When You Talk To God, Is The Response From Him or Is It From You Talking To Yourself

[knightlovesqueen]

Although I dont like absolutes, word to jedis.

I'll give it a chance and try and learn something new.

No

Yes

 

[knightlovesqueen]

if it matters the second question is the most difficult to cement an answer to

 

[thunderchunk69]

lmao, I don't think God is supposed to talk to anyone directly or indirectly.

I think that's an insanely selfish idea.

What's the point of living your life if you're just taking direction?
Doesn't mean God doesn't exist, just means free will is ... just that.

I believe God might be the math, science, nature, order, disarray around us.

that's about it, not something to talk to.

this is an interesting perspective.

In addition to what you stated. I personally think that some people overrate their experiences, some people are even misinformed in the confines of their own religion, some people assume that their lives are a little 'too important'! As a result you get christians or otherwise thanking god for frivolous and trivial concerns ('thank God I found that stripper last night'), and blaming god for their own mistakes ('God made me broke because he made me make it rain at the strip club last night'). This distracts from more fundamental issues dealing with their own personal faith.

I think that still comes from a self absorbed perspective where God is worrying about you.
if God is all knowing and powerful, he's either controlling you 100% of the time or 0%, not at your command.

 

[futuremd]

Although I dont like absolutes, word to jedis.

I'll give it a chance and try and learn something new.

No

Yes

You're an agnostic-theist.

You don't know if a god exists, but you believe that there is one.

I'm an agnostic-atheist.

I don't know if a god exists, but I do not believe claims that have been asserted that one does exist.

Enjoy these:

 

[RIP sleazyy]

As for the topic at hand, I can speak on how I felt when I was a believer. When I prayed, I often prayed for things I wanted to happen. Goals, aspirations, protection. Like most, I prayed to do well on school. I would pray with my sports teams and give thanks for victories. I prayed for things that were out of my control. After 9/11, I prayed that my parents would be kept safe on their travels. When I was much younger, I was afraid of turbulence on flights and would pray HARD to get to my destination in one piece .

Being older now, I see that praying was a coping mechanism. It helped me "feel" better about things I couldn't control. It was false assurance. It was a placebo. Now that I'm a nonbeliever, what do I do differently? I still have the same fears and misgivings but I just... accept them. I don't think anyone or anything has some power to affect change. Some might say "things happen for a reason" and I'd agree that they do. I don't know what those reasons are and I damn sure don't think a god is the cause.

thank you for opening up about that experience.


did you have a specific "turning point"?

I won't lie...while I never really believed, for a long time I was afraid of saying something like "screw god" because I didn't want anything to happen. Like in the back of your head you're afraid that lightning will strike you or something. I also didn't want anyone to hear me then have something happen and have them blame it on what I said or make that coincidence as being related. I really needed an isolated trial to really test this out. 

I was at the stop light once and I was thinking about this stuff and I was just like "**** god"...waited...nothing happened...then I said it again... and it was this period of SUPER relief.

It was like mentally I held myself back from doing even what I knew wouldn't matter. 

I've had so many moments, in my head and out loud, that I've said something like "give me a sign" or "show me you care" and got nothing. NOTHING. 2 close friends died, great grandma died, family going through all types of ****. depression, suicidal thoughts and actions. while they're sitting praying talking about "God will show you, he has a plan".

and now I get "why would you be atheist? don't you know God loves you"? that _ should show up for once when people need him.

 

[knightlovesqueen]

what if i go back and forth in my belief?

 

[knightlovesqueen]

I've had so many moments, in my head and out loud, that I've said something like "give me a sign" or "show me you care" and got nothing. NOTHING. 2 close friends died, great grandma died, family going through all types of ****. depression, suicidal thoughts and actions. while they're sitting praying talking about "God will show you, he has a plan".
and now I get "why would you be atheist? don't you know God loves you"? that _ should show up for once when people need him.

I'm sorry to hear about your past. And I am happy you were able to persevere through them

and I still have your gift from a few months back lol.

i will send them out to you before this year ends

 

[carver]

Can someone make TAR thread about religion?

Pls 

 

[sumrndmdude]

I think that still comes from a self absorbed perspective where God is worrying about you.
if God is all knowing and powerful, he's either controlling you 100% of the time or 0%, not at your command.

And I would define it as such, sometimes people get a little self absorbed and I am guilty of that at times.

People underestimate the concept of free will, I believe. But to your point some people have the attitude of 'Jesus take the wheel' and this philosophy does not necessarily agree with Jesus teachings themselves. Perhaps if they/we said "the god I believe in has given the road map" that would be a lot more reasonable and simpler to grasp.

 

[knightlovesqueen]

let us demonstrate first civility in these specific topics before we open up such a large thread

 

[futuremd]

lmao, I don't think God is supposed to talk to anyone directly or indirectly.
I think that's an insanely selfish idea.
What's the point of living your life if you're just taking direction?
Doesn't mean God doesn't exist, just means free will is ... just that.
I believe God might be the math, science, nature, order, disarray around us.
that's about it, not something to talk to.

this is an interesting perspective.

In addition to what you stated. I personally think that some people overrate their experiences, some people are even misinformed in the confines of their own religion, some people assume that their lives are a little 'too important'! As a result you get christians or otherwise thanking god for frivolous and trivial concerns ('thank God I found that stripper last night'), and blaming god for their own mistakes ('God made me broke because he made me make it rain at the strip club last night'). This distracts from more fundamental issues dealing with their own personal faith.

This phrase never makes sense to me. It just serves to reinforce the notion that "faith" is anything more than the excuse people have for adopting something with little reason to do so. 

 

[thorrocksjs]

What does this mean?

It sounds like this:


View media item 118170

Son atleast make a real response all you do is either snatch pics from reddit or some other site. Dont click reply if your just gona post a pic as an actual response in a legit discussion .

 

[knightlovesqueen]

And I would define it as such, sometimes people get a little self absorbed and I am guilty of that at times.

People underestimate the concept of free will, I believe. But to your point some people have the attitude of 'Jesus take the wheel' and this philosophy does not necessarily agree with Jesus teachings themselves. Perhaps if they/we said "the god I believe in has given the road map" that would be a lot more reasonable and simpler to grasp.

unfortunately, I think it's the english language itself that poses the egocentric loop.

english speakers don't have the complexity as other languages.

but lets not turn this into linguistics class lol.

i see where u and chunk r coming from

 

[futuremd]

what if i go back and forth in my belief?

You're still agnostic, because you DO NOT KNOW, but you are vacillating between theism and atheism.

People like to conflate the two terms, but they are mutually exclusive. Gnosticism has nothing to do with theism.

 

[futuremd]

What does this mean?

It sounds like this:

Son atleast make a real response all you do is either snatch pics from reddit or some other site. Dont click reply if your just gona post a pic as an actual response in a legit discussion .

I just posted why I don't understand your statement.

It seems more like a poetic reification than anything of substance. Its like sophistry without an end or conclusion brought to bare. 

 

[futuremd]

I think that still comes from a self absorbed perspective where God is worrying about you.
if God is all knowing and powerful, he's either controlling you 100% of the time or 0%, not at your command.

And I would define it as such, sometimes people get a little self absorbed and I am guilty of that at times.

People underestimate the concept of free will, I believe. But to your point some people have the attitude of 'Jesus take the wheel' and this philosophy does not necessarily agree with Jesus teachings themselves. Perhaps if they/we said "the god I believe in has given the road map" that would be a lot more reasonable and simpler to grasp.

No...it wouldn't.

Whats the point of needing god if god created said road map? 

That implies that you have a decision to veer from the path that god made FOR YOU. 

 

[knightlovesqueen]

You're still agnostic, because you DO NOT KNOW, but you are vacillating between theism and atheism.

People like to conflate the two terms, but they are mutually exclusive. Gnosticism has nothing to do with theism.

and you know what i apologize for my past dismals of you.

today i took the time and listened openly

because of that i realized a mistake i had been making for so long, placing gnosticism in the spectrum of theism

 

[sumrndmdude]

This phrase never makes sense to me. It just serves to reinforce the notion that "faith" is anything more than the excuse people have for adopting something with little reason to do so. 

if you say: "my faith in god tells me that I will find a goldmine in alaska, and I will as a result be a billionaire"

I have issues with your faith, therefore This distracts from more fundamental issues dealing with their own personal faith

 

[futuremd]

You're still agnostic, because you DO NOT KNOW, but you are vacillating between theism and atheism.

People like to conflate the two terms, but they are mutually exclusive. Gnosticism has nothing to do with theism.

and you know what i apologize for my past dismals of you.

today i took the time and listened openly

because of that i realized a mistake i had been making for so long, placing gnosticism in the spectrum of theism

 

[futuremd]

This phrase never makes sense to me. It just serves to reinforce the notion that "faith" is anything more than the excuse people have for adopting something with little reason to do so. 

if you say: "my faith in god tells me that I will find a goldmine in alaska, and I will as a result be a billionaire"

I have issues with your faith, therefore This distracts from more fundamental issues dealing with their own personal faith

How is that a fundamental issue with their faith?

Is that not what faith is? Belief in something you assert or want to be true or real? 

Thats the problem here. We can't just keep looking at what people believe and taking them for that. Thats why the burden of proof is important. You can believe what you want, but you can't keep asserting things without actually substantiating them.

Otherwise, your claims about their being flaws in their faith are null and void. 

 

[RIP sleazyy]

I've had so many moments, in my head and out loud, that I've said something like "give me a sign" or "show me you care" and got nothing. NOTHING. 2 close friends died, great grandma died, family going through all types of ****. depression, suicidal thoughts and actions. while they're sitting praying talking about "God will show you, he has a plan".
and now I get "why would you be atheist? don't you know God loves you"? that _ should show up for once when people need him.

I'm sorry to hear about your past. And I am happy you were able to persevere through them

and I still have your gift from a few months back lol.

i will send them out to you before this year ends

thanks man. I still think you're an undercover Nigerian scammer though

 

[sumrndmdude]

No...it wouldn't.

Whats the point of needing god if god created said road map? 

That implies that you have a decision to veer from the path that god made FOR YOU. 

What is the point of speaking with and seeking the counsel of your parents when you start your own family, assuming they have taught you all you know, and you have learnt more afterwards.

I say map  not  to say that God has created a destiny for you. Map as in god has given you information to navigate life, you can choose to consult that map as you wish.

 

[sumrndmdude]

How is that a fundamental issue with their faith?

Is that not what faith is? Belief in something you assert or want to be true or real? 

Thats the problem here. We can't just keep looking at what people believe and taking them for that. Thats why the burden of proof is important. You can believe what you want, but you can't keep asserting things without actually substantiating them.

Otherwise, your claims about their being flaws in their faith are null and void. 

[h2]Definition of FAITH[/h2]
1

a  :  allegiance to duty or a person :  loyaltyb (1)  :  fidelity  to one's promises (2)  :  sincerity of intentions

2

a (1)  :  belief and trust in and loyalty to God (2)  :  belief in the traditional doctrines  of a religionb (1)  :  firm belief in something for which there is no proof (2):  complete trust

3

:  something that is believed especially with strong conviction;especially  :  a system of religious beliefs <the Protestantfaith>

I was going with definition 2(a). Feel free to include 2(b) I know that you are eager to do so!

 

[futuremd]

No...it wouldn't.

Whats the point of needing god if god created said road map? 

That implies that you have a decision to veer from the path that god made FOR YOU. 

What is the point of speaking with and seeking the counsel of your parents when you start your own family, assuming they have taught you all you know, and you have learnt more afterwards.

Because they're my family? They exist? They don't claim to have ultimate power, knowledge, and/or presence. 

I say map  not   to say that God has created a destiny for you. Map as in god has given you information to navigate life, you can choose to consult that map as you wish.

If god is merely a passive bystander then whats the point of recognizing it then? And why give you any information to start with in the first place? Why not all of it? At what point is there too little information or too much information to start with? 

 

[futuremd]

How is that a fundamental issue with their faith?

Is that not what faith is? Belief in something you assert or want to be true or real? 

Thats the problem here. We can't just keep looking at what people believe and taking them for that. Thats why the burden of proof is important. You can believe what you want, but you can't keep asserting things without actually substantiating them.

Otherwise, your claims about their being flaws in their faith are null and void. 

[h2]Definition of FAITH[/h2]
1

a  :  allegiance to duty or a person :  loyaltyb (1)  :  fidelity  to one's promises (2)  :  sincerity of intentions

2

a (1)  : belief and trust in and loyalty to God (2)  : belief in the traditional doctrines  of a religionb (1)  :  firm belief in something for which there is no proof (2):  complete trust

3

:  something that is believed especially with strong conviction;especially  :  a system of religious beliefs <the Protestantfaith>

I was going with definition 2(a). Feel free to include 2(b) I know that you are eager to do so!

That strengthens my point.

How can you find fault in the faith of others when its THEIR faith? 

Are you the ultimate arbiter of what THEIR trust in the god they assume to exist, should be? 

BTW, you can't keep relying on the dictionary and selective definitions to substantiate your claims. It smacks of inauthenticity.