is the type of "freedom" they want.

so the too big too fails shouldve been bailed out then. banksters getting that paper

 

[ninjahood]

I predict this will go until the 16th at 11:59pm.

this is what i presume.

if we go over that debt limit, there's no way da president escapes equal blame.

 

[duba169]

In the long run yes. I have a hard time believing that 60 years from now people will be talking about the house screwing things up. I have no idea who was in the house during the great depression.

But for the immediate future and rest of his presidency I think Obama doesn't get most of the blame and he shouldn't.

 

[sreggie101]

I predict this will go until the 16th at 11:59pm.

this is what i presume.

if we go over that debt limit, there's no way da president escapes equal blame.

fox news would love you.

 

[rillo561]

so the too big too fails shouldve been bailed out then. banksters getting that paper

I believe they were....

 

[andycrazn]

I predict this will go until the 16th at 11:59pm.

this is what i presume.

if we go over that debt limit, there's no way da president escapes equal blame.

the debt limit has legs and its heading towards the weimar republic with break neck speed

 

[andycrazn]

so the too big too fails shouldve been bailed out then. banksters getting that paper

I believe they were....

so the big banks getting bailed out was OK because they were gonna go bankrupt? well one bank didnt make the bailout list, but thats cause jpm wanted those assets

 

[rillo561]

so the big banks getting bailed out was OK because they were gonna go bankrupt? well one bank didnt make the bailout list, but thats cause jpm wanted those assets

Didn't say it was ok, but they were bailed out. People going bankrupt because of medical bills isn't my idea of 'freedom'

 

[ninjahood]

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2013-10-03/frustrated-republicans-pressure-boehner-to-end-shutdown

Sad, the GOP is seriously divided.

moderates vs tea party.....

problem with that is, if da moderates start getting wobbly they'll have serious primary challenges from da right of them in 2014.

i say if you can't get democrats to at least consider delaying individual mandates for at least a year (because if ya ain't heard obamacare

ain't even properly set up)

 

[rillo561]

moderates vs tea party.....

problem with that is, if da moderates start getting wobbly they'll have serious primary challenges from da right of them in 2014.

i say if you can't get democrats to at least consider delaying individual mandates for at least a year (because if ya ain't heard obamacare

ain't even properly set up)

What does delaying a law for a year do? Those 'moderates' have serious problems as it is as they aren't gerrymandered.

 

[milestailsprowe]

What does delaying a law for a year do? Those 'moderates' have serious problems as it is as they aren't gerrymandered.

Delaying a law like when your mom says next time on that toy you want. Its next time every time

 

[andycrazn]

so the big banks getting bailed out was OK because they were gonna go bankrupt? well one bank didnt make the bailout list, but thats cause jpm wanted those assets

Didn't say it was ok, but they were bailed out. People going bankrupt because of medical bills isn't my idea of 'freedom'

but bankruptcy is bankruptcy. you cant just defend one over the other because of circumstances. because if thats the case i can defend the bailouts by saying it kept jobs and blah blah blah and it saved the economy from collapsing and all that good fairy dust stuff.

heres the thing, individuals and businesses big or small go into bankruptcy all the time. is it ok if a rich athlete went broke a few years after retirement? or what if he was rich and something happened to the point where he wasnt getting paid because hes injured and because of that caused him to go bankrupt?

what about the crushing student loans that cause individuals to go default?
i do agree with you that medical services in america is insanely expensive and the worst part of it is that you dont get the costs upfront cause they can stick it to you in the end. what other business can operate without showing prices and still be here. one of the problems is government getting in the way.

http://kfor.com/2013/07/08/okc-hospital-posting-surgery-prices-online/

[QUOTE]Oklahoma City hospital posts surgery prices online; creates bidding war
OKLAHOMA CITY – An Oklahoma City surgery center is offering a new kind of price transparency, posting guaranteed all-inclusive surgery prices online. The move is revolutionizing medical billing in Oklahoma and around the world.

Dr. Keith Smith and Dr. Steven Lantier launched Surgery Center of Oklahoma 15 years ago, founded on the simple principle of price honesty.

“What we’ve discovered is health care really doesn’t cost that much,” Dr. Smith said. “What people are being charged for is another matter altogether.”

Surgery Center of Oklahoma started posting their prices online about four years ago.

Click here to see the online prices at Surgery Center of Oklahoma.

The prices are all-inclusive quotes and they are guaranteed.

“When we first started we thought we were about half the price of the hospitals,” Dr. Lantier remembers. “Then we found out we’re less than half price. Then we find out we’re a sixth to an eighth of what their prices are. I can’t believe the average person can afford health care at these prices.”

Their goal was to start a price war and they did.

Their first out-of-town patients came from Canada; soon everyday Americans caught on.

Matthew Gang, 22, tore his patella tendon, dislocating his knee-cap playing basketball earlier this year.

Gang is from California and he is uninsured.

Surgery in his home-state was going to be about $30,000.

The posted price at Surgery Center of Oklahoma was $5,700, one-fifth the price.

Matthew and his father Tom Gang flew from California to Oklahoma for surgery.

“It was well worth it,” Tom Gang said. “I need a rotator cuff surgery right now. I’m thinking about flying out there and having my surgery because it was such a positive experience for us.”

A handful of other Oklahoma medical facilities have started joining Surgery Center of Oklahoma in price transparency:

McBride Orthopedic Hospital
Oklahoma Heart Hospital
Cancer Specialists of Oklahoma
Breast Imaging of Oklahoma
Comprehensive Diagnostic Imaging

Surgery Center of Oklahoma does accept private insurance, but the center does not accept Medicaid or Medicare.

Dr. Smith said federal Medicare regulation would not allow for their online price menu.

They have avoided government regulation and control in that area by choosing not to accept Medicaid or Medicare payments.

Several medical facilities in Oklahoma are posting their prices online through The Kempton Group’s website, in order to circumvent that Medicare guideline.

The Kempton Group is a third-party administrator for self-funded health insurance plans in Oklahoma and Texas.

Click here for a list of Oklahoma facilities which offer online pricing through The Kempton Group.

“The key to this is really about empowering employees.” Kempton Group President and CEO J. Wayne Kempton said.

Some Hospital administrators accuse the surgery center of cherry-picking the healthiest and wealthiest patients.

Oklahoma Hospital Association President, Craig Jones, supports transparency in theory.

Jones calls the issue “complicated” and does not expect major metro hospitals to offer online price menus in the future.

“Where we can reveal information that’s meaningful to the patient, we very much support that; that’s what hospitals need to do,” Jones said. “The difficulty when you compare hospitals with surgery centers is that surgery centers, most of the work they do are elective procedures which are a bit more predictable.”

The difference in price is staggering.

News Channel 4′s Ali Meyer obtained bills from the metro’s three largest medical centers: Mercy Medical Center, Integris Baptist Medical Center and OU Medical Center.

Mercy Hospital charged $16, 244 for a breast biopsy; the procedure will cost $3,500 at Surgery Center of Oklahoma.
OU Medical Center billed $20,456 for the open repair of a fracture; the procedure will cost $4,855 at Surgery Center of Oklahoma.
OU Medical Center billed $21,556 for a gall bladder removal surgery; the procedure will cost $5,865 at Surgery Center of Oklahoma.
OU Medical Center billed $23,934 for an ankle arthroscopy; the procedure will cost $3,740 at Surgery Center of Oklahoma.
Integris Baptist billed $37,174 for a hysterectomy; the surgery costs $8,000 at Surgery Center of Oklahoma.

“I think there’s a tendency to over-simplify the issue of price transparency but there’s no doubt that hospitals are and need to be more accountable to the public,” Jones said. “To try to make the services and the businesses that they carry out more understandable.”

According to the hospital association, about half of Oklahoma’s hospitals are losing money.

However, the metro’s largest hospitals, which are building free-standing emergency rooms and satellite facilities, are not on that list.

“The ‘haves’ seem to be doing a little bit better and the ‘have-nots’ seem to be doing a little bit worse,” Jones said.

However prices may be dropping because of the transparency at Surgery Center of Oklahoma.

As patients are demanding price-matching, some hospitals relent.

“Hospitals are having to match our prices because patients are printing their prices and holding that in one hand and holding a ticket to Oklahoma City in the other hand and asking that hospital to step up,” Dr. Smith said. “So we’re actually causing a deflationary effect on pricing all over the United States.”

The economics are not simple.

But for patients who are finding ways to save on medical care, that seems to be all that matters.[/QUOTE]

 

[fresh out dabox]

nice

 

[rillo561]

but bankruptcy is bankruptcy. you cant just defend one over the other because of circumstances.

No it isn't. Corporations have a different set of laws.

What happened with the bailouts is straight up criminal.

 

[ninjahood]

 

 

I predict this will go until the 16th at 11:59pm.

this is what i presume.

if we go over that debt limit, there's no way da president escapes equal blame.

fox news would love you.

obama is da president....he's da face of da nation..like homie said, no one is gonna remember da house or senate, but da presdient they will.

 

[andycrazn]

but bankruptcy is bankruptcy. you cant just defend one over the other because of circumstances.

No it isn't. Corporations have a different set of laws.

What happened with the bailouts is straight up criminal.

but the outcome is the same, just like an individuals bankruptcy they have to forfeit certain assets, a corporation gets split up and their assets gets sold to the highest bidder to pay off the debts.

now theres a good and bad with bankruptcy. going through it can be stressful but at the end of the day, it could help you escape from the shackles of too much debt.