The Official NBA Collective Bargaining Thread vol Phased in Hard Cap

[MIKE LOWERY]

At the true arrogance from the owners. When you buy an NBA team it's just like buying any other establishment. It's a business venture. There's risks involved. You honestly think it's not only plausible but necessary to generate profit even if your team is poorly run? Are you +@!%%!%@ me?

I don't wanna hear that small market competitiveness $#%%%**% either. This is about money. You knew exactly what you were getting into before you bought a team in cLeaveLand, Minnesnowta, and Memphis.

Oh no my star player left and I'm stuck in this +@*%$* city with this +@*%$* team.

SSSSSSSSSSSTTTTTTTEEEEERRRRRNNNNNNN!!!!


No but seriously, I can see some changes but not slicing the salary cap by a third and making it a hard cap, forcing the players to give back money, and non-guaranteed contracts.

 

[MIKE LOWERY]

At the true arrogance from the owners. When you buy an NBA team it's just like buying any other establishment. It's a business venture. There's risks involved. You honestly think it's not only plausible but necessary to generate profit even if your team is poorly run? Are you +@!%%!%@ me?

I don't wanna hear that small market competitiveness $#%%%**% either. This is about money. You knew exactly what you were getting into before you bought a team in cLeaveLand, Minnesnowta, and Memphis.

Oh no my star player left and I'm stuck in this +@*%$* city with this +@*%$* team.

SSSSSSSSSSSTTTTTTTEEEEERRRRRNNNNNNN!!!!


No but seriously, I can see some changes but not slicing the salary cap by a third and making it a hard cap, forcing the players to give back money, and non-guaranteed contracts.

 

[duba169]

Originally Posted by JohnnyRedStorm

It would never happen, but I like the idea of having every contract have an early termination clause for guys that dog it (ie Jerome James, Eddy Curry, etc) where you need to either play a certain amount of games or achieve a certain amount of statistical success for your contract to be valid.

that's messed up though because then a coach like Dantoni who holds grudges can determine whether or not you get paid
Marbury was in excellent condition his first year. But because of their beef he didn't play a second. wouldn't be fair to marbury to take away his money because a coach won't play him

 

[duba169]

Originally Posted by JohnnyRedStorm

It would never happen, but I like the idea of having every contract have an early termination clause for guys that dog it (ie Jerome James, Eddy Curry, etc) where you need to either play a certain amount of games or achieve a certain amount of statistical success for your contract to be valid.

that's messed up though because then a coach like Dantoni who holds grudges can determine whether or not you get paid
Marbury was in excellent condition his first year. But because of their beef he didn't play a second. wouldn't be fair to marbury to take away his money because a coach won't play him

 

[johnnyredstorm]

Originally Posted by DubA169

Originally Posted by JohnnyRedStorm

It would never happen, but I like the idea of having every contract have an early termination clause for guys that dog it (ie Jerome James, Eddy Curry, etc) where you need to either play a certain amount of games or achieve a certain amount of statistical success for your contract to be valid.

that's messed up though because then a coach like Dantoni who holds grudges can determine whether or not you get paid
Marbury was in excellent condition his first year. But because of their beef he didn't play a second. wouldn't be fair to marbury to take away his money because a coach won't play him

Yeah that's the only thing holding it back.
Sad our examples revolve around the Knicks though

 

[johnnyredstorm]

Originally Posted by DubA169

Originally Posted by JohnnyRedStorm

It would never happen, but I like the idea of having every contract have an early termination clause for guys that dog it (ie Jerome James, Eddy Curry, etc) where you need to either play a certain amount of games or achieve a certain amount of statistical success for your contract to be valid.

that's messed up though because then a coach like Dantoni who holds grudges can determine whether or not you get paid
Marbury was in excellent condition his first year. But because of their beef he didn't play a second. wouldn't be fair to marbury to take away his money because a coach won't play him

Yeah that's the only thing holding it back.
Sad our examples revolve around the Knicks though

 

[carlos tevez]

I'm sorry but I'm with the players 100% in this case. A large amount of NBA teams are run by idiot owners, GMs, etc etc who hand out horrible contracts like candy. Who is allowing these mediocre players to be overpaid? No one is forcing teams to give mediocre players $6+ million a year to do what any rookie or D-leaguer could do. As for the top players, they've all earned their contracts...guys like LeBron, Kobe, Duncan, Dirk, KG, etc etc have earned their money through years of hard work and consistency.

Anyways, the player's union is not going to bend over backwards just to appease the owners. If anything, they'll agree to some concessions but have an agreement in place that ties the cap to league revenues. We saw that happen in the NHL and a few years after the NHL lockout the "cap" is basically around the same amount NHL clubs were spending prior to the lockout

 

[carlos tevez]

I'm sorry but I'm with the players 100% in this case. A large amount of NBA teams are run by idiot owners, GMs, etc etc who hand out horrible contracts like candy. Who is allowing these mediocre players to be overpaid? No one is forcing teams to give mediocre players $6+ million a year to do what any rookie or D-leaguer could do. As for the top players, they've all earned their contracts...guys like LeBron, Kobe, Duncan, Dirk, KG, etc etc have earned their money through years of hard work and consistency.

Anyways, the player's union is not going to bend over backwards just to appease the owners. If anything, they'll agree to some concessions but have an agreement in place that ties the cap to league revenues. We saw that happen in the NHL and a few years after the NHL lockout the "cap" is basically around the same amount NHL clubs were spending prior to the lockout

 

[statis22]

Reagrdless of the spin if a small market owner chooses to compete in the league he should have a legit chance to without ridiculous contracts hampering their salary capif or when their star player leave.

These players aren't taking less than what their worth so imo all this teams shouldn't hand out these bad contracts talk is just not feasible.

 

[statis22]

Reagrdless of the spin if a small market owner chooses to compete in the league he should have a legit chance to without ridiculous contracts hampering their salary capif or when their star player leave.

These players aren't taking less than what their worth so imo all this teams shouldn't hand out these bad contracts talk is just not feasible.

 

[duba169]

handing out bad contracts isn't a small market thing, it's a dumb management issue. just look at the knicks for a decade

 

[duba169]

handing out bad contracts isn't a small market thing, it's a dumb management issue. just look at the knicks for a decade

 

[statis22]

It becomes a bad contract as soon as it hampers your salary cap and you have no choice but to pay that particular player.

You're right it isn't a bad management issue, it's a league wide issue.

 

[statis22]

It becomes a bad contract as soon as it hampers your salary cap and you have no choice but to pay that particular player.

You're right it isn't a bad management issue, it's a league wide issue.

 

[scotty pimpin]

@ y'all blaming all of this on small markets. 70% of the NBA is small market. 2011 is the time if hardship. The NBA wouldn't be @*%# without the small markets. So get used to this. And this is coming from a Chicagoan.

 

[scotty pimpin]

@ y'all blaming all of this on small markets. 70% of the NBA is small market. 2011 is the time if hardship. The NBA wouldn't be @*%# without the small markets. So get used to this. And this is coming from a Chicagoan.

 

[grittyman20]

The problem isn't all on the small markets, because large market teams make bad decisions too. Realistically there needs to be a better revenue sharing system in place. The Lakers are getting 150 million from their new television deal and don't have to share that with anyone...so hell yeah they're going to always going to be one of the most successful franchises in the league. The issue right now is the owners want to make up their losses solely out of the players pockets, which is not cool at all. I wish casual fans had the ability to separate business from emotions when discussing the lockout. Like PMatic said, Stern is a genius when it comes to manipulating through the media. If I have to hear one more argument about how athletes are overpaid compared to "real jobs" like teachers and policemen I'm going to rip my ears off...that's irrelevant here. It's all about principle at this point, no one with the opportunity to fight is going to voluntarily take a pay cut just because their bosses want to fatten their pockets.

 

[grittyman20]

The problem isn't all on the small markets, because large market teams make bad decisions too. Realistically there needs to be a better revenue sharing system in place. The Lakers are getting 150 million from their new television deal and don't have to share that with anyone...so hell yeah they're going to always going to be one of the most successful franchises in the league. The issue right now is the owners want to make up their losses solely out of the players pockets, which is not cool at all. I wish casual fans had the ability to separate business from emotions when discussing the lockout. Like PMatic said, Stern is a genius when it comes to manipulating through the media. If I have to hear one more argument about how athletes are overpaid compared to "real jobs" like teachers and policemen I'm going to rip my ears off...that's irrelevant here. It's all about principle at this point, no one with the opportunity to fight is going to voluntarily take a pay cut just because their bosses want to fatten their pockets.

 

[japanair21]

The thing is, an owner like Cuban is fine with dishing out 50 million dollar contract to someone like Brendan Haywood. He probably regrets it now, sure, but he'll go ahead and sign Tyson Chandler to probably something close if the CBA allows it. Yet he's one of the more successful owners in the NBA recently, he turned a bottom-feeder team, like the Timberwolves, into a semi-contender for the past 10 years.

While an idiot like Sterling (he's the Clippers owner, right?) just doesn't know how to manage a team.

 

[japanair21]

The thing is, an owner like Cuban is fine with dishing out 50 million dollar contract to someone like Brendan Haywood. He probably regrets it now, sure, but he'll go ahead and sign Tyson Chandler to probably something close if the CBA allows it. Yet he's one of the more successful owners in the NBA recently, he turned a bottom-feeder team, like the Timberwolves, into a semi-contender for the past 10 years.

While an idiot like Sterling (he's the Clippers owner, right?) just doesn't know how to manage a team.

 

[grittyman20]

From what I've heard about Sterling, is that he's more concerned with profitability than he is about winning...although he may have changed that stance in recent years. The Clippers have a built in fan base that's used to losing so he doesn't really have that urgency to build a winner. I don't even know why people would be fans of that team other than wanting to root for a local team but hating the Lakers and what they stand for...but that's an entirely different discussion

No disrespect to any die hard fans, but there are some cities that are just in weak markets and need to move on...Toronto, Sacramento, Minnesota, Indiana, etc. I'm sure those teams would do better financially if they were in Vegas, Seattle, Anaheim, or maybe even one of those foreign countries that were in discussions years ago like London or Barcelona. 

 

[grittyman20]

From what I've heard about Sterling, is that he's more concerned with profitability than he is about winning...although he may have changed that stance in recent years. The Clippers have a built in fan base that's used to losing so he doesn't really have that urgency to build a winner. I don't even know why people would be fans of that team other than wanting to root for a local team but hating the Lakers and what they stand for...but that's an entirely different discussion

No disrespect to any die hard fans, but there are some cities that are just in weak markets and need to move on...Toronto, Sacramento, Minnesota, Indiana, etc. I'm sure those teams would do better financially if they were in Vegas, Seattle, Anaheim, or maybe even one of those foreign countries that were in discussions years ago like London or Barcelona. 

 

[carlos tevez]

No disrespect to any die hard fans, but there are some cities that are just in weak markets and need to move on...Toronto, Sacramento, Minnesota, Indiana, etc. I'm sure those teams would do better financially if they were in Vegas, Seattle, Anaheim, or maybe even one of those foreign countries that were in discussions years ago like London or Barcelona.


No disrespect but you dont know what the F you are talking about.

Toronto is the 4th largest market in the NBA. Yes, only behind NY, LA and Chicago. Not only that, but Toronto is the 5th biggest city in North America.

According to Forbes, the Raptors are the 10th most valuable team in the NBA, not bad for a club that has only been in the league for about 15 years. Not bad for a club that has been crap for almost all of those 15 years.
http://www.forbes.com/lis...onto-Raptors_321933.html

How you can lump the Craptors with financial minnows like the Kings, Wolves, Pacers is beyond me.

 

[carlos tevez]

No disrespect to any die hard fans, but there are some cities that are just in weak markets and need to move on...Toronto, Sacramento, Minnesota, Indiana, etc. I'm sure those teams would do better financially if they were in Vegas, Seattle, Anaheim, or maybe even one of those foreign countries that were in discussions years ago like London or Barcelona.


No disrespect but you dont know what the F you are talking about.

Toronto is the 4th largest market in the NBA. Yes, only behind NY, LA and Chicago. Not only that, but Toronto is the 5th biggest city in North America.

According to Forbes, the Raptors are the 10th most valuable team in the NBA, not bad for a club that has only been in the league for about 15 years. Not bad for a club that has been crap for almost all of those 15 years.
http://www.forbes.com/lis...onto-Raptors_321933.html

How you can lump the Craptors with financial minnows like the Kings, Wolves, Pacers is beyond me.

 

[scotty pimpin]

Originally Posted by grittyman20

From what I've heard about Sterling, is that he's more concerned with profitability than he is about winning...although he may have changed that stance in recent years. The Clippers have a built in fan base that's used to losing so he doesn't really have that urgency to build a winner. I don't even know why people would be fans of that team other than wanting to root for a local team but hating the Lakers and what they stand for...but that's an entirely different discussion

No disrespect to any die hard fans, but there are some cities that are just in weak markets and need to move on...Toronto, Sacramento, Minnesota, Indiana, etc. I'm sure those teams would do better financially if they were in Vegas, Seattle, Anaheim, or maybe even one of those foreign countries that were in discussions years ago like London or Barcelona. 

Better in Seattle? We all seen what happened. Better in Vegas? Yeah, for all the tourist to visit.
(Edit: personal attack removed and warning added to account.)