***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[osh kosh bosh]

You dont have to cheerlead for Bibi. All he had to say is he supports Israel's existence and its right to defend itself.

Am I missing something, isn't this basically his position?

 

[ballinsam23]

Like he's a politician, this is literally his job. That's not selling out, the is doing your job responsibly and correctly.

When you throw your people under the bus for personal gain. How's that not selling out?

 

[RustyShackleford]

You dont have to cheerlead for Bibi. All he had to say is he supports Israel's existence and its right to defend itself.

Rusty there is an entire thread on NT full of bs conspiracies, that Meth allows, with posters wishing for Iran and its radical extremist terrorist proxies to obliterate Jews and Israel in order for "the U.S and western civilization to fall"

I know he's not clueless to see wtf is happening in the world.

If you have an issue with Meth, @ Meth.

From what I have seen NT mods don't have much tolerance for antiemetic conspiracy theories. If you think some are missed, then report them.

I have spoken against these same conspiracy theories when they come up. I am not ignorant to the fact anti-Semitism has spiked over the past through months.

I know what is happening.

But let us not sit here and act like Israel is not killing thousands of innocent people, and inflicting a whole bunch of suffering on people either.

And you seem strangely dismissive of that fact from what I have seen. Like you can't understand why people might have an issue with Israel today, outside of them being anti-Semitic.

 

[Mark Antony]

I'm so confused by the sellout stuff. What's the Wellspring for some these internet talking points before they take life? Like it starts and normal human beings will happily spout it and repeat it while not hearing themselves or feel a bit embarassed to be so easily led down a path like that. End of babble.

 

[RustyShackleford]

In my view, Bibi and his Administration are the moral equivalent to Hamas

Just a bunch of murderous pieces of **** that endanger the lives of innocents. Especially the ones they came to be fighting for

I am sick and ******* tired of people acting like one group is morally superior

I am sick of of people being mealy mouthed and trying to tacitly play down how bad one side is because they think doing so is some slight against Jews or Arabs

Someone doing that is just mirroring things they swear they can't stand from the other side

Just like Bibi and Hamas leaders be doing

 

[osh kosh bosh]

When you throw your people under the bus for personal gain. How's that not selling out?

He's a supporter of isreal policy wise


But He's not an activist, he has to sell his values to the electorate. When the electorate was Pennsylvania (higher Jewish population )you talk one way

When it's a national electorate you talk another way.


This is normal. This is the job of a politician. Terms like "sellout" don't make sense.

 

[ballinsam23]

In my view, Bibi and his Administration are the moral equivalent to Hamas

Just a bunch of murderous pieces of **** that endanger the lives of innocents. Especially the ones they came to be fighting for

I am sick and ******* tired of people acting like one group is morally superior

I am sick of of people being mealy mouthed and trying to tacitly play down how bad one side is because they think doing so is some slight against Jews or Arabs

Someone doing that is just mirroring things they swear they can't stand from the other side

Just like Bibi and Hamas leaders be doing

Jews were being blown up in the middle east way before Bibi.

That whole region hates us more than they love themselves.

 

[aepps20]

Methodical Management have you noticed an increase in Russian Bot activity on NT? Some of these new posts read like they were drafted out of the politburo

 

[Brownstone]

JD attacking Tims national guardsman-ship is predictable as it is sad

 

[RustyShackleford]

He's a supporter of isreal policy wise


But He's not an activist, he has to sell his values to the electorate. When the electorate was Pennsylvania (higher Jewish population )you talk one way

When it's a national electorate you talk another way.


This is normal. This is the job of a politician. Terms like "sellout" don't make sense.

The way I read the attack is that he is a "sellout" because he is not taking a more pro-Israel view that is out of line with the Democratic Party.

It is the same kinda framing that AIPAC uses.

Blurring the line between the Israeli Government and Jews in general.

So any criticism against Bibi is a general attack against Jews.

Which we know is rather ridiculous

 

[Belgium]

God bless you all and your opinions but holy **** this echo chamber of a thread is so out of touch with reality.

Donald Trump will likely be the next President of the United States and we will hopefully be unburdened by what has been.

Bless you and your opinions too. Obviously the thread's regulars are overwhelmingly on the left side of the political centrum but a closer look would reveal that Democratics' actions are frequently debated.
Conservatives are welcome to come in here and debate, but do everyone a favor and don't be another one of those snowflake losers who starts crying when his views/opinions are challenged.

I might go into a rabbit hole and do some hefty research on communism and how Kamala's policies fit into said communism

Spoiler: They don't. The idea of turning the US into a communist state is patently absurd and virtually no one from either party involved in legislation would let that happen.
It's a boogeyman term they use for policies that have nothing to do with communism. Of course there are quite a few terminally online leftist nutjobs that unironically preach communism but there's always gonna be some crazy folks.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Jews were being blown up in the middle east way before Bibi.

That whole region hates us more than they love themselves.

And Arabs been dying over there too.

All you are doing right now is demanding people care about Jews (which they should) and not give a **** about Palestinians (which is a morally bankrupt position to have).

 

[Wargames]

With Cori Bush and Jamaal Bowman imo they are just bad politicians who misread the electorate.

I think there are some people who have convinced themselves that Democrats in deep blue areas actually hate the Democratic party.

I just don't think this is true,

most Democrats like the democratic party. They like the normie liberal positions. (Including normie democrat foreign policy)
And importantly they don't want people who make trouble for the Party.

AOC understands this, she runs to the left of the democratic party but she tries to give out the impression that she is fundamentally a team player.

Imo that was the point of her caping for Biden staying in. To give out the vibe that she is on the team.


Cori Bush does goofy things that generate bad news cycles for democrats. And if your primary voting partisan democrat. You like the democratic party and you don't like people who that.p


The AIPAC stuff, while problematic, is just cope.

Be better at politics.

$22 Million in two congressional races is not cope. It’s problematic as **** and like I said the issue goes deeper than AIPAC and support of Israel. They are just early adopters. This whole election we have seen time and time again the effect citizen United has had on elections and wildcard effect PACs have on races.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

My frustrations with both sides.

Is activist seem to think if they stoke enough moral outrage, it will make them exempt from normal politics.

​

If you yell anti semitism or genocide enough times suddenly politics don't matter.


Bibi made a calculated decision to make Isreal a more partisan issue. He ****** over Obama, he ****** over Biden.

The idea that you can do this and you expect Democrats, even center left democrats to not look at you crazy is silly.

Shapiro is doing politics, if you want pro Isreal Dems to able to work in the democratic party you need to give them space to moderate their language

Without calling them "sellouts".

 

[elpablo21]

 

[RustyShackleford]

Well, well, well. Look how the tables have turned

 

[osh kosh bosh]

$22 Million in two congressional races is not cope. It’s problematic as **** and like I said the issue goes deeper than AIPAC and support of Israel. They are just early adopters. This whole election we have seen time and time again the effect citizen United has had on elections and wildcard effect PACs have on races.

Skill issue. Git gud at politics. You can sit around and cry about citizens United.

Or you can do politics better.

Crazy idea;

Next time vote for the signature legislation of the democratic president.

And don't make trouble for the party with crazy antics and they prob keep their seats despite the money.

Crying about AIPAC is cope. Managing special interests groups is part of politics. Life's not fair.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Well, well, well. Look how the tables have turned

Candidate too old to make a normal amount of campaign appearances and rallies?

SAD! Must be hard to deal with.

 

[ballinsam23]

And Arabs been dying over there too.

All you are doing right now is demanding people care about Jews (which they should) and not give a **** about Palestinians (which is a morally bankrupt position to have).

I'm not demanding people care about Jews. I've seen enough to know that people really dont like Jews for w.e reasons they have. These same people rather take Iran's side. Which to me is crazy.

Both Jews in Israel and Palestinians want to be left the **** alone.

Clearly there is no peace in site. There is no solution regardless of who is in charge.

 

[RustyShackleford]

I think some people have it backwards

AIPAC blows a **** ton of money lobbying

But the reason they spent so much on those two races because they saw two people they disliked who were uniquely bad at their jobs, and would be venerable in a primary

Add to the fact they have to run against two very good primary challengers, then you get the results you get

Hell the races it give the most over the years are races trying to flip a GOP incumbent when I think there is a legit possibility of it happening.

Seeing such a big net swing in your favor incentivizes someone to spend more

Bush and Bowman were beatable, so AIPAC spent to beat them

 

[RustyShackleford]

I'm not demanding people care about Jews. I've seen enough to know that people really dont like Jews for w.e reasons they have. These same people rather take Iran's side. Which to me is crazy.

Both Jews in Israel and Palestinians want to be left the **** alone.

Clearly there is no peace in site. There is no solution regardless of who is in charge.

this just read as a cop out to me

I don't know if a peaceful two-state solution can hold. It would take a massive amount of work and money

But I think it would be a major net positive and a step in the right direction if Gaza and Israel were lead by the people that actual want one.

Instead of people that just want conflict for political gain

 

[Wargames]

Skill issue. Git gud at politics. You can sit around and cry about citizens United.

Or you can do politics better.

Crazy idea;

Next time vote for the signature legislation of the democratic president.

And don't make trouble for the party with crazy antics and they prob keep their seats despite the money.

Crying about AIPAC is cope. Managing special interests groups is part of politics. Life's not fair.

This is my fault for engaging you, and expecting a good conversation on the issue of Citizen United.

If it wasn’t a money issue they wouldn't have had to use so damn much to knock them out. None of these politicians were hated in their districts. It’s also not a simple AIPAC issue. That’s giving them to much credit.

It is a PACs, Donors, and Bundlers can cancel politicians issue and it’s funny when it’s happening to outsiders you don’t like but if you think this is going to be limited to them you’re burying your head in the sand. For example Katie Porter who is very good at politics might be done due to this same issue, since the rumor is the groups that kept her out the senate are planning to fund someone to run against her in the house more or less out of spite.

Meet some of the biggest donors shaping California's U.S. Senate race

Here are the biggest donors in the 2024 California Senate race, both for and against the top candidates: Adam Schiff, Katie Porter, Steve Garvey and Barbara Lee. Donors include unions, Native American tribes, cryptocurrency billionaires, Hollywood players and other wealthy interests.

www.latimes.com

But like I said my fault for engaging you on this topic because you clearly dont want to, just wave it away.

 

[gry60]

Jews were being blown up in the middle east way before Bibi.

That whole region hates us more than they love themselves.

Is this why Israel has a peace treaty with Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Iraq, and Jordan?

Is that why Jordanians willingly intercepted Iran missiles/drones flying towards Israel after yet another assassination of one of their top leaders?

You can't take actions that guarantee an atmosphere of war and post this nonsense. It's just not logical. Israel policies have plenty to do with the way they are perceived by Arab populations in the region. You can't pretend that the policy of killing ten times as many as you lost is supposed to turn your neighbors into friends.

 

[ballinsam23]

You got DripNick over here loving every post that includes "death to america" and "jews blowing up"

But I dont care about Palestinians.

 

[DripNick]

In my view, Bibi and his Administration are morally worse than Hamas

One side just tryna survive and get access to basic human rights.
The other demands the right to steal the other's land to build a bigger pool or a few more parking lots, just because one interpretation of a very old book says they're the superior race.
Nuance