***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[...So]

 

[elpablo21]

 

[Wargames]

i think we’re all screwed because

Dems don’t want to be the party of labor and small business, rely on black votes and really don’t give black voters anything, refuse to take a stand on immigration that isn’t “See, we’re just as tough as the Republicans!”, and rather get into pissing contest with anyone on the left of them. Don’t even get me started on how they don’t care about the environment, student loan debt, or actual criminal Justice reform

Also kick Manchin and Sinema out already because we seen how this story ends and they’ll run as independents anyway and speak at the RNC national convention just like Joe Lieberman .

Citizen’s United got rid of functioning decency in American politics and it’s unfortunate we got to sit here as average citizens and watch as things get worst as a bunch of feeble minded idiots get empowered.

 

[Wargames]

I actually wonder if it was time for some new political parties.

 

[IATT]

 

[RustyShackleford]

My washed *** finna pop a couple of baby aspirin and lay down

These fools probably cost me a few more follicles off my hairline wit this stress

Clowns killing endangered species outchea with tomfoolery

 

[Sharpshoeter13]

 

[gry60]

the reason stuff like that doesn't happen is because young people are not a reliable voting bloc
so staying home just further decreases the chances of that ever happening.

I believe this less and less.

Young people care about education, jobs, and opportunities for advancement. Affordable education was cut from the BBB plan; young parents won't be able to take advantage of cheap childcare/pre-K programs. How do you cultivate reliable voters when they are always the first demographic whose concerns are thrown under the bus? Young people are poorer, but they're not idiots. They can see the Democratic internal flipflopping, and the threat of a GOP governance may not be enough for a demographic that isn't looking forward to having higher living standards than their parents.

 

[Methodical Management]

They Were Her Property — Stephanie E. Jones-Rogers

www.stephaniejonesrogers.com

Ask yourself Osh, do your really want to spend your night arguing with Timid?

I asked myself a similar question this evening, flashed back to my 2006-8, and said the secular equivalent of "not today, Satan."

For his part, I'm sure Timid recognizes that he's not entitled to a whole new set of warnings just because he slapped on a fake mustache and would never throw his account away by losing his temper over sports or a kneejerk nihilism political take.

 

[rexanglorum]

the reason stuff like that doesn't happen is because young people are not a reliable voting bloc
so staying home just further decreases the chances of that ever happening.

How do you explain Medicare not being expanded to cover vision, hearing, and dental.

I agree that we need a lot more people voting, including young people, but it’s pretty obvious that voting patterns only get you so far. Older people vote and poorer senior citizens aren’t getting much help.

Money talks.

Obviously voting GOP will make things worse and like a total sucker I’m sure I’ll be donating to Democratic candidates in the 2022 cycle.

However, the mechanism by which minimal Democratic policy wins turn into electoral defeats tends to be “voting can’t change my material conditions, I am not going to miss a day’s pay at my low-wage, precarious job, in order to stave in line for eight hours to vote for politicians who won’t change things.”

Some voters flip from cycle to cycle but big swings from one election to another, in the sane geographic are, tend to be the result of different groups turning out.

 

[Wargames]

How do you explain Medicare not being expanded to cover vision, hearing, and dental.

I agree that we need a lot more people voting, including young people, but it’s pretty obvious that voting patterns only get you so far. Older people vote and poorer senior citizens aren’t getting much help.

Money talks.



Obviously voting GOP will make things worse and like a total sucker I’m sure I’ll be donating to Democratic candidates in the 2022 cycle.

However, the mechanism by which minimal Democratic policy wins turn into electoral defeats tends to be “voting can’t change my material conditions, I am not going to miss a day’s pay at my low-wage, precarious job, in order to stave in line for eight hours to vote for politicians who won’t change things.”

Some voters flip from cycle to cycle but big swings from one election to another, in the sane geographic are, tend to be the result of different groups turning out.

I will play the devil’s advocate and also argue it’s hard to message about the Republicans cheating because the ways they do it in back room deals and during boring committee votes. These are not nearly as interesting (and easy to go viral) as the lies they use to accuse Democrats of cheating. Gerrymandering that I still don’t think the majority of American citizens understand isn’t nearly as scandalous as making up a story that the Democrats are voting twice.

So far too many people don’t see the Republicans as a rogue party and instead see the, as just an alternative.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Centrist are gonna be up to all kinds of nastiness tomorrow

Won't be surprised if Manchin was to kill the BBB deal completely

 

[dwalk31]

 

[elpablo21]

 

[osh kosh bosh]

How do you explain Medicare not being expanded to cover vision, hearing, and dental.

I agree that we need a lot more people voting, including young people, but it’s pretty obvious that voting patterns only get you so far. Older people vote and poorer senior citizens aren’t getting much help.

Money talks.

obviously money is a factor but I think you consistently overrate it's impact on these things.
a senator is going to be rich for the rest of their life regardless of whatever vote or positions they take.

plus big democratic donors are to the left of rank and file dem voters


Warnock is breaking records fundraising wise.
it's not like the progressive non profit world is bereft of money.
if all it took was money to sway these people then im sure Geroge Soros could make it happen.


You underestimate the degree to which these people believe these things whole heartedly.

the Dems have 50 senators and thus are slaves to the idiosyncrasies of the furthest right senators.
now don't get me wrong Sinema seems like a bad actor/grifter, but she stands out because she seems unusually ideologically flexible.
most of them really believe dumb ****,

theres a whole long Vox article on Joe Manchin and his history in west Virginia politics.
I came away pretty convinced his weird, somewhat irrational and contradictory world view


is born of legit goofiness and not because xyz corporation is bribing him.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Delk comes in the thread 4 hours late to troll just because he couldn't help himself

Pathetic as always

 

[elpablo21]

 

[RustyShackleford]

obviously money is a factor but I think you consistently overrate it's impact on these things.
a senator is going to be rich for the rest of their life regardless of whatever vote or positions they take.

plus big democratic donors are to the left of rank and file dem voters


Warnock is breaking records fundraising wise.
it's not like the progressive non profit world is bereft of money.
if all it took was money to sway these people then im sure Geroge Soros could make it happen.


You underestimate the degree to which these people believe these things whole heartedly.

the Dems have 50 senators and thus are slaves to the idiosyncrasies of the furthest right senators.
now don't get me wrong Sinema seems like a bad actor/grifter, but she stands out because she seems unusually ideologically flexible.
most of them really believe dumb ****,

theres a whole long Vox article on Joe Manchin and his history in west Virginia politics.
I came away pretty convinced his weird, somewhat irrational and contradictory world view


is born of legit goofiness and not because xyz corporation is bribing him.

You make too many excuses for dude

Yes he is goofy and loves the attention

But lobbyists openly brag about having his ear and him being an ally

Probably directly benefits from his energy company

Dude openly says incoherent nonsense to defend his positions too. Like clearly dumb **** that makes little logical sense

Mans can be a goofball and bought at the same time

 

[RustyShackleford]

 

[Sharpshoeter13]

 

[osh kosh bosh]

You make too many excuses for dude

Yes he is goofy and loves the attention

But lobbyists openly brag about having his ear and him being an ally

Probably directly benefits from his energy company

Dude openly says incoherent nonsense to defend his positions too. Like clearly dumb **** that makes little logical sense

Mans can be a goofball and bought at the same time

maybe i am but imo non of his behavior requires corruption


I have no doubt that Joe Manchin thinks of himself as a pro business conservative democrat
. and he's a glad-handing old school politician,

so id bet he thinks that talking to billionaires and listening to their concerns is good for the country.

you don't need to bribery to find a west Virginia man that has an irrational commitment to coal mining.



people having irrational commitments to local extractive industries does not necessitate corruption.




ultimately my point is for rex everything comes down to money
and regardless of where you come down on Joe Manchins level of corruption, I just don't think it's really that simple.

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

maybe i am but imo non of his behavior requires corruption


I have no doubt that Joe Manchin thinks of himself as a pro business conservative democrat
. and he's a glad-handing old school politician,

so id bet he thinks that talking to billionaires and listening to their concerns is good for the country.

you don't need to bribery to find a west Virginia man that has an irrational commitment to coal mining.



people having irrational commitments to local extractive industries does not necessitate corruption.




ultimately my point is for rex everything comes down to money
and regardless of where you come down on Joe Manchins level of corruption, I just don't think it's really that simple.

So what you’re saying is that there hasn’t been due process in the question of Joe’s corruption…

Rex can Speak for himself, but my sense is that he ties everything to class (struggke). Money is a mechanism, not a cause.

 

[rexanglorum]

I wouldn't say it's all about money but the conventional wisdom, that groups, who vote a lot, get their problems solved, is off the mark. There's a lot of senior citizens living in poverty and that is a bloc that votes a lot.

Related to that, Joe Manchin is going to bat for billionaires despite not a single billionaire living in West Virginia. It's hard to chalk it up to local eccentricities under those conditions.

 

[Methodical Management]

Or at least a lazy link drop to spike the ball.

It’s both sad and predictable.

The prophecy has been fulfilled.

Take that, Q Anon Easter.

Delk comes in the thread 4 hours late to troll just because he couldn't help himself

Always bet on shamelessness.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

I wouldn't say it's all about money but the conventional wisdom, that groups, who vote a lot, get their problems solved, is off the mark. There's a lot of senior citizens living in poverty and that is a bloc that votes a lot.

Related to that, Joe Manchin is going to bat for billionaires despite not a single billionaire living in West Virginia. It's hard to chalk it up to local eccentricities under those conditions.

Ninjahood spent years living in his mom's rent controlled apartment saving up for a Jesus peice going to bat for billionaires on a sneaker forum.

No billionaires were bribing him.

Joe Manchin is going to be rich for the rest of his life no matter what he does.

Do you really think Joe Manchin is conciously voting against his constituents because a billionaire is going to give him...what exactly?