Congress clears historic health care bill...

[chickhien]

^hire more workers. overseas.

 

[sundoobie]

Originally Posted by JustScoreda100

Originally Posted by SunDOOBIE

Wow

You pass off that 3.8% rise in capital gains taxes as if its insignificant. That tax alone will cost a lot of people money. It even hits small time traders like me who play around with penny stocks. Now I have to increase the risks I take in order to offset this tax increase while I'm already getting killed by brokerage fees.

It will also have an effect on the stock market because people may choose other investment vehicles to get the returns they're used to with out increasing their risks. The stock market is already fragile as is and may be up for correction. I wouldn't be surprised if this tax speeds up that correction.

Sure it's significant for RICH folks considering this is UNEARNED income that they really need to feed their children.  

So you're saying this will cost a lot of people money?  So if I am a millionaire and I have $500,000 sitting in a mutual fund and it made $10,000 in dividends, am I going to worry about $380 in additional tax?  Because OH GEE $380 more in taxes is really going to force me to give up my way of life. 

Give me a break.

So money earned from investments is unearned income now? Wow you give me a break.

You obviously have no idea what its like to invest money in the stock market. Do you even have a stock portfolio? It takes me hours to research stocks the stocks I put my money into. I earned every *+%$%!* cent I made from my investments. You really have to stop thinking about specific situations that don't make up majority of the situation in reality.

What about the pension funds and municipal funds that will have to pay this tax? Will you still think its insignificant when your the handlers of your 401k start to pass the cost of this tax onto you in the form higher fees? Or the increase in back fees that you might get because of how it will hit their bottom line? I'm not trying to be apologetic towards the banks either.

You're all gung ho for higher taxes when they're not targeting you, but your a fool if you think those bastardy "rich" people who conspire against you on the daily aren't going to just pass the cost of these taxes on regular every day citizens like you. 

Investment income = unearned income.  That is the clear cut definition when talking about income taxation.


[h1][/h1]

[h1]unearned incomeDefinition
[/h1]





An individual's income derived from sources other than employment, such as interest and dividends from investments, or income from rental property. also called unearned revenue. opposite of earned income.



Pension funds? Municipal Funds?  The hell are you getting all this stuff?

The 3.8% increase in tax is directed at INDIVIDUALS.  Those married couples with modified adjusted gross incomes of more than $250,000 (or $200,000 for singles).  Just these taxpayers! 

The rest of the garbage you wrote is not even factual or written in that bill.  Just a bunch of what if, could be, should be scenarios I rather not even comment on. 

 

[burns1923]

Originally Posted by CParkFresh

Originally Posted by Burns1923

Medicare and Medicaid should both be repealed.  ...needs to be repealed on principle.

So you are against providing healthcare to seniors... Okay man... You win... LOL

On taxpayer money?  Damn right I'm against taxpayer-funded health care.

Stop with the compassion crap.  It's not gonna justify government mandated health care.

"Moral rationalization is indispensable at all times of action whether to justify the selection or the use of ends or means." - Saul Alinsky

"You do what you can with what you have and clothe it with moral arguments." - Saul Alinsky

  

 

[callhimar]

Originally Posted by Burns1923

Originally Posted by CallHimAR

I quit.

Reading the comments on that page and here lead me to believe that there are a great deal of Americans who are extremely misinformed and confused.

The fear mongering is simply too strong here.

  That's just the thing.  Americans are more informed about the health care bill than Congress itself.

And they DON'T WANT IT.  What part of 55% against it on principle and 73% want a complete re-do don't you understand?

If the bill was so great, the majority of Americans would be embracing it.  Instead, they can't wait for the midterms. 

Wait, didn't Obama get a majority of the pop vote (53%) yet the majority is against his health care bill (55%/73%)?

Guess that makes the majority of Americans "fear mongers". 

Clearly they DON'T understand what they're rallying against when polls in the past indicated that they were actual for a great deal of the reforms in the bill, but when the bill itself was brought up they were against it. I wonder why?

Oh, fear mongering by major "news" networks to make it seem like this is going to destroy America. Who owns said network? A billionaire who most likely knows those who run the health care industry as well.

The majority of people are EXTREMELY misinformed. Let me emphasize, EXTREMELY. It shows because most of what is being said on the internet, at the "tea parties" and at the protests is complete bull !+%! that is spread by fear like "Obama isn't American" and so on and so forth. When THAT is a persons argument, their opinion is null and void, and that is one of the idiotic arguments people sure. I'm seriously wondering now if this DOES have something to do with this mans race, and if it does, I'm completely disgusted.

 

[38816]

yawn, im not gonna bother reading this post

but i will say

hooray.

too many americans can't go to the hospital because they have no health insurance...

me included.

i got sick for an entire week, and HOPED it wasn't swine flu....

i've worked full-time since i graduated college with a 4 year degree...

cannot afford 200 dollars a month for insurance.

am i in north korea?

i overheard an instructional aide "is this rate for insurance per month or per check? if it's per check, i don't even make this much per check"

"well ask for more hours..."

a.) healthcare shouldn't be run for-profit

b.) healthcare costs are extremely inflated...how can we remedy that? stop running the healthcare system for-profit...

c.) look at everyone salty over being taxed for HEALTHCARE, something you're being raped for ANYWAY....where was all this outrage when we were being taxed for TAX BREAKS FOR THE WEALTHY AND BOMBS FOR WAR? i didn't see white dudes taking to the streets with pistols when haliburton was getting multi-billion dollar deals...

i'd much rather get taxed for healthcare than bombs....

 

[thunderchunk69]

Originally Posted by eNPHAN

a.) healthcare shouldn't be run for-profit

b.) healthcare costs are extremely inflated...how can we remedy that? stop running the healthcare system for-profit...

c.) look at everyone salty over being taxed for HEALTHCARE, something you're being raped for ANYWAY....where was all this outrage when we were being taxed for TAX BREAKS FOR THE WEALTHY AND BOMBS FOR WAR? i didn't see white dudes taking to the streets with pistols when haliburton was getting multi-billion dollar deals...

i'd much rather get taxed for healthcare than bombs....

a) agree, and insurance as well
b) true, but pharmaceutical companies are running wild as well, and just imagine the anti-American uproar if they regulated that
c) exactly, our $$$ is already going to celebrate Israel and other wars we are being lied about amongst other things

 

[cparkfresh]

Originally Posted by Burns1923

That's just the thing.  Americans are more informed about the health care bill than Congress itself.

And they DON'T WANT IT.  What part of 55% against it on principle and 73% want a complete re-do don't you understand?

If the bill was so great, the majority of Americans would be embracing it.  Instead, they can't wait for the midterms. 

Wait, didn't Obama get a majority of the pop vote (53%) yet the majority is against his health care bill (55%/73%)?

Guess that makes the majority of Americans "fear mongers". 

The problem is Americans are not informed about the healthcare bill. And those that think they are have only formed opinions based on whatever spin is being fed to them on both the right and left.

Kaiser Health Tracking Poll — March 2010

The March Kaiser Health Tracking Poll finds the public still divided on health reform legislation, with 46 percent of Americans backing the reform proposals on Capitol Hill, 42 percent opposing them and 12 percent saying they aren't sure. Six in 10 Americans say they have heard little or nothing about budget reconciliation. And many people continue to struggle with health costs, with nearly one in five saying cost increases have caused them or their employer to switch to a less comprehensive health plan.

The poll finds that Americans are also divided about what should happen next. Forty-two percent say “Congress has debated health care reform long enough and it is time for them to take a vote.

 

[38816]

Originally Posted by Frische Produkte

Originally Posted by Trelvis Tha Thrilla

Originally Posted by CallHimAR

at this point, I am against anything the gov't is trying to push at us but thats just me i dunno

Seriously. That is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard.

The government can barely handle small stuff like education and the DMV, what makes anyone think they are going to be able to run health care properly? I know I have no faith in the government to lay out this system correctly.

Im not against everyone having coverage. Im against the government running it. All young people should get prepared to pay huge chunks of their checks back to the government for a very long time.

[color= rgb(255, 0, 0)]Word for word I agree with you.[/color]

@ education being "the small stuff"
the problem is.....everything in this country is run for profit....

education and healthcare, morally, cannot be run for profit, because when something is run for-profit, it's all about a bottom line...about the cash.

basically, NCLB is a slick way to keep funding in already well-funded, WHITE, school districts/schools...and have a nice excuse to use when telling under-funded, struggling, BLACK, school districts/ schools, "sorry, we told you 75 percent of the student body has to pass this test for you to get funding....sorry"

look at this, the government has been GIVING TAX MONEY FOR THE FUNDING OF YOUR LOCAL SCHOOL DISTRICT out...in grants...to pay for your child to go to PRIVATE SCHOOLS

lol, the government is basically paying, not for children to go to state schools, no, they're funding private schools now...

ALL YOUNG PEOPLE SHOULD PREPARE TO PAY HUGE CHUNKS OF THEIR CHECKS?

okay, buddy...

unlike the social security they've taken from all of us since we started working and we'll never see, or all the other state and local taxes....

you got raped for this 8 year war we're currently in....i don't see you crying about all the taxes you've paid the past 8 years for taxbreaks and bombs, though...

i have no problem paying more taxes if it means i can receive medical attention when i am sick/injured...

right now, i, along with about 30 million other americans, cannot do so...

 

[burns1923]

Originally Posted by CallHimAR

Originally Posted by Burns1923

Originally Posted by CallHimAR

I quit.

Reading the comments on that page and here lead me to believe that there are a great deal of Americans who are extremely misinformed and confused.

The fear mongering is simply too strong here.

  That's just the thing.  Americans are more informed about the health care bill than Congress itself.

And they DON'T WANT IT.  What part of 55% against it on principle and 73% want a complete re-do don't you understand?

If the bill was so great, the majority of Americans would be embracing it.  Instead, they can't wait for the midterms. 

Wait, didn't Obama get a majority of the pop vote (53%) yet the majority is against his health care bill (55%/73%)?

Guess that makes the majority of Americans "fear mongers". 

Clearly they DON'T understand what they're rallying against when polls in the past indicated that they were actual for a great deal of the reforms in the bill, but when the bill itself was brought up they were against it. I wonder why?

Oh, fear mongering by major "news" networks to make it seem like this is going to destroy America. Who owns said network? A billionaire who most likely knows those who run the health care industry as well.

The majority of people are EXTREMELY misinformed. Let me emphasize, EXTREMELY. It shows because most of what is being said on the internet, at the "tea parties" and at the protests is complete bull !+%! that is spread by fear like "Obama isn't American" and so on and so forth. When THAT is a persons argument, their opinion is null and void, and that is one of the idiotic arguments people sure. I'm seriously wondering now if this DOES have something to do with this mans race, and if it does, I'm completely disgusted.

People don't want it. They don't agree with it.  If you want to paint everyone "misinformed" because they don't share the vantage point you do, enjoy living in your bubble.

And if you're referrring to Fox News, as if they're "brainwashing" the majority.... well, the "majority" elected Obama.  Reconcile that.

People of all political persuasions are against this. 

Your reaction - even though you "won" with this healthcare bill - would make Alinsky proud.  Shoot, Obama proud.

Remember when Hilary Clinton said dissent was "patriotic"?  Guess that doesn't apply to issues you and others champion.

Obama's politics and the tactics of the Democrat Congress is what "disgusts" me.
  

 

[mez 0ne]

Thank the lord this is heading in the right direction.

 

[cparkfresh]

^
Dude people are split over it. The majority of people have no idea what the bill is about. The problem with the American public is instead of taking the time to inform themselves they rely on sensationalized stories spun up to play to their emotion rather than logic. You are coming of as a poster child for this.

 

[38816]

lol @ the tactics

what?

"you got a better idea? shoot...."

"um, you're trying to trap us, president terrorist, sir"

moving on.....

ROFL @ HOW UPSET YOU ARE

 

[airjapan707]

A lot of good arguments both ways in here. But I know more than a few people personally and am pretty sure there are probably millions more who complain about the cost of health care yet they have the newest cell phones with expensive carriers cable tv a huge monthly car payment buying kicks and other goods that aren't needed etc. these are luxuries not necessities. The average american won't sacrifice the luxuries for an insurance plan so they feel the government owes them one.

 

[burns1923]

Originally Posted by CParkFresh

Originally Posted by Burns1923

That's just the thing.  Americans are more informed about the health care bill than Congress itself.

And they DON'T WANT IT.  What part of 55% against it on principle and 73% want a complete re-do don't you understand?

If the bill was so great, the majority of Americans would be embracing it.  Instead, they can't wait for the midterms. 

Wait, didn't Obama get a majority of the pop vote (53%) yet the majority is against his health care bill (55%/73%)?

Guess that makes the majority of Americans "fear mongers". 

The problem is Americans are not informed about the healthcare bill. And those that think they are have only formed opinions based on whatever spin is being fed to them on both the right and left.

Kaiser Health Tracking Poll — March 2010

The March Kaiser Health Tracking Poll finds the public still divided on health reform legislation, with 46 percent of Americans backing the reform proposals on Capitol Hill, 42 percent opposing them and 12 percent saying they aren't sure. Six in 10 Americans say they have heard little or nothing about budget reconciliation. And many people continue to struggle with health costs, with nearly one in five saying cost increases have caused them or their employer to switch to a less comprehensive health plan.

The poll finds that Americans are also divided about what should happen next. Forty-two percent say “Congress has debated health care reform long enough and it is time for them to take a vote.

 

[cparkfresh]

Originally Posted by Burns1923

CParkFresh wrote:

---

Burns1923 wrote:

---

Medicare and Medicaid should both be repealed.  ...needs to be repealed on principle.

So you are against providing healthcare to seniors... Okay man... You win... LOL


On taxpayer money?  Damn right I'm against taxpayer-funded health care.

Stop with the compassion crap.  It's not gonna justify government mandated health care.

"Moral rationalization is indispensable at all times of action whether to justify the selection or the use of ends or means." - Saul Alinsky

"You do what you can with what you have and clothe it with moral arguments." - Saul Alinsky

  


Burns1923

One last question. How did you feel about the $800 Billion Medicare Prescription Drug, Improvement, and Modernization Act [EXPANSION OF MEDICARE] that was passed by a Republican President and Congress? Which by the way did not go funded and only added to the deficit.

http://www.cms.hhs.gov/mmaupdate/

On December 8, 2003, President Bush signed into law the Medicare Prescription Drug Improvement and Modernization Act of 2003 (Pub. L. 108-173). This landmark legislation provides seniors and individuals with disabilities with a prescription drug benefit, more choices, and better benefits under Medicare.

The Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services (CMS) has created this update to provide the public and other interested parties with up-to-date information on CMS' efforts to implement the new legislation. This update will be published monthly. It will contain information on what CMS accomplished in the past month as well as major activities scheduled for the coming month, such as key implementation dates and regulations being published.

Mark B. McClellan, M.D., Ph.D., Administrator

"With the Medicare Act of 2003, our government is finally bringing prescription drug coverage to the seniors of America. With this law, we're giving older Americans better choices and more control over their health care, so they can receive the modern medical care they deserve...Our nation has the best health care system in the world. And we want our seniors to share in the benefits of that system. Our nation has made a promise, a solemn promise to America's seniors. We have pledged to help our citizens find affordable medical care in the later years of life. Lyndon Johnson established that commitment by signing the Medicare Act of 1965. And today, by reforming and modernizing this vital program, we are honoring the commitments of Medicare to all our seniors."

President George W. Bush, White House Press Release, 12/08/2003


Here in lies the problem with the arguments of many of the ultra conservatives and tea part activists use against Obama. They conveniently IGNORE the previous 8 years of government expansion while at the same time being irrational about the politics of today.

 

[gil23]

AMERICA will never agree on anything.

 

[burns1923]

Originally Posted by eNPHAN

lol @ the tactics

what?

"you got a better idea? shoot...."

"um, you're trying to trap us, president terrorist, sir"

moving on.....

ROFL @ HOW UPSET YOU ARE

Who's upset?   I'm just making points.

Sorry to disrupt your honeymoon with Obama. 

Having a radical as a president is tough to process.  That is, unless you took the time to examine the man's personal history, then it's not much of a surprise.

Hey, you guys "won" with the healthcare bill.  Enjoy it.  Don't get all angst ridden.

 

[38816]

Originally Posted by AirJapan707

A lot of good arguments both ways in here. But I know more than a few people personally and am pretty sure there are probably millions more who complain about the cost of health care yet they have the newest cell phones with expensive carriers cable tv a huge monthly car payment buying kicks and other goods that aren't needed etc. these are luxuries not necessities. The average american won't sacrifice the luxuries for an insurance plan so they feel the government owes them one.

hmmm.....
200 a month for healthcare

when i was insured, i made use of it ONE TIME

TO BUY GLASSES

"pay me 200 a month IN CASE you get sick....oh, and once you get sick, we only help you out with part of that..."

sounds necessary to me...

what a lot of you kids don't understand is this staggering statistic.

of all the americans who filed for bankruptcy in the past 5 years, over half did so due to medical bills....

people are literally losing their houses to pay for medical care...

that !@%# is ridiculous...

why are a handful of people becoming INSANELY rich off of healthcare?

so, the insurance company that raised rates in cali are under a bigger corp, wellpoint, who have enjoyed profits in the 200 billion range this past year....yet, they're raising rates....to levels people can't even afford...just to drop them off of their coverage....

but yeah, you right, this is about the average american working for their needs, and not splurging on ipods and sneakers

i honestly relish in white america's paranoia....

 

[thunderchunk69]

After spending trillions on:
An 8 year war most Americans were against
Bailing out banks

People are genuinely upset about people getting healthcare with their money

 

[burns1923]

One last question. How did you feel about the $800 Billion Medicare Prescription Drug, Improvement, and Modernization Act that was passed by a Republican President and Congress? Which by the way did not go funded and only added to the deficit.

I felt like it sucked.  I felt like it was tweaking something that was already an albatross.

  
Here in lies the problem with the arguments of many of the ultra conservatives and tea part activists use against Obama. They conveniently IGNORE the previous 8 years of government expansion while at the same time being irrational about the politics of today.

I don't ignore anything.  George W. Bush and the Congress  (Democrat since 2006) did NOT practice fiscal conservatism.  Their spending hurt the country, no doubt.  They were wrong and Obama is wrong now.

 

[k2theablam]

Originally Posted by spsfinest212

Originally Posted by yungchris504

http://www.facebook.com/g...?v=wall&gid=335426408861

Check this group out.

There is so much butthurt on that page it's hilarious.

A whole lotta talk about god and prayers in that group.

Sickening

 

[38816]

Originally Posted by Burns1923

Originally Posted by eNPHAN

lol @ the tactics

what?

"you got a better idea? shoot...."

"um, you're trying to trap us, president terrorist, sir"

moving on.....

ROFL @ HOW UPSET YOU ARE

Who's upset?   I'm just making points.

Sorry to disrupt your honeymoon with Obama. 

Having a radical as a president is tough to process.  That is, unless you took the time to examine the man's personal history, then it's not much of a surprise.

Hey, you guys "won" with the healthcare bill.  Enjoy it.  Don't get all angst ridden.

 

[k2theablam]

Originally Posted by eNPHAN

yawn, im not gonna bother reading this post

but i will say

hooray.

too many americans can't go to the hospital because they have no health insurance...

me included.

i got sick for an entire week, and HOPED it wasn't swine flu....

i've worked full-time since i graduated college with a 4 year degree...

cannot afford 200 dollars a month for insurance.

am i in north korea?

i overheard an instructional aide "is this rate for insurance per month or per check? if it's per check, i don't even make this much per check"

"well ask for more hours..."

a.) healthcare shouldn't be run for-profit

b.) healthcare costs are extremely inflated...how can we remedy that? stop running the healthcare system for-profit...

c.) look at everyone salty over being taxed for HEALTHCARE, something you're being raped for ANYWAY....where was all this outrage when we were being taxed for TAX BREAKS FOR THE WEALTHY AND BOMBS FOR WAR? i didn't see white dudes taking to the streets with pistols when haliburton was getting multi-billion dollar deals...

i'd much rather get taxed for healthcare than bombs....

Cosign on everything here. Good post enphan

To Add:

I want to emphasize how much I agree with your statement about health care being ran for profit. It seems that Health care can ONLY profit from screwing over its consumers, no better than your average credit card company. Disgusting how grossly backwards this system is/was.

 

[smoke ya later]

Originally Posted by K2theAblaM

Originally Posted by spsfinest212

Originally Posted by yungchris504

http://www.facebook.com/g...?v=wall&gid=335426408861

Check this group out.

There is so much butthurt on that page it's hilarious.

A whole lotta talk about god and prayers in that group.

Sickening

from my fb:

so and so:

[h3]is getting ready to watch Fox New with Glenn Beck (who is a big Christian) If you dont understand the healthcare bill, watch Glenn he will give you a better understanding. Also, he speaks the truth of what is "really" happening on Capital grounds!!!![/h3]

 

[38816]

CParkFresh wrote:

Here in lies the problem with the arguments of many of the ultra conservatives and tea part activists use against Obama. They conveniently IGNORE the previous 8 years of government expansion while at the same time being irrational about the politics of today.

word.
taxbreaks and billions upon billions to hailburton.....AMERICA, +%%# YEAH

healthcare? GTFOHWTBS!

you mean we'll be spending the money on something worthwhile like our national health?

BURN HIM AT THE STAKE