What Does ANYONE Have To Do To Be Considered Greater Than Mike Jordan?

[mister friendly]

Yeah DC I forgot about that. With genetic enginnering in the next 50 years we should see even better athletes. I totally forgot about that.

 

[Retroballer]

I dont think any one from a generation that watch Michael Play will consider anyone better than him. But when a generation that only knows and seen Lebron, that when people will start to consider someone better than Jordan. But its all opinion.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Originally Posted by DoubleJs07

NT....off the top of my head, was there a NBA champion besides the Bulls in the past 30 years or so that's won the Chip w/o the luxury of having a dominant 4/5 in their lineup? This is another reason why I'm just not really feeling like the Cavs are built to win right now. If Lebron stays, they'll make some changes...however, with the way the current team is constructed, I have my doubts. This is why I appreciate the MJ-led Bulls so much....they had the right mix of on-court chemistry and coaching to make it all work.

Not many I remember looking this up last year, basically almost every championship has one big and one permiter player of 18 PER and more, exceptions include, The Badboy pistons, The Lakers with old Kareem when he wasn't as good, as well as The Spurs with old David Robinson, and rookie Tony and Manu.

 

[brandon3000]

@ MJ cheesin wit this jump off IN the hotel room

the more things change the more they stay the same. Good point to the guy that posted this tho. MJ is lucky because if the internet was poppin back then it would have been pretty significant. Shorty was supposedly pregnant too...

 

[DCAllAfrican]

Originally Posted by RetroBaller

I dont think any one from a generation that watch Michael Play will consider anyone better than him. But when a generation that only knows and seen Lebron, that when people will start to consider someone better than Jordan. But its all opinion.

I think LeBron's career shares too many of the same fans that Jordan had for him to ever be considered greater. Maybe if he was born 75 years later. But not now.

 

[brandon3000]

Originally Posted by DCAllAmerican

Originally Posted by RetroBaller

I dont think any one from a generation that watch Michael Play will consider anyone better than him. But when a generation that only knows and seen Lebron, that when people will start to consider someone better than Jordan. But its all opinion.

I think LeBron's career shares too many of the same fans that Jordan had for him to ever be considered greater. Maybe if he was born 75 years later. But not now.

10 year old kids don't know about MJ the same way we do. In 10-15 years when Lebron is finishing his career they will think he's the greatest ever because thats all they've seen. I think thats what retroBaller was getting at.

 

[DCAllAfrican]

Originally Posted by Brandon3000

Originally Posted by DCAllAmerican

Originally Posted by RetroBaller

I dont think any one from a generation that watch Michael Play will consider anyone better than him. But when a generation that only knows and seen Lebron, that when people will start to consider someone better than Jordan. But its all opinion.

I think LeBron's career shares too many of the same fans that Jordan had for him to ever be considered greater. Maybe if he was born 75 years later. But not now.

10 year old kids don't know about MJ the same way we do. In 10-15 years when Lebron is finishing his career they will think he's the greatest ever because thats all they've seen. I think thats what retroBaller was getting at.

Yea but WE are still alive right now. If LeBron would have came AFTER everyone that witnessed Mike died off, then maybe we would have a discussion. But Jordan JUST left in the grand scheme of things (time wise). 10 years isn't really much time considering generations.

 

[darth dnzy]

--Thread still open?! Saying someone is better than MJ is straight up blasphemous.
--I wanna reach a little. In terms of what they did for the game...the tandem of Magic/Bird > MJ.

--MJ had better shoes though.

 

[mister friendly]

Originally Posted by Brandon3000

@ MJ cheesin wit this jump off IN the hotel room

the more things change the more they stay the same. Good point to the guy that posted this tho. MJ is lucky because if the internet was poppin back then it would have been pretty significant. Shorty was supposedly pregnant too...

Jordan 

 

[crobers 78]

Originally Posted by Mister Friendly

Originally Posted by crobers 78

Originally Posted by Mister Friendly

He doesnt need 7 championships, Jordan kinda had incredible timing to be able to get 6 championships without a Finals loss.

If LeBron can win 4 straight championships and capture 3 more MVPs...he'll better than Jordan in my book.  

  ^  LOL! I'm sorry but please cut it out!

Why the heck do you think Lebron will have to win 7 titles before he passes Jordan in alot people's book?

Jordan never passed Bill Russell and Wilt Chamberlain's accomplishments. But he's the greatest?

So if Lebron could capture 4 straight NBA titles it would be accomplishment Jordan never did. Right? People would say "look he did something Michael Jordan never did" and then they would talk about how much more physicalyl impressive Lebron is than Jordan. They would also talk about how he has better all around stats then Jordan ever had and how he carried a team since high school.

Heck what if Kobe could 3 peat? He'd have 6 championships and two more Finals appearances than Jordan. People would argue that he's the greatest. Then people would argue about the lack of scoring titles and MVPs then you'd have people who would argue that he had to share the spotlight with a dominant big man and that you cant argue with his scoring prowess because after all he did score 81 points.....Jordan never scored that much.

The fact is people get tired of having the same GOAT and whenever somebody does anything close to Jordan accomplishments, people are gonna be ready to crown a new GOAT.

^ One word would be "MOVEMENT". MJ is a movement and is still raising the bar til this day with what he is doing for the game like buying a Team, etc etc...MJ is more than stats and those rings. Simply put you prob would not have a #8 or Lebron if it were not for MJ inspiring so many hearts and minds to play at such a high level.

  

 

[crobers 78]

Originally Posted by Mister Friendly

Originally Posted by crobers 78

Originally Posted by Mister Friendly

He doesnt need 7 championships, Jordan kinda had incredible timing to be able to get 6 championships without a Finals loss.

If LeBron can win 4 straight championships and capture 3 more MVPs...he'll better than Jordan in my book.  

  ^  LOL! I'm sorry but please cut it out!

Why the heck do you think Lebron will have to win 7 titles before he passes Jordan in alot people's book?

Jordan never passed Bill Russell and Wilt Chamberlain's accomplishments. But he's the greatest?

So if Lebron could capture 4 straight NBA titles it would be accomplishment Jordan never did. Right? People would say "look he did something Michael Jordan never did" and then they would talk about how much more physicalyl impressive Lebron is than Jordan. They would also talk about how he has better all around stats then Jordan ever had and how he carried a team since high school.

Heck what if Kobe could 3 peat? He'd have 6 championships and two more Finals appearances than Jordan. People would argue that he's the greatest. Then people would argue about the lack of scoring titles and MVPs then you'd have people who would argue that he had to share the spotlight with a dominant big man and that you cant argue with his scoring prowess because after all he did score 81 points.....Jordan never scored that much.

The fact is people get tired of having the same GOAT and whenever somebody does anything close to Jordan accomplishments, people are gonna be ready to crown a new GOAT.

    

 

[crobers 78]

Originally Posted by DCAllAmerican

This was a very good discussion.

I do wish I could die and fast forward 80 years to see the face of professional basketball. Like I was explaining to someone last week, sports fans have short memories even when someone is alive, so I am pretty sure once we all are dead that people of that day will find someone else to consider the goat.

Think about it like this. The same way many of us discredit Wilt's accomplishments because of the lack of relative competitive he had will probably be the same way people view Jordan's era once this world hits year 2100. Imagine how bland, boring, unathletic the 1980's - 1990's will be considered to people during those years.

I am sure the influx of PEDs and HGH will be in every potential athletes blood stream because their wild and crazy daddy wants their son to be a supreme athlete by time he is 12 years old. So not only will athleticism of Jordan's era not be comparable but there will be nobody left to really tell the story of what it was like to EXPERIENCE Mike.

It is cool to watch film on someone, but it is much different to live through their days. It is a different story to see how important they were to their sport and to pop culture. Once we are all dead, nobody will be able to know what it was like to live through the days of Mike.

So to those that think there will be another, I agree. There will always be another. And another. And another.

The same way Mike wasn't the first, he won't be the last. I like to call it generational bias.

^ I never discredit Wilt and what he did esp since i was not really present to truly watch him and could care less but you are right if the game is more infused with PEDS it will be a live NBA JAM Game n therefore could not be compared to what MJ did when PED's were not running so rampant so my idea is MJ is the GOAT of my era and what he did will more than likely still be seen as great, period. Da Bulls won over 300 plus games in a 3 yr span more than any other team in any sport including baseball and what Babe did. That alone is bananas and does not get enough credit. Bulls will go down as one of the most dominant teams ever which was led by MJ.
  

 

[gmsboy1]

This is wayyyyyyyyy off topic, but does anyone have the picture where Michael is pulling somones shorts down while they're lined up on the side for a free throw?
I think it was a rookie player for the Sonics. That picture is funny as %*%$.

 

[mister friendly]

Originally Posted by crobers 78

Originally Posted by DCAllAmerican

This was a very good discussion.

I do wish I could die and fast forward 80 years to see the face of professional basketball. Like I was explaining to someone last week, sports fans have short memories even when someone is alive, so I am pretty sure once we all are dead that people of that day will find someone else to consider the goat.

Think about it like this. The same way many of us discredit Wilt's accomplishments because of the lack of relative competitive he had will probably be the same way people view Jordan's era once this world hits year 2100. Imagine how bland, boring, unathletic the 1980's - 1990's will be considered to people during those years.

I am sure the influx of PEDs and HGH will be in every potential athletes blood stream because their wild and crazy daddy wants their son to be a supreme athlete by time he is 12 years old. So not only will athleticism of Jordan's era not be comparable but there will be nobody left to really tell the story of what it was like to EXPERIENCE Mike.

It is cool to watch film on someone, but it is much different to live through their days. It is a different story to see how important they were to their sport and to pop culture. Once we are all dead, nobody will be able to know what it was like to live through the days of Mike.

So to those that think there will be another, I agree. There will always be another. And another. And another.

The same way Mike wasn't the first, he won't be the last. I like to call it generational bias.

^ I never discredit Wilt and what he did esp since i was not really present to truly watch him and could care less but you are right if the game is more infused with PEDS it will be a live NBA JAM Game n therefore could not be compared to what MJ did when PED's were not running so rampant so my idea is MJ is the GOAT of my era and what he did will more than likely still be seen as great, period. Da Bulls won over 300 plus games in a 3 yr span more than any other team in any sport including baseball and what Babe did. That alone is bananas and does not get enough credit. Bulls will go down as one of the most dominant teams ever which was led by MJ.
  

I dont think you are realizing what he's saying. I beleive he's saying the parents will give their kids supplements from when they are babies. Also in the future there may be special engineered foods to help the body develop and parents make be able to take  "athletic defects" away from their child before they are born. You couldnt hold your generation athletes as pure because it won't be considered cheating because everybody will have access to it. It would be no more of a cheat than current athletes have but being able to weight lifts and take supplements like protein.


Also I think without Michael Jordan ever playing the game of basketball, kids would still be insipred to play Basketball, Instead of Jordan insipring them it may have been Dominique,Barkley, Penny,Shaq, robinson,Hakeem etc. The game of Basketball is bigger than one man.
  

 

[baller23217]

Originally Posted by Brandon3000


10 year old kids don't know about MJ the same way we do. In 10-15 years when Lebron is finishing his career they will think he's the greatest ever because that's all they've seen. I think thats what retroBaller was getting at.

exactly

 

[antbanks81]

I don't know that its possible OP. Everyone mentions the rings, but IMO he'd also have to be flawless in the finals and string together a few consecutively. Mike led his team to a three peat, took a break, came back and led them to another three peat. There was no question that Bulls would win from the opening tip off in November.

No one player can do for the game what Mike did. You can not make the game any more global. Maybe someone can make it go intergalactic (sp?) There is no shoe line that will meet the heights that the Jumpman inspired. There are kids that never saw MJ play and cop every pair that drops.

Mike was the first and the last.

 

[crobers 78]

Originally Posted by Mister Friendly

Originally Posted by crobers 78

Originally Posted by DCAllAmerican

This was a very good discussion.

I do wish I could die and fast forward 80 years to see the face of professional basketball. Like I was explaining to someone last week, sports fans have short memories even when someone is alive, so I am pretty sure once we all are dead that people of that day will find someone else to consider the goat.

Think about it like this. The same way many of us discredit Wilt's accomplishments because of the lack of relative competitive he had will probably be the same way people view Jordan's era once this world hits year 2100. Imagine how bland, boring, unathletic the 1980's - 1990's will be considered to people during those years.

I am sure the influx of PEDs and HGH will be in every potential athletes blood stream because their wild and crazy daddy wants their son to be a supreme athlete by time he is 12 years old. So not only will athleticism of Jordan's era not be comparable but there will be nobody left to really tell the story of what it was like to EXPERIENCE Mike.

It is cool to watch film on someone, but it is much different to live through their days. It is a different story to see how important they were to their sport and to pop culture. Once we are all dead, nobody will be able to know what it was like to live through the days of Mike.

So to those that think there will be another, I agree. There will always be another. And another. And another.

The same way Mike wasn't the first, he won't be the last. I like to call it generational bias.

^ I never discredit Wilt and what he did esp since i was not really present to truly watch him and could care less but you are right if the game is more infused with PEDS it will be a live NBA JAM Game n therefore could not be compared to what MJ did when PED's were not running so rampant so my idea is MJ is the GOAT of my era and what he did will more than likely still be seen as great, period. Da Bulls won over 300 plus games in a 3 yr span more than any other team in any sport including baseball and what Babe did. That alone is bananas and does not get enough credit. Bulls will go down as one of the most dominant teams ever which was led by MJ.
  

I dont think you are realizing what he's saying. I beleive he's saying the parents will give their kids supplements from when they are babies. Also in the future there may be special engineered foods to help the body develop and parents make be able to take  "athletic defects" away from their child before they are born. You couldnt hold your generation athletes as pure because it won't be considered cheating because everybody will have access to it. It would be no more of a cheat than current athletes have but being able to weight lifts and take supplements like protein.


Also I think without Michael Jordan ever playing the game of basketball, kids would still be insipred to play Basketball, Instead of Jordan insipring them it may have been Dominique,Barkley, Penny,Shaq, robinson,Hakeem etc. The game of Basketball is bigger than one man.
  

^ That perspective is interesting if that's his angle. The game is def bigger than one player but this player aka MJ was huge and inspired damn near every star in the league to feel like they can excel and/or be like him...you could go around the league and ask who they looked up to and who inspired them while hooked up to a polygraph machine and you will hear MJ all day. It's really irrefutable but some still try to fight it but it's cool. The same way you have so many artists from rappers to soul singers who looked up to Michael Jackson....

  

 

[knightngale]

Originally Posted by Mister Friendly


^^^ Gosh get off Michael Jordan's #^$

Eventually Michael will be passed it happens in every sport over time...Your kids and grandkids will have a new GOAT and be tired of your Jordan ^%* riding.

you are doing the same riding with lebron and he has barely done anything

 

[crobers 78]

Originally Posted by AntBanks81

I don't know that its possible OP. Everyone mentions the rings, but IMO he'd also have to be flawless in the finals and string together a few consecutively. Mike led his team to a three peat, took a break, came back and led them to another three peat. There was no question that Bulls would win from the opening tip off in November.

No one player can do for the game what Mike did. You can not make the game any more global. Maybe someone can make it go intergalactic (sp?) There is no shoe line that will meet the heights that the Jumpman inspired. There are kids that never saw MJ play and cop every pair that drops.

Mike was the first and the last.

^ Your second paragraph is strong and you are right MJ's shoe game was bananas and that's just one facet of his legacy i don't seeing being touched. This is why i don't understand why folks just let this man have his place in history alone n stop comparing him to cats who have been in league for like 6 yrs or cats who are still chasing their tail. Lol I stay trippin off these young cats who never seen MJ play n be on the J's hella tough n rep for dude to the gristle, but i love it tho. Shows you dude's affect on the game is profound! I don't see daniel son leaving anything close to this when he retires probably after like 20 yrs with his thirsty ***
  

 

[crobers 78]

Originally Posted by knightngale

Originally Posted by Mister Friendly


^^^ Gosh get off Michael Jordan's #^$

Eventually Michael will be passed it happens in every sport over time...Your kids and grandkids will have a new GOAT and be tired of your Jordan ^%* riding.

you are doing the same riding with lebron and he has barely done anything

Thank you! Plus Mister Friendly my kids and grandkids will not get tired of MJ because when i show them footage they will be like "whoa this dude is hella nice...why is his swag so cool and his shoes are sick! They will also be like man the Defense was tough, dudes hand checkin and campin out in the lane and MJ is still killin fools...he won how many rings in how many years with this Team Pops?" LOL! One day yall gone knock it off and succumb to the GOAT

 

[mister friendly]

Originally Posted by knightngale

Originally Posted by Mister Friendly


^^^ Gosh get off Michael Jordan's #^$

Eventually Michael will be passed it happens in every sport over time...Your kids and grandkids will have a new GOAT and be tired of your Jordan ^%* riding.

you are doing the same riding with lebron and he has barely done anything

 Wow....So in one thread I can be a Lebron d-rider, next I'm a Lebron hater. Then in another post I'm a Kobe d-rider or MJ hater.

I'm neither of those things. I just try to give objective opinions on these players because it seems like so many posters in Sports &Training forum seem to take their opinions on a player one step farther than neccesary.

So instead of getting reasonable apprecation threads..... we get threads and posts like

" Lebron is the most dominating player ever"
 " Michael Jordan is going to be the GOAT forever"
"Kobe is greatest scorer ever"
 " If MJ hadnt retired the Bulls would've won 10 Championships in a row"

  

 

[crobers 78]

This Cavs performance and LeBarbie's perfomance tonight is EXACTLY why imma need yall to plse stop trying to compare him to MJ or say he will be better! Dude does not have the wherewithal to take over a crucial game and has no hardware to justify being King. I do not see dude getting a ring, ever! The only reason #8 got those rings was because he was traded to basically the best organization in the league alongside Shaq in in prime years, very good role players and the best coach in the league.

 

[crobers 78]

 

[mrben23]

Originally Posted by DCAllAmerican

My man wassup

See I have already heard folks say that LeBron has TOO MUCH talent around him. Almost diminishing the idea that he is truly winning this all by himself. (As if Jordan didn't play alongside a Top 50 HOF'er). Would anyone agree with that?

On PAPER, time for time, the names of the other Cavs are more recognizable than the names of the other Bulls.
Shaq
Jamison
Mo Williams
Big Z

Are much better (on paper and recognizable) than the rest of the Bulls.So that might be why someone made that statement.

Interested in hearing other opinions.

Huh? Basketball is a team sport. I'm just against that "No talent on the Bulls statement."
Scottie Pippen
BJ Armstrong
Dennis Rodman
Steve Kerr
John Paxton
Horace Grant
Luc Longley
Tony Kukoc
Ron Harper
Bill Cartwright
Robert Parish

 

[mrben23]

By the way, MJ globalized the sport of basketball. GLOBALIZED.