Kanye West: King of the Sunken Place, "Watch the Throne"

The Wage Gap for Black Workers Is Growing
By
Jeanna Smialek
and
Jordyn Holman
September 5, 2017, 1:00 PM EDT
  • U.S. black men earn 70 cents on a white man’s dollar
  • While part of gap owes to education, a growing portion doesn’t
Black workers earn less than their white counterparts in a worsening trend that holds even after accounting for differences in age, education, job type and geography, new Federal Reserve research shows.



In 1979, the average black man in America earned 80 percent as much per hour as the average white man. By 2016, that shortfall had worsened to 70 percent, according to research Tuesday from the San Francisco Fed, which found the divide had also widened for black women.



“Especially troubling is the growing unexplained portion of the divergence in earnings for blacks relative to whites,” San Francisco Fed Research Director Mary Daly and her fellow authors wrote in the report, adding that this could owe to hard-to-measure factors including discrimination or school-quality differences.



740x-1.png

“The opportunity to succeed is at the foundation of our dynamic economy. In this context, large and persistent shortfalls for African-Americans, or any other group, are troubling,” they wrote.



The San Francisco Fed’s study marks a growing focus by the U.S. central bank on inequality and the lagging employment performance of U.S. minorities. Chair Janet Yellen has talked about the subject and the Philadelphia and Minneapolis Feds have set up institutes to study inequality and social mobility. The increased attention stands in contrast to the past, when the topic was rarely investigated by Fed research staff or broached by officials, who viewed the problem as outside their remit for monetary policy.

The new research, which highlights the persistence of a racial wage gap 50 years after the passage of the U.S.’s landmark anti-discrimination Civil Rights Act, points to a problem for politicians and policy makers: It’s tough to address disparities if it’s impossible to measure what’s driving them.

The fact that the gap has lingered and even worsened over time also means that a stronger labor market, which politicians often cite as a remedy for black workers’ economic disadvantage, probably won’t permanently narrow the divide.

“A job is the first condition, but it’s really not a sufficient condition to fix disparities,” Daly said.

Black workers have consistently higher unemployment than their white counterparts, but that divide is highly cyclical: In strong labor markets, it shrinks, but then it skyrockets again during recessions. Black wage gaps change less across business cycles.

Income Ladder
The fact that black workers earn less is a problem in part because it limits their chances at moving up the income ladder. Lower wages can make it harder to afford time off for education and training, for instance.

And it’s particularly worrying that the black-white gap is climbing on the back on unexplainable factors. While a sizable portion of the racial wage divide arises from the different industries and occupations black people work in, their education levels, and their ages, the share owing to factors that aren’t traceable accounts for much of the growth in the wage gap over time.

In 1979, about 8 percentage points of the earnings gap for men was hard to explain, and by 2016, that had risen to 13 percentage points -- just under half of the total earnings gap.

“This implies that factors that are harder to measure -- such as discrimination, differences in school quality, or differences in career opportunities -- are likely to be playing a role in the persistence and widening of these gaps over time,” the authors write.


https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-04-24/federal-job-guarantee-program-might-be-a-big-help
 
That was an example. It doesn’t have to be construction. You can’t take a general census like all white men make this much and all black men make this much and use it to prove racism or sexism. It’s just dumb. But then again you wouldn’t understand that huh genius.
You want a proven fact proven again to you for the sake of...... maybe they won’t so you get some type of small personal victory?
 
And present me with a real study and I will look at it. Show me that all of the black men that work construction make less then all the white men that work construction for the same company. You can’t! You know why? Because it’s illegal!

You know this can easily be concealed via hiring and promotion bias, right? Why in the hell do you think the EEO Act came about? There are loopholes in everything. Right in front of your face. But for some reason you can't see the forest.
 
You are one of thee most ignorant people I have encountered on here. Saying that I’m racist means that I look down on black people or see them as inferior to me. Like I said, my Dad is black, also stated my Wife is black. I have 3 boys by her and so guess what, my kids are black. There is no loophole. Just you trying to make this dum *** title you put on me sticks. It’s not going to work. I won’t raid my children like how you were raised. I won’t tell them “Oh you didn’t get that job because of racism”, although it might be the case sometime. I will them “Someone was better qualified than you. It’s OK opportunities come and go”. I will tell them “You can be anything you want in this world. You just have to work harder than everyone else to get it.”
Sorry if I think black people need to hold themselves accountable for somethings. I think they can do better. And since I’m the only one focused on solutions that aren’t based on someone else doing something for them, let’s hear them.

I completely agree with this sentiment. I'm not mixed, both of my parents are black. I've seen the hood and I've seen generational wealth. I also come from a legacy of attending hbcu's.
This ideology is actually taught at Howard. We should never forget but we must overcome without excuses. We can educate our future without hate in our hearts.

I mentioned this "us vs. them" narrative earlier in the thread and it's becoming more prevalent as the thread turns to race issues. There are other race communities besides the black community that are systemically oppressed also. It's not just about black men in prison, police killings and welfare abuse. Let's look at the success of our community and continue to build off that instead of allowing ourselves to be weighed down in a system that wasn't designed for us. Stop trying to change the system and work the system.

Somewhat irrelevant side note: The wage gap is astronomical for Hispanic women.
 
Say what you want. Call me names if you want. I don’t care if all these NTers are “flaming me”. I’ve grown up in the hood around mostly black people. You think they were nice to me all the time? You think they didn’t call me racial slurs? I’ve been called N by some of my own family. I don’t care about this pity party you are all throwing in here. I just don’t want you to poison other people’s mind into thinking there is no point in trying because it’s already to late or the game is set and white people win. Go get a job be a man and do right by your family. That’s a W and that’s all that really matters at the end of the day.
I’m not a house N. I’m not taking anyone’s side and that’s what you’re missing. A house N took the white mans side. I won’t argue that my white skin may or may not have gotten me things. I don’t know and never will. And I’m not interested in reading the victim literature your trying to push on me. Once again someone is trying to put labels on me. I’m not anti-black, I’m not anti-white.

And present me with a real study and I will look at it. Show me that all of the black men that work construction make less then all the white men that work construction for the same company. You can’t! You know why? Because it’s illegal!

And John Legend needs to shut his *** up. Prolly wouldn’t even be where he was today if it wasn’t for Ye.

I don't think I called you names today. Half-breed and Mulatto are actual tradition American Race classifications for people mixed with black and white. You would have actually be documented as that during certain times in this country just as black people would have been classified as Negro.

I'm sure you were called racial slurs growing up and that there is pain from your upbringing. I just invite you to unpack that experience with definitive knowledge of why you feel that way and the understanding that your experience is not uncommon.

Also, the funny thing is that I am pretty sure that the book I referenced goes in on the economical earning differences between black and white people in America within just the first few chapters. The information you are asking about is quite literally hidden in books and online studies. To be specific to the black and white earnings in construction, if you belong to certain unions in certain states they actually do document everyone's earning and compare them by race so that there aren't significant disparities. Also, I think you're confusing black history with victimhood. Just because you prosper in a institution that your traditionally disadvantaged in doesn't make you a victim nor does documenting it or sharing the experience. I know several of the people in this thread including myself are living great, flourishing in this institution making good money and enjoying what life has to offer. We are far from victims and we are trying to get you out of the sunken place fam.
 
You're never going to get through to someone who believes that the existence of a single black person who earns more than their white counterpart is enough to disprove the wage gap

It's the same cherry picking foolishness that we see from the NT right-wing all the time
 
I also think Fearism is more relevant than racism in 2018
I completely agree with this sentiment. I'm not mixed, both of my parents are black. I've seen the hood and I've seen generational wealth. I also come from a legacy of attending hbcu's.
This ideology is actually taught at Howard. We should never forget but we must overcome without excuses. We can educate our future without hate in our hearts.

I mentioned this "us vs. them" narrative earlier in the thread and it's becoming more prevalent as the thread turns to race issues. There are other race communities besides the black community that are systemically oppressed also. It's not just about black men in prison, police killings and welfare abuse. Let's look at the success of our community and continue to build off that instead of allowing ourselves to be weighed down in a system that wasn't designed for us. Stop trying to change the system and work the system.

Somewhat irrelevant side note: The wage gap is astronomical for Hispanic women.

There are other minorities too, so let's drop fighting against white Supremacy and systemic inequality brahs.

Not like people can try to make the best of their situation AND fight against systemic inequality. Those things are not mutually exclusive.

Some of you dudes minds have been full colonized.
 
The Wage Gap for Black Workers Is Growing
By
Jeanna Smialek
and
Jordyn Holman
September 5, 2017, 1:00 PM EDT
  • U.S. black men earn 70 cents on a white man’s dollar
  • While part of gap owes to education, a growing portion doesn’t
Black workers earn less than their white counterparts in a worsening trend that holds even after accounting for differences in age, education, job type and geography, new Federal Reserve research shows.



In 1979, the average black man in America earned 80 percent as much per hour as the average white man. By 2016, that shortfall had worsened to 70 percent, according to research Tuesday from the San Francisco Fed, which found the divide had also widened for black women.



“Especially troubling is the growing unexplained portion of the divergence in earnings for blacks relative to whites,” San Francisco Fed Research Director Mary Daly and her fellow authors wrote in the report, adding that this could owe to hard-to-measure factors including discrimination or school-quality differences.



740x-1.png

“The opportunity to succeed is at the foundation of our dynamic economy. In this context, large and persistent shortfalls for African-Americans, or any other group, are troubling,” they wrote.



The San Francisco Fed’s study marks a growing focus by the U.S. central bank on inequality and the lagging employment performance of U.S. minorities. Chair Janet Yellen has talked about the subject and the Philadelphia and Minneapolis Feds have set up institutes to study inequality and social mobility. The increased attention stands in contrast to the past, when the topic was rarely investigated by Fed research staff or broached by officials, who viewed the problem as outside their remit for monetary policy.

The new research, which highlights the persistence of a racial wage gap 50 years after the passage of the U.S.’s landmark anti-discrimination Civil Rights Act, points to a problem for politicians and policy makers: It’s tough to address disparities if it’s impossible to measure what’s driving them.

The fact that the gap has lingered and even worsened over time also means that a stronger labor market, which politicians often cite as a remedy for black workers’ economic disadvantage, probably won’t permanently narrow the divide.

“A job is the first condition, but it’s really not a sufficient condition to fix disparities,” Daly said.

Black workers have consistently higher unemployment than their white counterparts, but that divide is highly cyclical: In strong labor markets, it shrinks, but then it skyrockets again during recessions. Black wage gaps change less across business cycles.

Income Ladder
The fact that black workers earn less is a problem in part because it limits their chances at moving up the income ladder. Lower wages can make it harder to afford time off for education and training, for instance.

And it’s particularly worrying that the black-white gap is climbing on the back on unexplainable factors. While a sizable portion of the racial wage divide arises from the different industries and occupations black people work in, their education levels, and their ages, the share owing to factors that aren’t traceable accounts for much of the growth in the wage gap over time.

In 1979, about 8 percentage points of the earnings gap for men was hard to explain, and by 2016, that had risen to 13 percentage points -- just under half of the total earnings gap.

“This implies that factors that are harder to measure -- such as discrimination, differences in school quality, or differences in career opportunities -- are likely to be playing a role in the persistence and widening of these gaps over time,” the authors write.


https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-04-24/federal-job-guarantee-program-might-be-a-big-help

"Unexplained" :lol
 
There are other minorities too, so let's drop fighting against white Supremacy and systemic inequality brahs.

Not like people can try to make the best of their situation AND fight against systemic inequality. Those things are not mutually exclusive.

Some of you dudes minds have been full colonized.

You're fighting systemic inequality by becoming the best you, by any means necessary.
 
it's that simple huh?

Explain to me why it isn't. Within my statement are the roadblocks that life presents to us. Some of it racism, some of it not.

On a world built off colonization do you think 200 years of protests will change human nature? If everyone stops asking "it's that simple?" and become the best they can be no matter what it is, our community will be more positive within itself. Instead we are fueled by the hatred and negativity that has been used on us since we were brought here.
 
You're never going to get through to someone who believes that the existence of a single black person who earns more than their white counterpart is enough to disprove the wage gap

It's the same cherry picking foolishness that we see from the NT right-wing all the time
Yeah that argument is so morinic my head hurts reading it. Clearly those dudes don't understand basic statistics

Also I must say this argument about changing behaviors, taking more responsibility, or stop playing victim to counter systemic inequality is also foolish . Social sciencist control for all kinds of factors and behaviors and the racial wealth gap is still there.

I always tell my conservative friends that they have a fundamental understand on how racism manifest itself in our socioeconomic system.

It is all about probabilities. Racism doesn't make things impossible for black people and other minorities it just makes it harder and nearly every step along the way. So sure there will be many successful black folk, but on average there will be less. Not because of lack of effort, but just my of social, economic, and politicial forces weighing the probabilities against you.
 
Explain to me why it isn't. Within my statement are the roadblocks that life presents to us. Some of it racism, some of it not.

On a world built off colonization do you think 200 years of protests will change human nature? If everyone stops asking "it's that simple?" and become the best they can be no matter what it is, our community will be more positive within itself. Instead we are fueled by the hatred and negativity that has been used on us since we were brought here.

in theory that makes sense. in reality only the oppressed are being asked to be their best selves. everyone else is still status quo
 
I don't think I called you names today. Half-breed and Mulatto are actual tradition American Race classifications for people mixed with black and white. You would have actually be documented as that during certain times in this country just as black people would have been classified as Negro.

I'm sure you were called racial slurs growing up and that there is pain from your upbringing. I just invite you to unpack that experience with definitive knowledge of why you feel that way and the understanding that your experience is not uncommon.

Also, the funny thing is that I am pretty sure that the book I referenced goes in on the economical earning differences between black and white people in America within just the first few chapters. The information you are asking about is quite literally hidden in books and online studies. To be specific to the black and white earnings in construction, if you belong to certain unions in certain states they actually do document everyone's earning and compare them by race so that there aren't significant disparities. Also, I think you're confusing black history with victimhood. Just because you prosper in a institution that your traditionally disadvantaged in doesn't make you a victim nor does documenting it or sharing the experience. I know several of the people in this thread including myself are living great, flourishing in this institution making good money and enjoying what life has to offer. We are far from victims and we are trying to get you out of the sunken place fam.

I’m not in the sunken place fam. But since you brought up how well you and some other minorities are doing then let’s talk about that. Now these well off brothas that you speak of, did they go to special schools? Did they find some secret back door that the white Man hasn’t found yet? I’m sure they didn’t. I’m sure these brothas your talking about went to a normal high school, graduated, went to college or found a trade, and then bam! Success. This is all I’m saying. There is no secret white man conspiracy. If you do see something funny call them out in it. Maybe it’s not what you think, maybe it is. Either way. Coming up with excuses like I can’t do anything because the systematic oppression will hold me back is just complete BS.
And I wasn’t saying that you in particular were calling me names. I was just saying that the names and labels don’t bother me. These immature NTers saying I’m dumb doesn’t bother me. Because at the end of they day they will pick themselves up by the “bootstraps” and get their life together or they will be the next generation in the projects talking about the system and the evil white man. Y’all didn’t go through slavery but y’all sound like slaves lol.

Don’t need to give a census. Just tell me that Steve working next to you at your job doing the same work as you is getting paid more than you. You can do that right? All these brothas in here talkin the talk. Gotta be at least one example of it happening right now in real life.
 
Yeah that argument is so morinic my head hurts reading it. Clearly those dudes don't understand basic statistics

Also I must say this argument about changing behaviors, taking more responsibility, or stop playing victim to counter systemic inequality is also foolish . Social sciencist control for all kinds of factors and behaviors and the racial wealth gap is still there.

I always tell my conservative friends that they have a fundamental understand on how racism manifest itself in our socioeconomic system.

It is all about probabilities. Racism doesn't make things impossible for black people and other minorities it just makes it harder and nearly every step along the way. So sure there will be many successful black folk, but on average there will be less. Not because of lack of effort, but just my of social, economic, and politicial forces weighing the probabilities against you.

I dont know whats so hard to understand about this.
 
Listen I am an economist by training and profession.

What you are saying is not only philosophically wrong, but also scientifically asinine.

Ok Mr. Economist. What is your actual suggestion to the African American community for the future. Not asking for data but a suggestion on what the community should be doing to overcome systemic inequality.
 
I’m not in the sunken place fam. But since you brought up how well you and some other minorities are doing then let’s talk about that. Now these well off brothas that you speak of, did they go to special schools? Did they find some secret back door that the white Man hasn’t found yet? I’m sure they didn’t. I’m sure these brothas your talking about went to a normal high school, graduated, went to college or found a trade, and then bam! Success. This is all I’m saying. There is no secret white man conspiracy. If you do see something funny call them out in it. Maybe it’s not what you think, maybe it is. Either way. Coming up with excuses like I can’t do anything because the systematic oppression will hold me back is just complete BS.
And I wasn’t saying that you in particular were calling me names. I was just saying that the names and labels don’t bother me. These immature NTers saying I’m dumb doesn’t bother me. Because at the end of they day they will pick themselves up by the “bootstraps” and get their life together or they will be the next generation in the projects talking about the system and the evil white man. Y’all didn’t go through slavery but y’all sound like slaves lol.

Don’t need to give a census. Just tell me that Steve working next to you at your job doing the same work as you is getting paid more than you. You can do that right? All these brothas in here talkin the talk. Gotta be at least one example of it happening right now in real life.

Oh really now.

I guess this was just a figment of my imagination. Probably just some very fine people.

article-charlottesville-4-0811.jpg
 
Explain to me why it isn't. Within my statement are the roadblocks that life presents to us. Some of it racism, some of it not.

On a world built off colonization do you think 200 years of protests will change human nature? If everyone stops asking "it's that simple?" and become the best they can be no matter what it is, our community will be more positive within itself. Instead we are fueled by the hatred and negativity that has been used on us since we were brought here.

You dont fully comprehend the roadblocks that are in place and how hard it is to overcome them. All that sounds good, but racism and life dont work like that. You dont just will your way through life.

It's weird to me how people can fully grasp how hard it is to get out of debt but not understand how hard it is to escape poverty and the roadblocks that come with it. Baffling.
 
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